That parenting has changed

[Brieminewine]

I find I think about this so much more now that I’ve had a baby.

I’m a 90s kid, in my mind had a great childhood, lots of trips away, fun family time etc not much money but lots of love but when I got into my teens it’s changed. When I was about 14 my dad withdrew, I remember walking down a beach abroad and something being said like oh well it’s guna be one of the last chances to do something like this. It was more a bantery relationship after that and I feel as I got older they turned a blind eye to a lot I was up to (staying out all night, partying etc from 15/16) and now I think was it the time or was it the people?! Looking back I 100% wanted full control of my life, I had amazing friends and social life but was I too young to know what was best for me?

I’d say I’m close to my mum now but not in the share everything type of closeness that I’d want for my DD. I’ve turned out well good job etc and they always encouraged me so much with school work and careers etc but boys and general life zilch!ive never discussed any of this with anyone.

So I suppose my AIBU is, has parenting changed with the times or did I have a shit time and sugar coated lovely shared experiences but ultimately they let me down?!

Not all childhoods are the same, and I think some have a very sheltered of different experience will not understand what you are trying to convey op, at all, or understand the dangers that young girls are exposed to. The combination of hands off parenting and teenage bullet proof confidence is extremely dangerous, and can lead to life changing situations for the child. You are right to shudder and reject that form of parenting yourself.

I don't happen to subscribe to eac generation thinking the one before was this or that, I am into progressive parenting meaning that every generation works hard to improve the chances/opportunities of the new generation - and that includes looking after them more carefully.
It is not about being judge and jury of past parenting, but more acknowledging the mistakes that were made, and working out how it can be improved.

What I would say op is that you may be hitting a nerve, because I believe the parenting you describe is still going on today and many do check out way too early under the guise of allowing independence to flourish. It will be dressed up as allowing kids to be kids, teens need space and all the rest. Actually teens need boundaries, protection and someone that has their back 247 far more than they need to roam, and I am thinking about county lines/drugs etc.

BTW I wasn't aiming the paragraph about each generation moaning about the one before at you op. It was really responding to pp.

I think it's an individual thing.

I was a teen in the 60s and still very close to my lovely warm dad. Some of my happiest memories are coming home from uni on the train and seeing him on the platform literally jumping up and down with excitement! Yes, embarrassing- but I felt so loved!

At the same time, neither he nor my mum were smothering: they had a great respect for privacy and individual autonomy. They expected a high level of behaviour and they generally got it.

I don't think my parenting has been substantially different, though I was probably a bit harder to shock when it came to revelations about teen partying and sexual experimenting. My parents were teetotallers and though liberal in their views preferred not to talk about bodily functions. Dh's parents otoh were party types, who would happily get sloshed with elderly neighbours and teen children.

Two warm, friendly households with some quite major cultural differences.

And yes, there was a sense of stepping back for both dh and me when we reached our later teens, but only stepping back in terms of control, not in terms of support if we needed it. Both sets of parents still enjoyed our company and liked having us around, but from age 15 or so treated us more like adults, trusted us and listened to our views.

Again, I don't think I've been very different with mine. Dd's MH problems, as a teen and as an adult, have meant she has needed a level of support from me which I had never envisaged, but that doesn't mean I try to control her; just that I will answer the phone if she has a bad episode at 2 in the morning and needs to talk. My mother would have done that too.

I think it was normal for the time.

My parents were strict when I was a child. But from 14 onwards tended to let me do my own thing. Bearing in mind they would have left school at 15.

I agree, it sounds like I had a really similar childhood to you (very happy) and in my teens I was able to do what I wanted.

There was no guidance regarding doing my school work or stoppping me from going to the local nightclub and walking home at 16.

I also turned out alright..!

When I reflect on this difference in parenting, I think about how my parents were parented.

Growing up in the 1950's they really were left to get on with it and so their style to me, was revolutionary in terms of the care and attention and opportunities (ballet, choir, drama) they gave me, but also had glimmers of the way they were brought up.

My parenting of my children is much more 'hands on and boundaried' than what I had but it includes what I hope is the best of what they gave to me.

It is like everything it evolves over time.

My experience was very different and I'd say amongst my friends the majority had parents who were still involved when they were teens and would have very much cared if they'd been out all night etc.

I am a nineties teenager and was the rebel one. The one thing I did notice was that most of my friends parents-not all, just stoped parenting after about the age of fourteen, everyone was clothed and feed and school work was monitored but that was it. My parents still continued to parent and were horrified at what my friends were allowed to do. The one thing that has changed is that teenagers don’t seem to have a private life, they of course have it on their phones but they lack independence as they are given lifts everywhere, the parents can, and do track their location via phone, they are able to talk about their feelings with their parents etc whereas we were just expected to get on with difficult things ourselves, it would not have occurred to me to talk about a difficult friend or if I got myself into a bad situation to ring my parents to come get me, in that respect things are better, but also maybe children and teenagers should be navigating their own lives a bit more.

The expectations are a lot higher for teenagers now. Grade 9s and A*’s and good universities with career focused degrees because you’re paying through the nose for them.

My 80s/90s life was chill in comparison (although my parents were quite authoritarian).

Times have become more demanding and competitive and we gave to support our young people much more now because society demands so much of them.

Teens and young people are definitely taking more time 'to grow up' than the ones before, and it is no bad things considering we are not fully matured in terms of our development until the age of twenty five. Giving teens space and time to become themselves, to nourish their independence, identity and resilience is not the same as allowing young teens to be out all night with no clue as to where they are, or who they are with.
Teens today can develop slowly, and with care so that they are not 'running before they can walk' and not constantly feeling out of the depth in risky situations. Taking time to grow up properly, with the safety net of a family that cares about you, and is there for you, is not the same as an 90s experience with very little contact with parents or adults in general and running wild!

I agree zoe the global marketplace and competition for jobs is a driving force behind the pressure on our kids, the pressure can be enormous and they fully need the extra support in my experience.

That sounds like a normal childhood, bearing in mind that there are lots of different "normals". I also think what you're describing would be normal now.

The expectations are a lot higher for teenagers now. Grade 9s and A’s and good universities with career focused degrees because you’re paying through the nose for them.*

I hear this a lot, but I don't recognise it from my own experience tbh. I'm 50 with teenage children and I'm a teacher. I don't think my dc have any more academic pressure on them than I did.

My parents, and those of my friends, def didn't let us do what we wanted from 14. We weren't allowed down town at night to join the park drinkers, but had free rein during the day. My parents were v strict.80s/90s. My dad was very much 'this is my house. Def no back chat. We were allowed to go to a nightclub from 16 though, and the pub from yr12. Nightclub=ok cos you got taxi home.
Pub=not so much, cos you walked and it was dodgier.

I'm strict on manners and back chat, but I'm more open to discussion than my dad was. I'm utterly terrified of ds starting to wander (not currently) cos we've got a massive problem with county lines, knives and gangs of older kids destroying stuff, but I don't want him being the kid who has to stay in either. I have sympathy for my parents now.

I remember just starting yr12 and going to the pub, then a mate's mum's 40th (so, so old). I rolled in at 6am then got up and went to my Saturday job. I didn't see the problem, but my dad was so angry he didn't even shout. And he was a shouter. Didn't speak to me for 2 days. I deserve all I get from my dc, tbf.

Lots of parents feel their job is done some earlier than other's I'm shocked at some of the things Dsis turns a blind eye on with her teens I think it is a natural naivety or a decision to pick your battles.
Teens do change in personality DD is 12 we're close but not like when she was a tot.
They naturally grow away parents and parents naturally step back.
We did what we wanted as teenagers and unfortunately didn't always make good choices.

@zoemum2006

The expectations are a lot higher for teenagers now. Grade 9s and A*’s and good universities with career focused degrees because you’re paying through the nose for them.

My 80s/90s life was chill in comparison (although my parents were quite authoritarian).

Times have become more demanding and competitive and we gave to support our young people much more now because society demands so much of them.

I agree that, in terms of tuition fees and a rapidly changing job market, teenagers have additional difficulties. However the top grades in every subject, "only Russell Group?" ethos is more representative of MN than real life.

It’s not just parenting of teenagers that has changed. I work in a school nursery and I notice a lot of changes since my kids were that age. Compared to how most pre schoolers were parented back then (1990s) today they seem to be younger in terms of their development and what is expected of them. I hear lots of parents describing 2 and 3 year olds as “babies”, and consequently having low expectations of what children of that age are capable of.
Don’t get me wrong lots of things have changed for the better, but I’m not convinced everything has.

People are having fewer children as well, which makes a difference.

I'm the eldest of a large family and grew up in the 70s and 80s, and I would say I got very little parental attention from a very young age, purely because my parents' very limited resources of time and energy were devoted to the younger ones who needed feeding or changing or dressing or bathing etc. I learned very early on to sort out my own problems, and not to add to my parents' burdens. I'm sure some parents with large families manage better, but they had far too many children for them.

Which means that I find the threads where people are very invested in their children away at university, and in the details of their accommodation, assignments, happiness, PT jobs etc absolutely incredible. I did my university application by myself, and grant/scholarship applications etc -- I'm not sure my parents knew what I even studied! I mean, they knew the name of the degree, but not what I meant.

But I don't think I had the kind of concentrated attention those Mn university threads see as standard from my parents past the age of five or six.

Maybe your dad was going through a stressful time at work,maybe your mum was going through the menopause, maybe they were having marital problems but didn't tell you about it and you were too absorbed as a typical teenager to notice.

I think there was a trend in the 1990s and 2000s of viewing girls especially as being mature enough to make their own choices from around 13 or 14. So if they got drunk and had sex with lots of boys/became pregnant, it was their own choice and they were "promiscuous" and "sluts", rather than being a matter of concern for their welfare. And very little was said about the older men complicit in this kind of behaviour. This in my view is one of the worst examples of the sort of detached parenting you're describing... children don't go from cuddling their teddies and playing with toys at 11 to completely independent and responsible for the consequences of their own actions at 13.

I do think parents nowadays verge on being over-involved, especially with what schools are doing. But there is much more emphasis on safeguarding, much more knowledge of the dangers faced by young people (drugs, alchohol, cyber-bullying, street violence etc.) and parents are more willing to engage emotionally with their teens. And most people no longer blame vulnerable teens for their own sexual exploitation. All of these are good things.

I think one also needs to recognise how much in life for earlier generations was sorted through nepotism, at all levels of society.

When my MIL applied to RADA in the 1940s her stepfather, who was an actor, went in with her and basically talked non-stop until the interviewing panel suggested that maybe the girl could speak for herself. When my dd applied to RADA she took the train to London on her own. I very much doubt they'd have let me in through the door and I certainly couldn't have made any difference speaking to admissions. She was on her own.

Generations of young hopefuls will have got jobs in banks or at universities or in shops because a parent or uncle or cousin had a word with the manager. Dh got his first job in a shop like that. And what about Toby Young, who didn't make the grade but his dad rang a university contact?

Couldn't happen these days. You couldn't get a job in Tesco's without going through the same application process as everybody else.

So yes, there are more opportunities for young people, but very few where dad comes home in the evening and tells you that I just got you a job.

When it comes to independence, again I think it depends on what you mean. Young working-class men may have had to become independent very quickly, but I'm less sure about middle-class young woman like my mum, who lived at home until she married and then moved a few doors down. Her parents were lovely, and she knew how to cook and mend, but she had no experience of actually running anything (bills, repairs, dealing with tradesmen) until she had children of her own. Same with my MIL: treated like a young child well into her 20s.

@luxxlisbon

Every single generation always thinks the next generation have it too easy. This is nothing new.

A Roman quote said the same thing...A couple of millennia ago. Wish I'd taken note of the source.

Some kids these days do appear to run absolute rings around their parents.

An old Horseman said ''Discipline is a dirty word these days.....Discipline doesn't mean hitting''.

Parents pleading with kids ''Darling, we have to leave the toyshop now''

Come on, sweetheart.. Mummy has to go now.

Kid {Scowling} '' NO!!!! ''

More pleading, ''Getting down to his/her level''

Kid then starts slapping at parent's face..

Mummy :'' Okay, sweetheart. Five more minutes, then we must go, okay?''

Kid then raises hell once 5 mins is up, kicking and screaming.

Stuff like this is far more common. Kid dictates terms.

Discipline is difficult as the discipline our parents used is no longer acceptable it can be hard to navigate the little sods when they're kicking off in public.
We're all trying to do our best allowing them express feelings within reason.
They might be more pampered these days but wish I'd been pampered with supportive parenting I think it will benefit them in the future when the foundation is built on trust compromise and love.