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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

‘but’

70 replies

SkedaddIe · 07/01/2021 18:39

I was just told irl that I'm unreasonable for adding a 'but' in a conversation.

We were talking about the White House insurgents and the video of the shot. I said ‘but’ after “it's terrible that a woman died"

AIBU? Are some things ‘un-but-able’

OP posts:
Chanjer · 07/01/2021 19:16

Totally but-able behaviour

It's terrible someone died but fucking hell what would you honestly expect

Imissmoominmama · 07/01/2021 19:18

But... if she hadn’t been climbing through a window, towards senators, during an illegal break in, she’d still be alive...

It is sad that she died, but you can see how it happened.

JokeTheCoalman · 07/01/2021 19:19

Where I'm from a 'but' at the end of the sentence means the same as a but at the front
But I don't want to
I don't want to, but

Yoshinori · 07/01/2021 19:20

It’s not really terrible that she died is it?
How is it terrible ?

She was a white supremacist who decided to invade the Capitol and died as a result. Some argue that that is terrorism.

I doubt if a a BLM protester or a Muslim protester had done what she had done, you would be so quick to say how terrible it was she died.

Of course one shouldn’t be glad she died but it’s why do you feel so compelled to say it’s terrible she died so close to a discussion of the issue ?
“But”

As a POC, I would assume you sympathised with her tbh.

Anotherlovelybitofsquirrel · 07/01/2021 19:26

She shouldn't have been there. Zero sympathy.

x2boys · 07/01/2021 19:45

What is terrible is that the president of the USA incited this violence ,he's always been a loose cannon but he's been unstoppable since November ,.

GeordieGreigsButtButtZoom · 07/01/2021 20:05

What did you say, in full?

HypocrisyDoubleStandardsMess · 07/01/2021 20:21

@Imissmoominmama

But... if she hadn’t been climbing through a window, towards senators, during an illegal break in, she’d still be alive...

It is sad that she died, but you can see how it happened.

Agree but...nope, still agree.
Brinksmanship · 07/01/2021 20:22

Everything before the but is bullshit.

Livelovebehappy · 07/01/2021 20:25

Trump certainly played a part in the violence which occurred yesterday, but it’s also a shame that Biden, for weeks last year, refused to condemn the looters and violent protests in Portland. Biden was complicit in condoning the violence with his silence. Neither are fit to run the country. I feel sorry for the Americans that these two were the only choices they had. Regardless, the woman didn’t deserve to die.

HypocrisyDoubleStandardsMess · 07/01/2021 20:25

@Yoshinori

It’s not really terrible that she died is it? How is it terrible ?

She was a white supremacist who decided to invade the Capitol and died as a result. Some argue that that is terrorism.

I doubt if a a BLM protester or a Muslim protester had done what she had done, you would be so quick to say how terrible it was she died.

Of course one shouldn’t be glad she died but it’s why do you feel so compelled to say it’s terrible she died so close to a discussion of the issue ?
“But”

As a POC, I would assume you sympathised with her tbh.

I agree with this too.

She was prepared to die for "revolution". She got her wish.

I'm only sorry for her children if she had any.

OrangeSlices998 · 07/01/2021 20:27

Depends what you said after the but. If you said ‘I’m sorry your Nan has died but I never liked the old cow’ then yes YABU. In this context, I’d be more curious to know what you said next as to whether you were unreasonable. I think if you said something about what she was doing when she was shot, immediately after saying it was sad she died YABU.

Friendswithwhenifits · 07/01/2021 20:28

I had a Scottish boyfriend who put a but at the end of every sentence. It was only when he started putting his butt in other places that he stopped being a boyfriends. Missing the point but..

Chanjer · 07/01/2021 20:29

It’s not really terrible that she died is it?
How is it terrible ?

People getting shot dead generally is, regardless who it is. Something led them there, stupidity or whatever, but people getting shot by the police is not good. I don't find it surprising but I can still think that loss of life is a shame

HypocrisyDoubleStandardsMess · 07/01/2021 20:31

I actually think the sympathy is mainly because she's a white woman. Pretty sure if it was a man, it would be easier to condemn/have no sympathy (Men died too but haven't heard much about them).

ChestnutStuffing · 07/01/2021 20:36

No, it's fine. Obviously if you say something idiotic after the but, it is idiotic, but that is not the fault of the but.

The number of statements that cannot have some level of nuance added usefully to the main statement is very small, if not zero. Most people need to do it more often.

As far as using things like "however" instead, or rephrasing - sure, maybe that would make it seem less objectionable. But I don't think it is really very reasonable to demand that everyone, all the time, needs to speak at the level of a professional writer or philosopher to express their meaning.

I don't think a but necessarily negates an apology, either. To me that is essentially saying that in a conflict one person is always responsible for the entire problem.

HypocrisyDoubleStandardsMess · 07/01/2021 20:39

OP, 'but' is fine. If you're making sense, you're making sense, whether you use 'but' or 'however' or nothing at all. And vice versa.

ChestnutStuffing · 07/01/2021 20:40

@Gliblet

Definitely.

I'm sorry, but...
I'm not a racist, but...
I'm not being funny, but...

Usually ways for people to say the absolute worst thing imaginable at that precise moment but think they haven't done anything wrong because they put their handy little caveat in place first.

As pp have said, its a different beast to 'It's a horrible situation but it could have been so much worse'.

I'm sorry for yelling at you, but you shouldn't have told my mother about our disagreement.

I'm not a racist, but I don't believe in critical theory.

I'm not being funny, but (can't think of anything here off the top of my mind, but I would be shocked if it wasn't the same as the other two.)

Chanjer · 07/01/2021 20:47

Nothing to do with her colour or sex for me. I've been involved in activism and protest for a long part of my life and I sympathize because there's times this could have been me, or people I know, albeit for a polar opposite cause.

I'm not surprised she got shot BUT I think there could have been much better outcomes

Original poster
SkedaddIe · 07/01/2021 21:42

I said 'but I'm surprised the death toll was not much higher'.

My friends are mostly left leaning and definitely pacifist so they assumed I meant the officer firing the shot was reckless but then I clarified that I actually thought the woman and other rioters were reckless.

OP posts:
Original poster
SkedaddIe · 07/01/2021 21:50

I should add that I think the woman was taken advantage of. Ex veterans often have difficulty with MH and are exploited. The video I watched had lots of the other rioters just standing around with selfie sticks while she was bleeding out on the floor. I think she pushed her privilege too far and I think she thought they wouldn't dare fire on her.

OP posts:
LouiseTrees · 07/01/2021 21:50

I think what you said was fine after you clarified with the drip feed.

HypocrisyDoubleStandardsMess · 07/01/2021 21:54

Bingo! Yes, of course..."Mental health issues". Was wondering the first place this would be said. Doesn't get old at all.

Yoshinori · 07/01/2021 23:12

People can often be quick to be concerned about MH issues when a white kid shoots a school or when a white man guns down a mosque but aren't so quick when a young muslim man acts as a suicide bomber.

I wonder why.

Fatladyslim · 07/01/2021 23:40

@Yoshinori

It’s not really terrible that she died is it? How is it terrible ?

She was a white supremacist who decided to invade the Capitol and died as a result. Some argue that that is terrorism.

I doubt if a a BLM protester or a Muslim protester had done what she had done, you would be so quick to say how terrible it was she died.

Of course one shouldn’t be glad she died but it’s why do you feel so compelled to say it’s terrible she died so close to a discussion of the issue ?
“But”

As a POC, I would assume you sympathised with her tbh.

I had this exact same conversation today! If this had been a group of Muslims it would be 100% described as a terror attack. It IS a terror attack! The fact that they are white people should make zero difference.
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