To think that serial killers can’t exist these days?

[Snooks1971]

Or actually get away with murder enough to become a serial killer maybe I should say. Just finished Night Stalker on Netflix, which made me think about this, although I’ve thought along these lines before. Have always been fascinated with Jack The Ripper after visiting Madame Tussaud’s as a young teen (late 40s now).

I haven’t googled any facts and I’m just an armchair observer, but surely with mobile phones, cctv, forensic developments, tech interfaces actually talking to each other this wouldn’t be possible now.

Then I wonder how many serial killers from the past that we have never of who must have got away with it. Makes my mind boggle a bit.

Maybe three were just a keen gardener who was fed up with people’s cats shitting in their veg patch? Don’t want your cat murdered? Cat-proof your own garden and let it shit in there

@iklboo

Maybe three were just a keen gardener who was fed up with people’s cats shitting in their veg patch? Don’t want your cat murdered? Cat-proof your own garden and let it shit in there.

Don't be ridiculous. Killing & mutilating cats is fine if you like gardening?

Please don’t put words in my mouth. I didn’t say it was fine at all.

It’s much more difficult for murderers to go undetected for so long these days, mainly due to technology and, in America especially, the way this enables information to be shared across states / departments within the same state. Also, if you read something like Helter Skelter, sewing the errors that happened before databases, email etc, and the amount of people let off for smaller crimes / serving short sentences and getting out to commit worse crimes - I guess the fact that prisons are now a profit making industry in the US means this happens far less. But Helter Skelter was really eye opening about the state of policing in the US at that time, as was I’ll Be Gone In The Dark.

Sadly there is an endless supply of vulnerable people who no one can be much arsed to look for when they go missing, most of them are women, sex workers, care leavers etc

Add trafficked people and illegal immigrants, anyone with no history of being around in the first place.

Depending on methods, I think it would be almost easier at the moment for someone to kill a few people without being found out.
Eg, a nursing home with a covid outbreak. Would they bother with autopsies?

The violent, mostly men, who torture women who looked like mummy are another matter.

@Whirlwind14

Randomly, whilst awake in the middle of the night I came across this fact!

That's pretty chilling.

The Night Stalker, Richard Ramirez, grew up in my hometown and lived near my cousins that I would visit often when I was a kid. My cousins went to school with him.

@Porcupineintherough

I dont think that definition is correct *@FastFood*. As I understand it, a serial killer is someone who kills 3 or more people, with spaces between the killings (to distinguish it from spree killing), for motives that are largely about psychological or sexual gratification ie not revenge, or money. They can have connections, even relationships, with some or (rarely) all of their victims.

I think as well that the killings tend to become more sophisticated (for want of a better word) and usually more extreme in terms of brutality etc - each builds on the one before, which is one of the reasons why the term "serial" was adopted - not just one after another, but each one playing in to the following one.

I totally believe the canal thing, why wouldn't you?

Because the more obvious explanation is they were drunk and have fallen in. The pattern repeats all over the U.K and in many countries. It's nothing new. People are drawn to water and drunk guys go to urinate in it, puke in it, and being drunk generally make stupid decisions . I've known more than one person who died this way. My Father saw his friend drown like this in the Clyde when he was young. It's a tale as old as time.

Because the more obvious explanation is they were drunk and have fallen in.

And because Manchester city centre is heavily covered with CCTV, yet not one traceof a fantom pusher has ever been found? Plus pushing someone into a canal isn't a particularly sophisticated way of killing them, death is by no means certain. Someone would have lived to tell the tale and identified the perpetrator.

Drunks missing their footing in the dark seems the most likely explanation

I watched a documentary about Peter Tobin recently and it horrified me. He travelled all over the country and the police have identified many locations where he was in the area at the same time a missing person went missing and has never been found. They assume it’s him but no resources to actually investigate more, so they are all just still classed as unsolved, even though they are fairly sure it was him.

He owned a house down in Brighton and is suspected that he buried a local missing girl in the garden there (as was his MO) but the police don’t have the money to dig it up! How awful for the family of the girl! And the homeowners wouldn’t allow for it to be dug up with private funding, only if it was by the police. Personally I would want to know if there was a body in my garden and to try and help the family get closure.

Because he’s already in prison and never getting out, it’s ‘not in the public interest’ to spend any more money on tracing the rest of his victims. They did initially, which was how they connected him with other locations and missing people, but it never got further than that.

I think that’s really awful.

Read about Samuel Little - he died in December but was probably the most prolific serial killer in the US. He confessed to 93 killings and the FBI have confirmed about 50 of them, including ones where bodies were discovered that had not initially been considered homicides. He painted pictures of his victims over a period from 1970s to 2000s and the following link also leads to an FBI page where they are trying to identify victims for some of his confessed killings (Trigger warning: there are interviews with him detailing the crimes on that page)

www.fbi.gov/news/pressrel/press-releases/fbi-confirms-samuel-little-is-most-prolific-serial-killer-in-us-history

How did he get away with it for about 30-40 years? He killed opportunistically, randomly, was continously moving and picked his victims from poorer black neighbourhoods, sometimes with chaotic lifestyles/addiction issues, although many were women in work or at college. In one of the interviews he was very open about it - he picked women that wouldn't get media attention, women who were less likely to have a vocal network to publicize their death and seek justice, women who society might judge their death or disappearance as a natural progression or consequence from their lifestyle, pretty much women that society cared about least. And he got away with it - maybe 93 women who he brutally robbed of their lives, over a 30-40 year period.
I

Wouldn't you describe Levi Bellfield as a serial killer?

You could if you literally had never had previous contact with the police and murdered complete strangers. Otherwise they’d get on to you reasonably quickly.

Christopher Halliwell got away with it for a long time!

You could if you literally had never had previous contact with the police and murdered complete strangers. Otherwise they’d get on to you reasonably quickly.

I wonder if even this is less likely to happen these days, because we have so much more technology (speaking about the U.K. here specifically) - dash cams, ring doorbells, and not to mention social media.. if someone was seen acting dodgy in a local area they're usually put on the local town Facebook group.. so I think all this must deter some of them maybe?

I think if your smart you can get away with it. Dint take your phone with you, make sure the reg plate is covered with mud etc.

Different league but they never found anyone in connection to the M25 cat killer. I know they say now there was no m25 cat killer, but having a friends cat dissected and arranged on her lawn in broad daylight, I'm not convinced

I read something a few years ago about the fbi saying there's usually at least 1 to 2 serial killers per state at any one time 😮

@covetingthepreciousthings I think in some cases it's seen as more of a challenge, more exciting and higher satisfaction to the person if they get away with it, just like those killers who leave some sort of clue, they'll dangle something in front of police, mocking them and taunting them to put 2 and 2 together. As I said previously technology and people can be mislead very easily, technology has probaby deterred a large number but not all, I don't think anything will ever put an end to serial killers, it's just a part of society, like burglary, there's so much that has been done to deter it and help capture those responsible but it still happens unfortunately.

just like those killers who leave some sort of clue, they'll dangle something in front of police

Yes you're right, and then there's the ones who go a step further and even who will turn up to help the police with searches etc..

@Whirlwind14

Randomly, whilst awake in the middle of the night I came across this fact!

The problem with this random statistic that may cause all kinds of thrills/ frights in the naive is who is 'you' in this? YOU will walk past 36 murderers in your lifetime on average. Let's assume the YOU in this is the population of the UK, although it could just as easily refer to the world population, the population of Timbuktu or the US. We'll assume UK for the point. The YOU will include prison officers, judges, defence barristers, police officers who will 'walk past' murderers a lot more than that in their lifetimes perhaps. You will, on average, walk past more murderers (probably) based on where you live and have lived. There is no possible way of telling how many murderers ANYONE has walked past in their lifetime, it simply isn't something that can be quantified. And yes, in America there probably are serial killers circulating. It's a massive place with lots of rural, forest, secluded areas and it's a wet dream for someone with ill intentions. Gang activity doesn't count towards serial killer activity. If you are one of those people who say 'I love watching serial killer documentaries' it doesn't make you sound clever. (I am not talking to you to the poster I'm quoting, I'm quoting you for the statement only.)

Fortunately, the law in England is that when they’re caught and convicted, serial killers stay inside until they die:

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/44/schedule/21

This isn’t the case in Scotland and most EU countries.

Sorry Whirlwind, I assumed my quoting you would include the picture.

Just google it. Literally thousands of people
Who have killed or are suspected of killing 2+ people in the last 5 years.

Just google it. Literally thousands of people
Who have killed or are suspected of killing 2+ people in the last 5 years.

2+ non related people though? In the U.K.? Or are you talking across the globe.

Sorry bold fail there quoting @Guineapig99

I think it’s harder now but still possible. You’d have to be careful with cctv and ring doorbells, and not carrying a phone and not leaving your DNA etc - but if you thought carefully about handling those areas you could do it.

Also if you’re a really good serial killer then the police won’t connect that all of your victims are yours. I suppose if you mixed up your victim profile and locations and didn’t have any motifs etc then it would be harder for police to spot your MO.