To think this is going to end badly?

[Notthissticky]

COVID related

My work (secondary school) have just confirmed that pupils and staff will be tested using lateral flow tests. This involves self-administering a throat and nose swab. If you're identified as a close contact of a positive case, you can take daily tests and continue to attend school, instead of self-isolating.

Lateral flow tests have a false negative rate of between 30 and 50 percent, depending on who administers them (pupils as young as 11 in our case). So pupils can continue to mix (there's no social distancing in classrooms) after a close contact tests positive, whilst there's a 1 in 2 chance that they're actually positive. AIBU to think that this is going to result in a disaster of epic proportions???

www.newscientist.com/article/2263746-test-caught-just-3-per-cent-of-students-with-covid-19-at-uk-university/

My DC will not be having these tests.

I just worry for the pupils and staff who have to remain at school though, mixing at close quarters with the children whose parents think they are ‘better than nothing’ and have given consent for this testing to replace isolation.

There will be unknown numbers of pupils who have been identified as close contacts and who should be at home isolating, who will be spreading covid around the school.

I've done lateral tests myself in the NHS, they're nasal swabs only and they're not too bad if they are only expected to swab and not do all the other stuff involved. However, yes, the false positive rate is worrying and the self isolation thing is fucking stupid and they could be held accountable for doing something like that.

For those that say their child can’t do it properly: you do know this is NOT the same as the Pcr test up the nose right? This is 2cm in the nose and 4 strokes near the back of the throat on each side.

They said on the webinar today that it was school close contacts. To stop bubbles closing, rather than individuals being off.

So if there were 1000 children in a school and 6 of them were positive (a realistic number),

That's 0.6% - ONS estimates 10 times that number of secondary age kids are positive.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/coronaviruscovid19infectionsurveypilot/24december2020#age-analysis-of-the-number-of-people-in-england-who-had-covid-199*

So that's 30 positive results missed and merrily spreading covid on the bus, at school, at Tesco on the way home and at home.

They are nasal and throat, not nasal only.

@ZoeTurtle

It's not better than nothing, because it will give people false confidence that they're COVID-free and can therefore be less vigilant about distancing etc. Nothing IS better than a significant rate of false negatives.

There was a study of these tests used as they will be in schools, results compared to pcr tests, LF tests identified four positive cases and missed 60. Not difficult to see that those missed 60 thinking they are negative and not isolating if someone in their bubble tests positive will lead to a huge rise in infection.

@lemonysnickett88

I've done lateral tests myself in the NHS, they're nasal swabs only and they're not too bad if they are only expected to swab and not do all the other stuff involved. However, yes, the false positive rate is worrying and the self isolation thing is fucking stupid and they could be held accountable for doing something like that.

Well, these are the tests that schools will be using, which is a nose and throat swab

Personally I wouldn't worry yet - I think BoJo is about to close the schools anyway.

I agree with you. My adult daughter has tested positive today after taking two self test kits at home and them being negative. (Nurse) I work in a school and don’t trust them!

For those that say their child can’t do it properly: you do know this is NOT the same as the Pcr test up the nose right? This is 2cm in the nose and 4 strokes near the back of the throat on each side

DS has significant coordination difficulties including issues with dexterity, grip, and hand/arm tremors. He wouldn't be able to do the test without assistance, namely someone doing it for him, but thats all moot anyway as he won't tolerate anything invasive like this so has already refused to participate in it.

Not my school, and not for vulnerable children or children of key workers. Pretty sure we'll be using the tests.

Lateral flow are nasal only, you can find all the instructions online.

I think people are slightly misinterpreting the figures. So it doesn’t pick up 50% of the positives, however not all contacts will develop the disease, in fact the majority won’t. For example as a household contact you have a 1 in 5 chance of getting covid. So if you’re in contact with 10, 8 won’t catch it, they will test negative. 2 will catch it, one will test positive and one negative, so you’ve effectively missed 1 in 10. The false negative was 30% with high viral loads (which the new variant has but it’s also more infectious).
Possibly it could be used to shorten the isolation period but I don’t think it’s a good idea otherwise. I do support it for screening for asymptomatic people though.

Well it's all academic now. Nobody is going anywhere.

@Perfect28

Lateral flow are nasal only, you can find all the instructions online.

The instructions sent to school were a high nasal swab and throat swab, same as pcr. I don’t know why they’re not the same as I think there’s a low probability of kids doing the throat one correctly!

I don’t know why the NHS staff ones are different

Right so now the lateral flow test schools will be using aren't even the same as the ones currently in use?

It's not academic. Schools like mine will be open, and key worker and vulnerable children will be in school.

@Perfect28

Lateral flow are nasal only, you can find all the instructions online.

This is the poster for schools. You can find that online, too.

@Perfect28

Right so now the lateral flow test schools will be using aren't even the same as the ones currently in use?

They were only being delivered today so maybe, maybe not! The care homes ones are different to the NHS rapid tests

I can't understand why students need to come in to get in to take them. Why can't they do them at home first?

I cannot understand the sense of drawing together crowds, mixing them and then testing for those who will be positive who have just infected everyone else.

Also, where do they wait until the results come through?. Surely, make student do them at home before school,.
Keep self isolation and all the other measures?

The tests have to be done in school. For this testing (not close contact) they can be done during the day at whatever time, just withdrawn from a lesson to swab and then returned while the test is processing. For close contact testing, it should be done before the start of the day and results obtained before they join the class.

@bungleandgeorge I've just sourced the document your screenshot came from. Published in December apparently but I've been scouring the Internet for weeks trying to find any information, how curious... 🤨 So if the student self swabs, is it staff members/volunteers who have to 'process' the tests, so to speak? And where do the students go whilst they await their results? And what if the school doesn't have the non porous floor and suitable space etc etc. So many questions. All of which I think will be redundant at 8pm. I was online today and home and didn't get any information, DH's school didn't seem aware of any of this either. So patchy.

Yep...my 16yo DD is a pretty resilient type but as I understand it if she comes into contact with a positive case it's daily tests for a week.

She has said she'd rather self isolate, and tbh I can't blame her.