Private school & MC kids are going to be away ahead at the end of this pandemic

[Norfolker]

Just that.... I know from my neighbours that the local private has a brilliant set up online. They had sent revision work to be completed over Christmas, most of the kids I know at the private have a sahp... The local outstanding primary near us was also the same with the same type of mc parents as in the private.
Aibvu to suggest kids who don't have that support are the ones who will fall behind or underachieve in the years to come.
My neighbour in the local outstanding comp has said she spent a fortune buying workbooks on amazon to supplement the online provision! I ordered some yesterday but the thought hadn't crossed my mind before talking to my neighbour...

I think re-thinking our education system would be good. I am not convinced that compulsory full time education up to 18 is for everyone nor uni for 50% of the year group.

Some flexibility, technical qualifications to be gained while working would be good. Free re-takes/FE college courses for those affected by the exam situation.

I think the attainment difference is real at the moment and that the school closures will make it worse.

There are studies showing that most children progress at the same speed or only marginally different speed whilst in school. The problem is the holidays where some groups progress (summer camps, parental time, extra work) and the lowest groups actually regress and are worse off when school resumes. Thus the attainment gap widens year on year.

That is why it is crucial to keep the schools open if it can be achieved. The most vulnerable children are likely to stand still or regress. If it certainly only was 2 weeks, I wouldn’t have a problem with it. However, I doubt it will be 2 weeks. And it is very near the very long closure spring/summer last year.

Personally I think getting control of this pandemic will be better for the country’s health, economy AND education.

It’s hard to bite the bullet and take decisive action because everything is interlinked and there will be groups disadvantaged in the short term.

@MothExterminator

I think the attainment difference is real at the moment and that the school closures will make it worse.

There are studies showing that most children progress at the same speed or only marginally different speed whilst in school. The problem is the holidays where some groups progress (summer camps, parental time, extra work) and the lowest groups actually regress and are worse off when school resumes. Thus the attainment gap widens year on year.

That is why it is crucial to keep the schools open if it can be achieved. The most vulnerable children are likely to stand still or regress. If it certainly only was 2 weeks, I wouldn’t have a problem with it. However, I doubt it will be 2 weeks. And it is very near the very long closure spring/summer last year.

Agree with this

Plenty of children were already ‘hobbled for life’ before the pandemic. I teach in one of the most deprived boroughs in London. We as a society can’t even guarantee the basic things a child needs such as not living in poverty. Lack of remote education is the tip of the iceberg for many

Did you read the article? Baltimore is just as or even more deprived than London. The writer makes a strong case that we are ruining these kids chances at education.

Their only route out of poverty is education, this is not ‘tip of the iceberg’ stuff. In the US, this is sadly a more common situation for black children, and it’s smug white liberals doing this to them!

It’s shocking, really

[quote Maldives2006]@MangoFeverDream

If you’re trying to compare 4 months of expecting parents to home Ed to anything WW2 or American segregation you need to look at a history book. It’s deeply insulting to those people that lived through that time.[/quote]
The type of families we are talking about either cannot or will not homeschool their children.

The comparison is not between now and then. It’s between them and their peers who did not experience educational disruptions. So those coming in a few years before/after.

Did you read the article?

There will be a wide difference in support, yes.

Though the way I see it, if my Y7 returns on track or even ahead, that just gives more time for the teachers to concentrate on the kids that need more support. Which happens now anyway - her maths teacher doesn’t say a word to her, instead going to those that need more help. So my workbooks at home are actually helping kids that don’t have them.

I’m surprised that it took a neighbour commenting, after 9 months, for you to think about getting workbooks. They’re not expensive and don’t require technology. They can be well written so they don’t require the parent to teach. Of course, not all kids will take using them alone - or with parental help. And I’m not for one minute suggesting every parent can afford them. But at, say, £10.00 for a book entitled “KS2 Maths” you don’t have to know the curriculum and you don’t have to earn a fortune. So don’t just wring your hands - take responsibility yourself.

I can't believe I'm defending Boris here because I can't bear him, but to those saying he doesn't care about poorer families - he's the one who's trying to keep the schools open. That's surely the only reliable way of reducing the risk of the rich/poor education divide widening. As has been said here and elsewhere, home education is never going to work equally for all families, however well you do it or how much money you throw at it. Boris presumably realises this.

My dc1 was already 6/9 months behind, the gap had been closing (was 9/12 months behind when starting at new school) I’ve done everything within my power to help with this sadly I’m not a teacher. It’s crossed my mind to place dc1 into a private school but Dh is against it. After feb half term I’m going to see about getting a tutor via zoom or something.

I’ve been buying work books using BBC bite size, and I’ve also been teaching them other skills like cooking and have even had both of them helping the doing the food budget.

Sadly I do think we’ve been set up to fail and the government do not give a shit. And I do think the poorer children/families will have suffered the most, which is really crappy.

I am slightly amazed it’s taken a comment from a neighbour for you to realise this

My dc attend a private school. Tbh the gap is very wide in state schools as well.
Stay that all excellent schools seem to be in unaffordable areas to live in (this is why we are on the private route) and secondly if we weren't private we would be paying tutors to homeschool or sign up to a homeschooling online school plus tutors.
Either way money will get around the issues you mention regardless of private schools running.
The other thing to think of is would we rather have a whole country uneducated or some educated and some not,
I am sharing my schools output with state school friends to lessen the guilt. You're right it's not fair but I don't know in many situations where life is fair to the extent some people want it to be and fair shouldn't be 'everyone goes without'.

@annahavana

I can't believe I'm defending Boris here because I can't bear him, but to those saying he doesn't care about poorer families - he's the one who's trying to keep the schools open. That's surely the only reliable way of reducing the risk of the rich/poor education divide widening. As has been said here and elsewhere, home education is never going to work equally for all families, however well you do it or how much money you throw at it. Boris presumably realises this.

Sorry, but Johnson really is not doing this to benefit poorer families. The poorer families are most at risk of having bad covid outcomes as a result of the virus spreading at school.

Johnson really isn't thinking of the poorest at all. If he was, he'd help people on low incomes isolate with sick pay when they have covid instead of forcing them to return to work or lose their wages.

Disadvantaged children benefit from schools being open. There is no way around it.

If he was, he'd help people on low incomes isolate with sick pay when they have covid angry instead of forcing them to return to work or lose their wages

They are eligible for SSP

Yes, but the problem (always, not just now) is that more disadvantaged families are at greater risk of negative outcomes full stop. At greater risk of poor Covid outcomes if Covid spreads. At greater risk of financial hardship if they have to self isolate. At greater risk of losing their jobs if primaries close. At greater risk of educational disadvantage if schools aren't open. I'm not saying that Boris couldn't be doing more for poorer families than he is, in all sorts of ways. But I do think that trying to keep schools open is (at least in part) a genuine attempt to reduce disadvantage. If he was only interested in helping the MC and privately educated, then why wouldn't he shut the schools and let everyone get on with educating/tutoring at home?

It is hard to make everything fair from home life to schooling even if we only had state schools. Some areas have grammar schools and others don't. Some have posh comps in leafy expensive suburbs.

I would be keeping schools open in this even if more people die as that is where the greater good balance lies.

I ordered some yesterday but the thought hadn't crossed my mind before talking to my neighbour...

Why hadn’t it occurred to you until then?

Parental engagement has always been the biggest factor, and it still is. The woman from OFSTED made that very point when she was talking about cutlery.
It’s not about money or class, so, YABU

Why can we not encourage the working classes to do more with their children rather than moan that middle class children's parents are educating them?

Parental engagement has always been the biggest factor

That’s why it’s so awful. Some parents do not have the time or are not committed to their child’s education, which is why we need schools to be open.

Why can we not encourage the working classes to do more with their children rather than moan that middle class children's parents are educating them?

And how do you propose we do that? You can’t force them to be better parents (short of threatening to take their children away)

annahavana
‘I can't believe I'm defending Boris here because I can't bear him, but to those saying he doesn't care about poorer families - he's the one who's trying to keep the schools open. That's surely the only reliable way of reducing the risk of the rich/poor education divide widening. As has been said here and elsewhere, home education is never going to work equally for all families, however well you do it or how much money you throw at it. Boris presumably realises this.’

Boris is trying to keep the schools open, purely so the parents can continue to go to work. Otherwise, the economy will continue to take the hit. And he’s now messed up the UK even more with his World beating Brexit deal.

Boris is a narcissist; he does not care about the spread of Covid within schools.

In order to work out how Boris and his cronies think, start with money/greed/power as the answer and then work backwards.

Sadly, the situation will most definitely continue to get worse during 2021.
Pay more attention to who you vote for, as it looks like we have a few more years of this shit show.

Thank you, I wouldn't vote for the Tories in a million years, and I think extremely carefully about who I vote for. But equally, I don't like the reduction of politics to complete black and white - eg all Tories are totally evil - it's lazy and it gets us nowhere. Does Boris care far too much about greed and power? Yes, undoubtedly. But that doesn't mean that he cares absolutely nothing for anybody else. Yes, I'm sure one of his main reasons for wanting schools open is economic - but it is also true that the hardest hit by an economic recession will be the poorest (fewer jobs, less money for education, health care and the welfare state). Even if you refuse to believe that he has any care at all in his terrible black heart for those less fortunate than himself, it doesn't make sense for the prosperity of himself or his friends (economically or politically) to utterly disregard them. Look who got him back to power last December - the disaffected former Labour heartlands.

I dgaf about Boris and his cronies, but how is this:

Boris is trying to keep the schools open, purely so the parents can continue to go to work

a bad thing? Low-income families need to be in work, and their children need an education, in-person is most effective.

The benefits of universal education are undisputed I thought

I think you’re right op. The affect of the pandemic is going to be much less on children who are already advantaged and much worse for children who are disadvantaged. I don’t think it’s just about the type of school or class but I think it’s about many other things to (availability of parents, issues such as domestic abuse at home etc).

Unfortunately this whole pandemic is likely to lead to greater inequalities in my opinion.

@MangoFeverDream

Parental engagement has always been the biggest factor

That’s why it’s so awful. Some parents do not have the time or are not committed to their child’s education, which is why we need schools to be open.

Why can we not encourage the working classes to do more with their children rather than moan that middle class children's parents are educating them?

And how do you propose we do that? You can’t force them to be better parents (short of threatening to take their children away)

And that is why unpalatable as it is to say it but some people really shouldn't have children.

The pandemic has exacerbated a pre-existing inequality, yes.

I can't afford to send my children to private school. I can afford an hour a week with a private tutor to help him catch up with his weakest subject. And I'm aware that to do so means he is at an advantage to many of his peers - just like he was throughout the previous lockdown when we were able to afford to buy a laptop for his sole use, which many of his friends parents were unable to afford.

The pandemic will create (or exacerbate) a huge amount of inequality right across society. It's frightening.