to think Derbyshire police need to read the LAW and understand that you can't fine people when they are not breaking it

[chomalungma]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-55560814

Surrounded by police, treated like a criminal for driving 5 miles to a beauty spot for a walk.

It is not illegal to drive to exercise.

Unacceptable treatment by the police. 5 miles is local.

my nearest supermarket is an 'expensive' one; I will drive farther to shop in one we can afford comfortably. FFS.

@viques

Maybe next time the walkers could make coffee at home in a thermos rather than going to a coffee shop...........

As far as I am aware getting a take away coffee from a coffee shop is allowed under lockdown. Or do you think thee businesses should also be closed and not allowed to make any money, lay off their staff, etc.

Well considering they have said stay local, don't travel and the fact that people who live in Derbyshire are sick of everyone coming out the the cities to "exercise somewhere quiet, good on the police. It might be "quiet" but people still actually live and work here that don't want people coming from high tier areas. They were in a lower tier until all the 'walkers' came out then the infection rates went up.
I mean how difficult is it? Even a bloody dog can sit and stay!!

I mean how difficult is it?

After ten months of this shit, it's extremely difficult, particularly if you live somewhere shit.

@GetOffYourHighHorse

It does seem heavy handed, why not just park there and tell people to go home.

Why are people driving 5m to meet a pal though, it isn't essential. Just go for a walk or run from your home address. Everyone always thinks they are special and different but if everyone drove a few miles to meet someone the roads would be busy. Stay at home fgs!

Oh the irony of your username.

I've always loved rurally and once even lived where my cottage door went out onto a main road. I couldn't even go for a walk with the pram. If those were the rules I'd be stranded. 5 mile drive to a large open space is absolutely fine

It getting to the stage where you have to have a fines kitty in place for leaving your house, so the rich can just carry on and do what they want and the poor stay the fuck at home

^^ twas ever thus and the poor of course are ghettoized in dense living conditions where they cant sd properly.

@Snaketime

Well considering they have said stay local, don't travel and the fact that people who live in Derbyshire are sick of everyone coming out the the cities to "exercise somewhere quiet, good on the police. It might be "quiet" but people still actually live and work here that don't want people coming from high tier areas. They were in a lower tier until all the 'walkers' came out then the infection rates went up. I mean how difficult is it? Even a bloody dog can sit and stay!!

i really don't think Derbyshire's cases are due to walkers. Just like the influx of people to Cornwall over the summer (and still) did not cause a big surge in cases there. Ditto the Cotswolds. it is the large cities/towns in those areas that start with the covid cases and it spreads from there.

Nah Whether you want to argue over the technicalities of should or must we are all expected to stay local at the moment they didn’t need to go to that precise location across borders no sympathy for them

We have annual passes to a local Arboretum it’s 6 miles away but it’s in a different county so we’re not allowed to go even they advertise as being open for local exercise some people push the guidance and others will make sacrifices because it’s the right thing to do

They also look like a couple of Insta twats and are probably loving the attention

@Wales34

The rules state that exercise should begin and end at home , you aren't supposed to driven for exercise. I think given the serious situation in the hospitals I welcome the police doing this

You're wrong, nowhere says this.

I do wish people would look up the actual guidance before embarrassing themselves by posting nonsense on threads like this.

I can't believe people think laws are all absolute and police officers don't spend their days interpreting them?
Is someone drunk and disorderly? Up to the cop who apprehends them. Is someone resisting arrest? Up to the cop. Are you driving without due care and attention? Could be, depending on how the cop who sees you interprets what you are doing.

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not.

@JellyBabiesSaveLives

The issue isn’t whether the walkers were being sensible or whether they were bending the rules. The issue is that our police force were telling people they were breaking the law when they were not. They gave penalties and ordered people to go home without any legal authority to do so.

Absolutely. I imagine the people supporting this would be less keen if the police started inventing laws they were less happy about.

We have annual passes to a local Arboretum it’s 6 miles away but it’s in a different county so we’re not allowed to go even they advertise as being open for local exercise some people push the guidance and others will make sacrifices because it’s the right thing to do

You are allowed to go into a different county (assuming you are in England)

Whether you should go is up to you.

But you are allowed to go.

@fluufy

I can't believe people think laws are all absolute and police officers don't spend their days interpreting them? Is someone drunk and disorderly? Up to the cop who apprehends them. Is someone resisting arrest? Up to the cop. Are you driving without due care and attention? Could be, depending on how the cop who sees you interprets what you are doing.

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not.

But in this case they don't have to prove you are guilty.

If you are innocent, you have to prove your innocence.

Plus the proof of drunkenness can be established with a breathalyser and there are legally defined limits for levels of alcohol in blood.

There are no legally defined limits for 'local' or 'reasonable' or 'short' in this case.

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not

And if they interpret them incorrectly, then the case gets thrown out.

Judges interpret law.

@fluufy

I can't believe people think laws are all absolute and police officers don't spend their days interpreting them? Is someone drunk and disorderly? Up to the cop who apprehends them. Is someone resisting arrest? Up to the cop. Are you driving without due care and attention? Could be, depending on how the cop who sees you interprets what you are doing.

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not.

Of course. And if the law said “stay local” then police could interpret that. But the law says you can leave your house for exercise (among other things of course). The police could judge what constitutes exercise, but there is no distance from home that is mentioned at all. So they are not interpreting the law, they are adding to it.

Plus all your examples would go to a magistrates court for a fair trial.

There is no fair trial in this lockdown exercise case.

I am scared how many people on this thread seem happy about police issuing fines to people who are perfectly law abiding.. in fact I would argue these women were also following the guidance, but they were definitely inside the law.

As to those saying 'i just walk in my local park, that's fine' - why do you need to go to the park? Surely you could just jog up and down on the spot in your living room? Need some fresh air? Just open the window. Is it necessary for you to leave the house at all?

See how mad this all gets? That's why the law is specific and why you should not fine someone unless you are sure they have breached it.

@chomalungma

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not

And if they interpret them incorrectly, then the case gets thrown out.

Judges interpret law.

In this case of lockdown exercise, there is no fair trial. There is no judge!

The police are the judge. Which should not every happen in a democracy - the two parts of law enforcement are supposed to always be separate

@JamesMiddletonsMarshmallows it is the law in Wales, so taking in consideration their username, I’d just assume they are not aware of the different laws in England.

I was brought up to show no respect to police; they were only ever known as pigs, mocked, merrily lied to at every opportunity. I spent my childhood hearing from my mother about the bones they had broken, the rape threats, punches and illegal arrests she and her friends suffered. I watched it happen to people I knew as a teen - they broke a friends ribs round the back of the station as late as 2005.

As an adult, I chose to take a full part in society and to re train my thought processes around the police. Since adulthood and a 'respectable' life, they have been nothing but courteous (if not actually ever helpful). I had hoped that things were different now. No. Still jumped up cunts, making up their own laws and punishments. Covid has fucked all of my tentative respect for police.

@Glenorma

If they were sitting in the car together it’s illegal. And I totally agree that driving several miles is not acceptable.

They travelled separately.

Why do people have an issue with the 5 mile thing? What is an acceptable distance and can you justify your reasoning seeing as the law can't?

My 13yo has gone on a walk with a friend today. They got Starbucks to take with them - had no idea that could be thought of as a picnic. As far as I remember from last time you were allowed to sit down and have something to eat while on your walk.

@WingingWonder

I live somewhere with NO footpaths It’s rural and pretty and plenty of people walk the fields and footpaths but/ There are stiles everywhere It’s rough terrain It’s pretty isolated 4 miles away is a country park I shall be going there with my kids and dog because it is safe ... common sense

Same here!

I cannot agree that there was any breach of the legislation here. Exercise is an approved reasonable excuse to leave home and they stayed local. Perhaps there is case law on the meaning of "local". If so, I'm pretty sure 5 miles is local.

There have been consistent problems with Derbyshire Police being heavy handed.

So stupid

@chomalungma

What do you think happens with every law? The police interpret them, and decide how when and why to apply them, or not

And if they interpret them incorrectly, then the case gets thrown out.

Judges interpret law.

And the standard of proof for criminal sanctions is "beyond reasonable doubt" . Not "on the interpretation of the police".