can't decide between job offers

[colalight]

So I was made redundant last year due to Covid 19. I was earning £37,000pa. Public sector so it was good pay, benefits, pension, unionised, family friendly policies etc.
I wasn't happy where I was as I found it quite stressful. Not because of the job itself but the targets were quite impossible and my managers were arseholes. So the redundancy (voluntary) was quite a relief and the package was good.
I wanted to still work though so I've been applying for lots of roles and I have two offers.
First one is £41,000pa and mostly home based but with occasional travel to London which is quite a way to travel. Its private sector. 25 days holiday a year, employee voice (rather than a union), "excellent" pension scheme (but no details other than that), nothing about staff benefits although glassdoor says 'shop discounts'. Oh and they were asking me in the interview about my preferred gender pronouns which made me a bit uncomfortable. The interviewer also kept going on about the BLM movement (which I support) but again it made me feel this organisation was a bit too political and woke for me.
Second one is £30,000pa and only home based during Covid 19 but its 30 mins from home. Its public sector. 31 days holiday a year, flexible working policies, has lots of staff, networks and societies, very detailed list of staff benefits, very good pension scheme and it is unionised. It could open lots more doors for me career wise.
I want to accept the second offer but my head is saying its a step back for me.
My DH says we can afford it (plus he's hoping to get a promotion). He also says it is more important to be happy. He says I can keep job searching whilst in job 2 but I can't stop my head from saying "you've worked so hard to get where you are and you will be failing!" I also worry that it could take forever to get back up to what I earned before - if at all.
WIBU to take the lower salary? Has anyone been in a similar position?

@colalight if the company really cannot provide you with information about the benefits they offer, I would be very concerned about them as an organisation.

What do they say when you ask?

Sounds like you'd be happier in the lower paid job and if you can afford it then I'd take that one. Q

OP, just wanted to add. Job 1 interview mentioning gender pronounce and blm.. It is likely their new HR policy to mention/ask that, also it is most likely have zero impact on your work, your future colleagues might not be political at all. You need to ask HR from the first company about exact pension so you can realistically compare 2 jobs from the money perspective.

Don't take job 1 if you don't want stress. It's a private company, they will grind you down with the amount of work they will give you, especially in reporting. Every month it will be 'can you do this extra one too please' until you're doing enough work for several people. Been there, done that, no thanks never again.

Take job 2. You've already had a good pension from your previous job, this will just add to it.

Job 2 pension scheme says employee contribution is 9.6% of annual salary and employer contribution is 19.5% of members' salaries

So Job 2 are offering to put £5850.00 into your pension and you will contribute £2880. That sounds as if the pension offered by job 2 will be a defined contribution pension rather than the 'gold plated' civil service defined benefit pension.

I do hope you keep chasing job 1 for more details of their pension offer. If they can't help with something so basic, I would tend to avoid them as an organisation.

What do you know about the culture of job 1? Do you think it would suit you ?

I agree with @Sprig1 and didn’t think their comment was rude. The posters that commented on it are just clutching at straws in an attempt to find something to get offended about - just shit stirrers.

Neither job sounds great frankly. They’re not the only jobs in the world - just the only 2 you currently have offers for. I would recommend that you keep applying until you’ll find something more suitable.

Job 2 is a step backwards. It is a regression - it doesn’t matter how otherwise cushy it is. It’s okay for short term until you find something better though.

Were you aware that the London commute was a requirement for the other job? If so, why did you apply? I think in the current climate you wouldn’t be expected to travel there so again, it would be okay short term until you find a more suitable job.

Does either company have a better reputation or is better known than the other?

If home based and requires occasional travel to London I would expect to be able to expense that

Putting the salary and benefits aside, which job appeals the most?

From what you have said, I think you prefer Job 2. It's clearly an area that interests you as you are already studying the subject.

I think you are being swayed by the money for Job 1. If you are working directly with SMT and directors then expect stress. They will be the most demanding people in the organisation. I very much doubt the pension contribution from the organisation will be anywhere near 19.5%!!!

Get all the details for the first job so you can make an informed decision. Also, don't assume that you are taking a step back. This is a stepping stone. I took a job once for only £1k increase on my salary. Within the year, I'd had two pay rises equating to £7k. This was a long time ago and a big increase on my salary.

@FinallyHere the glassdoor reviews for job 1 keep talking about 'bad management' but DH says happy people don't tend to leave reviews?

@sofiaaaaaa I didn't know about travel until middle of the interview process and they said it was 'occasional' but how occasional is occasional???

@Royalbloo they are both very well known organisations in their respective fields. Job 1 is a national organisation. Job 2 is local but international reputation.

@wendyleen I am trying to see it as a stepping stone yes, it could open more doors to me, and I can keep applying for higher grade roles too

Interesting @colalight

I'd say that making a job offer without the necessary contractual details of pension arrangements would be at least a bad sign, if not a textbook definition of bad management.

It is possible for the HR function who make job offers to be disorganised and the management to be great but ....

What are the different cultures, what you have seen of them, like? Which do you think might suit you better.

@FinallyHere job 2 is fairly local (13 miles away, 25/30 min drive on average) so I know about the organisation and it is indeed well respected and well known and I have some family links to it (they don't work there anymore though). I have heard nothing negative and glassdoor is mostly positive. job 1 is a national organisation, and as the role would be homebased, I have not really had a chance to observe the culture. Glassdoor is mostly negative. Also been doing some reading up and they did a lot of restructuring and redundancies and had financial losses in 2019 but the CEO also says to the media that things are "turning around" due to new contracts.

Job offer from both job offers are conditional based on references, so no proper contracts through yet.

[quote colalight]@FinallyHere job 2 is fairly local (13 miles away, 25/30 min drive on average) so I know about the organisation and it is indeed well respected and well known and I have some family links to it (they don't work there anymore though). I have heard nothing negative and glassdoor is mostly positive. job 1 is a national organisation, and as the role would be homebased, I have not really had a chance to observe the culture. Glassdoor is mostly negative. Also been doing some reading up and they did a lot of restructuring and redundancies and had financial losses in 2019 but the CEO also says to the media that things are "turning around" due to new contracts.

Job offer from both job offers are conditional based on references, so no proper contracts through yet.[/quote]

I'd agree with your dh ref reviews, tend not to be left by happy employees unless company does a drive on them to get people to complete. Based on what you've said here though I'd go for job 2, it's local and you already know through actual people what it's like. Job 1 may say some travel to London but we all know fine well the odd few times turns into a lot!

So Glassdoor is mostly negative for Job 1 and mostly positive for Job 2?

I wouldn't say that bodes particularly well for Job 1. How many are we talking, one or two or loads?

I think the problem with restructures is that there is often some of the old guard left and the bright new things. They don't always meet in the middle which makes for politics and difficult working relationships.

Go with your gut on this one.

but the CEO also says to the media that things are "turning around" due to new contracts.

That means they'll accept any new contracts no doubt and question resources later. The workers are the ones dumped on to complete the work, ie you.

I'm not sure how to word a question about a, what the pension is and b, the negative reviews (nearly half are negative of about 160 reviews)

I wouldn’t ask about the reviews.

Pension.

Be direct. They’re offering you a package. It’s absolutely normal to clarify what the package actually is. Something like

Contact name

I’m very excited to receive your job offer for position X. Before I can accept I need to understand the details of the pension provision offered. If someone could let me know the employee and employer contributions and other details I’d be very grateful.

Yours sincerely

Colalight

okay, I will ask that question tomorrow and see what they come back with before I make a final decision.

Looking again at glassdoor, it says benefits include Death in service, health, pension, cycle to work scheme, childcare vouchers, buy and sell holidays, 25 days annual leave plus bank holidays, employee support scheme, bike to work, sick pay

glassdoor doesn't expand. I'll definitely ask more questions though.

@colalight

okay, I will ask that question tomorrow and see what they come back with before I make a final decision.

Looking again at glassdoor, it says benefits include Death in service, health, pension, cycle to work scheme, childcare vouchers, buy and sell holidays, 25 days annual leave plus bank holidays, employee support scheme, bike to work, sick pay

glassdoor doesn't expand. I'll definitely ask more questions though.

Do they not have any of this on their company career page op? I'd expect a big corp to be shouting from the rooftops about stuff like this as part of their evp (not so much pension contributions etc but at least any additional perks etc)

I did once leave a £45,000 a year job which I hated to go to a £30,000 a year job because it was also literally my dream job and the Company name would look really good on my CV. It massively paid off and I had lots of even better job offers quite quickly. Six months later I moved again to a better paid job that also was so much fun and it kick started my career from there on in. Most people advised me not to take that salary drop risk but I am forever grateful that I did.

@Allispretty

Nothing whatsoever on their website other than what I've written above (which I found from glassdoor). So its red flags for me. I'll report back if I get an answer to my questions today.

I'd be taking job 2 given the culture, certainty and the lack of some details from job 1. You can always decline job 1 on the grounds of having found somewhere local to you if you do not want to given any more reasons.

so just off a teams call with job 1 where I asked more questions. They did NOT seem happy.

6% employer contribution and 6% employee contribution.

That contrasts with 21% employer contribution in previous role and 19% employer contribution in Job 2.

I also asked about staff support already available. They have multiple equality networks in job 1 (so does job 2) but they do not recognise a union. They have employee voice instead (but isn't that basically the organisation telling the organisation what to do)?

Think I will accept job 2 now.

Good plan. You need to think long term as being poor in old age sucks and you want a good pension. You can always get a better paid job whilst you’re still young.

Imagine being upset because a company asked you your preferred pronouns.