Scouts/ Guides etc charging full fees

[Oileo]

Obviously all groups are different, but ours are definitely not being charged for halls (As stated on the parish website and confirmed verbally). Different if groups are being charged. However most our subs go on in session resources, towards trips etc.

My third is now ready to join, which has prompted this. The first term will be £35. Only they’ll be solely zoom. It’s a new pack.

With our current pack I’ve stepped up and contributed a lot to zoom sessions and any face to face as a leader, doing something with every week- but overall I’m not earning and nearly a year in I could do with a bit of a break on subs.

Are your groups still charging normal subs? I know nationally scouts and guides are actually increasing costs for registration.

I’m noW feeling like I’m tight because I’ve just asked if the youngest can remain on the waiting list until face 2 face starts up. They were a bit off and I’m guessing her place is lost. But she has no interest in zoom at all at age 5. Loves a hall full of friends, but by 5:30 she’s not up for screen listening at all.

How are your kids finding it at after school times if they do it?

Ours are charging normal subs but always say to get in touch if we can't pay as they don't want to exclude anyone.

I have no issues with paying as it's a fraction of every other after school club in normal times and I always think £35 is scarcely break even. They are also proving materials to DD2 during lockdown.

Having said that, I am not in a position to help time wise due to younger DC - you are clearly more than doing so (and I am so massively grateful to those who do). I would hope that the subs of those who don't would help those who don't who might be finding it a bit harder right now.

I would ask - I am sure they will understand.

Best of luck to you.

To answer your original question, DD2 is fine but is 11 - DS1 (8) also enjoying Cubs.

I also have DS2 who is 5 - Zoom opps for him very limited, I quite agree they do not have the necessary attention span.

It's because we have to pay national membership fees in February. I'm a group treasurer and the national + county + district fees come to around £47 per child per year and fall due in Feb. As a new group your unit may not have the funds in reserve to pay out all at once and will be relying on first term subs to cover it. These are necessary fees and allow Scouting to continue and function as an organisation. Insurance, programme resources, website management, legal fees, campsite maintenance, activity centre maintenance etc etc, there's dozens of things that still need to be covered even when groups can only operate on zoom at a local level. In fact these fees are actually going up this year by £7.50 a head to cover increased costs due to covid - most costs have remained the same but commercial income has collapsed. TSA has made redundancies, sold properties and made various other cost cutting measures and it's still not enough.

Our group will have to charge full subs for at least two terms if we're to break even. Additional costs over and above membership fees already mentioned include our contents insurance for all our camping gear, personal injury insurance for leaders and young people which we can't operate without, our OSM web package fees for our computer admin suite, our scout shop invoices for badges that we're still distributing, and for us, a donation to our sponsor church even though we're not using their premises.

As for how our young people manage zoom - our beavers section has only about 50% attendance on any given week, and they limit their sessions to 45mins now based on parental feedback. I think we'll survive as a group but I don't think all our young people will come back even if we get some face to face in the summer term.

I think it is similar for scouts, but guiding has a 'census', each February, and that is when they unit has to pay a sum of money per child which covers insurance and organisation costs.

The guide association has to pay yearly insurance for each member. Which the unit gets charged for even with out meetings it could be that they are charging for.

Ours is still charging normal subs, but it’s only £10 a month. They have heir own hall so I think that fair enough.
They have applied for and been successful in getting a couple fo large covid grants which has meant that they’re doing ok for now, but as the 2 largest fundraisers (fete and sout post) were cancelled last year and probably will be again this year, I’m not sure how they’ll manage.

I think the parents that help out should pay less. I’m very grateful for those that do

Ours have asked for young leaders to pay subs this time. They are normally paid for from fundraising which obviously hasn’t happened this year

I hear what people are saying certainly.

But selfishly I also feel like I’m paying for something to keep running that will largely be missed. Rainbows is only age 5-7, some have pretty much now missed half their time.
When it does resume it’s likely to be limited far longer by numbers, distance etc and not be the same. With my eldest he doesn’t want to go with a mask, I can foresee him dropping out at face to face... after a year of near zero zoom. His friends don’t seem to enjoy the zoom much either, but try to play a part and go.

There’s not an easy answer. For me it’s their only after school club. It’s not cheap for 4 lots of subs (1 rainbow, 1 brownie, 1 cub and 1 scout) and I’m hitting the point of drop out.

@queenofSI

I think the parents that help out should pay less. I’m very grateful for those that do

The problem with this is that it's run by volunteers, so anything they charge for is an actual cost - activity fees, hut rent, insurance, registration fees etc. So either you're saying that the other scouts should pay more to subsidise the parent helpers or that the money should magically appear from somewhere. There's no profit to use just because someone is helping

The rainbows isn’t a new pack btw, just new for us. The others went to another hall but this one is now closer for us.

Insurance, safeguarding, leader training, headquarters fees etc.

These all cost money and the membership fee spreads this over the course of the year.

They are charities but they aren't free.

I help at cubs and scouts. I don’t mind at all paying the same as my kids benefit I’m sure in lots of other ways.

My guide unit have run meetings on Zoom since May, initially fortnightly, then Weekly since May half term. We sent out a bag of goodies for Oct through to Christmas and asked for a donation as we are working on badges, programme stuff and provide most things for the activities - parents needed to provide an orange, and paper and pens. We asked for a donation of up to half the subs, about 6 out of 24 made a donation.

This term as previously mentioned we have to pay our membership fee per child approx £40 in my area, normally we charge termly subs and save for this cost over the year, we haven't had any subs since we last paid it last Feb. So we have asked for full subs, explaining why we need it.

We have of course said if there are any financial difficulties please let us know, but we cannot afford to pay a bill of £1200 having had no income for the past year.

Trouble is, the units won't be there to reopen after all this if we're not careful...

However most our subs go on in session resources, towards trips etc.

No, 1/3 of subs at that (low) rate will go to the Capitation. Each youth member of Scouts (and Guides) pays a fee to HQ (and some usually to their County and District) to operate throughout the year. It pays the staff that run the organisation; the expenses of the masses of volunteers; the resources; things like rooms when people meet to plan events; training costs - do you know every single LEader has to be first Aid qualified, and renew this every 3 years ? Ditto Safety Training. Ditto Safeguarding training.; It pays staff to process all the DBS requests - as everyone who has access to either the dc, or even administrative details has to be DBS trained; It pays for training for the other 37 (? ish) Modules that Leaders complete. Plus hiring venues to deliver that training in. Plus resources for some. It pays for all the resources that are on the website. Where needed, it pays for legal fees to support groups and Leaders. It covers insurance costs for Leaders and young people.

So that is at least 1/3 of your annual subs.

However, as others have said, no Scout Group will exclude a child for financial reasons. You need to talk to your individual Group. Every Group I work with supports families when redundancy hits, or other financial hardship.

Are your groups still charging normal subs?

This varies massively, Group to Group. Very few have been charging normal subs. Some stopped charging at all, most - the sensible ones at least - have explained the situation to parents and asked them for 1/2, or 1/3, or whatever their finances can stand.
Some have been lucky enough to have a grant, which has left them better off than usual. Others have lost a big annual fundraiser (for example the annual Community Bonfire or similar) so will really be struggling. Demographs vary considerably. One GSL told me they explained the situation to parents and asked them for 1/3 of the monthly subs, and, overwhelmingly the parents wanted to continue the full amount, as their salaries hadn't changed and they realise what superb value for money the Scouts were for the last 8 years or whatever they had been using them.

Mine has closed for good because subs weren’t paid, such a shame.

Just talk to the leader - thank you for the offer of the place unfortunately due to my current situation I am going to have to pass at the moment as I am not in a position to pay subs. I would still like x to join the group and would appreciate being kept on the waiting list so that hopefully when the situation improves she can join.

Just be honest

If your children aren't accessing anything, and you don't think they want to return F2F with restrictions, when it is allowed, then of course they can leave, but there might not automatically be anything to go back to if everyone decided to leave now.
Nationally, HQ are doing what they can to try to balance the books - Baden Powell House is being sold, staff have been made redundant, and the Association have been talking with Government, and with charities to seek support. Groups across the Country have also been doing some fundraising and this has been matchfunded to try to support groups that will otherwise fold.

Some groups (and Districts) will have reserves they can use to support families financially, if this is the reason a family is talking about leaving, rather than them not actually wanting to belong, but the family need to have that conversation with the Group or they won't be aware.

I start tomorrow as a county treasurer. Voluntary role ,I am an accountant.

Scouts is a membership organisation, but most groups will have hardship funds.

Nationally I believe there have been redundancies amongst paid staff that operate at uk level.

My brownie group hasn't charged anything for Zoom meetings, which have included resources being delivered to houses occasionally. We will be asking for parents to pay the annual census at cost and will be explaining exactly what this is and why we still have to pay it, with clear wording inviting parents to talk to us if this will cause hardship. I think it's quite reasonable that we're taking this approach, as if we didn't do this then the unit would cease to exist for either face to face or Zoom, but it is right that we explain what this money is for. If you are being asked to pay the same fees for online meetings as you would for face to face then you are within your rights to ask for an explanation as to why this is required.

Our Explorers are charging full price but they still have their building to maintain so that's fair enough. Any underspend always gets saved for the group anyway so the kids will see the benefit eventually.

Ours is £12.50/month, zoom regularly but my daughter won’t do zoom. She started immediately before lockdown so bad timing but she did enjoy the two physical sessions she went to so don’t want to lose her place. Also, the fundraising opportunities that normally help pay for hall upkeep etc have been extremely limited so I’ve continued paying. They have always given people the option not to though given the current circumstances.

My eldest son’s online Beavers is £14 a month

I run a Brownie pack and we haven't charged parents for any of the Zoom meetings we've been running since October and delivered a pack of craft stuff and a present in the run up to Christmas. We haven't received any income since closing in March so the subscription fee due next month is going to be a little challenging for us and many other units in the country. My daughter joined my unit last month and I will obviously be paying for her to take part when we resume and start charging parents again but we would always work with any parents who couldn't afford the fees. We are all volunteers so don't feel that we can charge for the Zoom meetings as they don't generate any costs at the moment.