To think the only way forward now for school staff is to strike in Jan

[OverTheRainbow88]

Sadly, I believe, the only way forward now for school staff in to strike in Jan.

Schools are unsafe, understaffed and not ‘covid secure’. This will get much worse in Jan when people are allowed to meet inside in a 3 household bubble and travel freely around ( in England at least).

'noelgiraffe is not calling for a strike. She never has, not even close. She's only ever asked for the govt to make schools safer'

Yes and a phased return in Jan is one way of 'making schools safer'!! That and mass testing which is not compulsory despite what some folk on here would have you believe.

'I was Looking for a higher rate of death for teachers, than Joe public. But it’s not there, which has to be reassuring..yes?'

Maybe the evil DfE are keeping it secret?

@Flaxmeadow you have moaned and moaned since March about teachers and how we are being SO ridiculous and how everyone else is just getting on with it. You have absolutely no idea and are completely incapable of listening to an alternative viewpoint.
Your issues with teachers are, at this point, clearly personal.

As someone said earlier, I’m annoyed OP has even posted this. I don’t know a single teacher who wants to strike. All this has done has encouraged people to have a go at teachers for being lazy and apparently wanting to stop working AGAIN when all we have done is relax since March. Thanks so much OP.

Even now, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that infection rates are rising rapidly, the NHS is struggling to cope in many parts of the country, and even when it is beyond clear surely, even to the most blinkered amongst us that secondary school children do indeed contract and pass on covid - even now people come on MN and bleat for schools open at all costs.

If the gov had listened to teachers in the first place, and allowed schools to go for blended learning , rotas and mask wearing we would not be at crisis point now. To those school staff who have kept on going in schools, not knowing from one day to the next if there would be a covid case amongst your staff or students I thank you for the bottom of my heart.

I also would like to thank those teachers and other school staff who have patiently and repeatedly come onto MN to voice their concerns and make sensible suggestions about how to keep all children safe. You have faced ridicule and abuse on here from some posters with dignity and (for the most part) calm. Noblegiraffe in particular I would like to thank you - the abuse you in particular have had to face has been ridiculous. I have lost count of the number of times other posters have accused you of saying things that you have not said. Your posts are always clearly explained and sensible.

I hope that all who work in schools mange to have a safe and restful Christmas break.

Why should teachers have to strike? We should all want our schools to be safer, not just teachers. When a teacher has to isolate, pupils do too. We close on Tuesday the 22nd. Our local high school has 120 kids isolating as of last night. Our rate has happen from 85/100000 to over 150/100000 in 7 days. There are now multiple positive cases. I want our schools open but not at any cost.

'Noblegiraffe in particular I would like to thank you - the abuse you in particular have had to face has been ridiculous'

Challenging opinions is not abuse. If you do see any 'abuse' report it.

Schools are essential we all know that. Talk of strikes or having them shut for months on end are the ridiculous comments.

As positive cases are high among some secondary school kids it is then up to parents to ensure they aren’t mixing out of school. Many don't, you only have to look at mn to see how many people flout rules.

Windows open, SD, masks in common high flow areas, handwashing as I've said a million times phased returns in Jan. As 'safe' as many working areas, just give our kids the education they need and deserve and stop the whining.

I'll tell you one thing I noticed, one teacher in the carpark every day deep in conversation with a colleague, stood next to a door with a high flow of kids coming out of all pushing the door with their hands. Why tf don't they say use cuffs of elbows! No hands on doors! We all know the virus lives on hard surfaces for days. If she spent more time on common sense stuff rather than moaning to her pal it would be a way of 'keeping safe'.

@GetOffYourHighHorse your assumption that a member of staff deep in conversation with another colleague is 'moaning to her pal', shows a certain amount of bias here.

It's far more likely that they are having a work related conversation don't you think? Because obviously teachers can't have these conversations with colleagues when they're teaching so they take the opportunity when they can.

Or having a bit of a chat because they are confined to classrooms, or getting some peer support - because their working conditions this year are pretty tough. Or are teachers not allowed to chat to their colleagues.

And it was the kids presumably opening doors with their hands from your description - the teachers were in the car park, their working day not yet started, are you suggesting they should have been reminding kids to use their elbows instead of catching up with each other?

The NHS 'struggle' every single year. This year is no different. With regard to the death rate in teachers. Of course teachers will sadly die of CV19, they arent immune from passing away so saying its because the schools are open - sorry I just dont see the link.

What I think people are worried about should the country go back to online learning is how it went last time and what a lot of the schools ended up doing.

So many examples on this thread of schools disappearing off the face of the earth last time, some teachers deciding to take the whole summer off and stupidly putting endless Facebook posts showing what a jolly good time they are having, parents trying to get hold of someone, anyone to to help them with online learning, some teachers saying they dont have time/dont respond to emails and claiming they have their own children to look after.

It seems that the schools didnt take some personal responsibility here when the pandemic hit, they sat on their hands blaming the government and instead of offering helpful suggestions just downed tools. The Heads themselves know their school scenerio better than anyone, some are old buildings, some are brand new, its not for the government to hand hold them again and again. There were teachers on here blaming their school, their local authority, Boris etc.

Its like the people who heard Boris address the nation back in March who complained that it didnt cover their particular scenario. If he had gone through every different example we would still be listening now!

'your assumption that a member of staff deep in conversation with another colleague is 'moaning to her pal', shows a certain amount of bias here.'

I've heard them! I obviously try not to eavesdrop but if in a similar area it's hard not. Tell the kids not to touch doors with their hands whether it is the start of the day or the end would be more useful than complaining about 'not feeling safe'.

'Or having a bit of a chat because they are confined to classrooms, or getting some peer support'

Good grief. Confined to classrooms?! You see this is why teachers get a rough ride on mn. Of course they can chat to their pals my point being it is silly to wang on that isnt safe whilst ignoring the thing right infront of you, hundreds of kids exiting or entering a building using their probably grubby hands on handles. Cuffs or elbows!

Perhaps everyone who can't work from home should strike?

Perhaps everyone who can't work from home should strike?
Lots of retail staff don't work behind screens and have customers lean over them or stand very close.
Nursery staff (who in preschool often have 24 children so not much less than school) have no protection either.
Priston officers and police are being spat at and attacked.
NHS staff do have protective equipment but some are working with Covid patients all day.
Workers on public transport come in to contact with many people a day several of whom are exempt.
So do you think they should strike too? Or just carry on without all the drama?
I'm not saying it's not shit for teachers, I'm sure it is but what's the answer?
On line learning? We already know that doesn't work.
Extra week off? Okay but what are parents meant to do. And how is that weeks teaching going to get done.
Stop Christmas mixing? People are sick of being away from family and friends (you see on here and on the news just how bad things are for some) so people will mix anyway.
So strke if you like, if you think children's education is worthless if you really think it'll make it difference but don't expect sympathy and understanding when other people also have it so bad.

Neither I, nor noble giraffe, nor the vast majority of teachers posting on MN have called for schools to close. We have asked for them to be safe and for the truth about what it is actually like to be in a school right now to be out there.

I do not support the op in the call for strike action either.

And, in response to the suggestion that teachers tell children not to use their hands on the doors - they probably have told them, dozens and dozens and dozens of times. Do you want them to be told every time? If kids can't stop swinging on their seat after being told for the tenth time that day then I can't imagine the 'don't touch the door handle' instruction for the tenth time is going to make any difference either.

Good grief. Confined to classrooms?! You see this is why teachers get a rough ride on mn.

I’m not a teacher, and if you care to look you’ll see I hardly blindly support teachers - quite the opposite. But yes, the teachers in my kids school are confined to class - they can’t access the staff room, have breaks and lunch in the class room (and they wipe down door handles etc while they’re there). They don’t have opportunities to chat to colleagues the way they usually would. The school have had no Covid cases and no burst bubbles, and I strongly suspect the school regime has a lot to do with that.

@winechateauxjoy

Even now, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that infection rates are rising rapidly, the NHS is struggling to cope in many parts of the country, and even when it is beyond clear surely, even to the most blinkered amongst us that secondary school children do indeed contract and pass on covid - even now people come on MN and bleat for schools open at all costs.

If the gov had listened to teachers in the first place, and allowed schools to go for blended learning , rotas and mask wearing we would not be at crisis point now. To those school staff who have kept on going in schools, not knowing from one day to the next if there would be a covid case amongst your staff or students I thank you for the bottom of my heart.

I also would like to thank those teachers and other school staff who have patiently and repeatedly come onto MN to voice their concerns and make sensible suggestions about how to keep all children safe. You have faced ridicule and abuse on here from some posters with dignity and (for the most part) calm. Noblegiraffe in particular I would like to thank you - the abuse you in particular have had to face has been ridiculous. I have lost count of the number of times other posters have accused you of saying things that you have not said. Your posts are always clearly explained and sensible.

I hope that all who work in schools mange to have a safe and restful Christmas break.

Thank you

Teachers are not balloting for strike action in England. This thread has gone the same way as all the others of this genre. I used buy resources for pupils, my working day didn’t finish until about 9 and night and included at least one day of the weekend. Since I retired my son has since commented on how strange it is to not see me doing school work at the kitchen table during holidays. We do the job, in the main, because it is a vocation, we care, so we put up with a pile of shit from the government, from pupils, from parents. We still try to help. In many cases this is viewed as weakness by those who judge success by money and by the ‘my lack of education did me no harm’ brigade.
If your school did nothing in terms of educating your children during lockdown report them to OFSTED, if an individual teacher didn’t do their job report them to the Head. The vast majority of staff go above and beyond and are as pissed off with them as you are but don’t shove all teachers into the same group. Spend energy ensuring every teacher and pupil has access to IT that is fit for purpose in the classroom and home, that safety precautions are in place, pupils and staff wear masks until testing is in place and weekly. And maybe the government could train and employ a health worker in school clusters to carry out.
(Actually just wanted to tell teacher bashers to fuck the fuck off!)

'But yes, the teachers in my kids school are confined to class - they can’t access the staff room, have breaks and lunch in the class room '

But there's a pandemic and this is common in most work places. They can't (well they do) complain it isnt safe then complain when they have to do things to keep them safe! Before anyone says what's the difference, well a classroom is bigger! Surely easier to sit at the front and keep 2m away than it is in usually cramped staffrooms. It’s reducing mixing. Honestly it's like pulling teeth. It was the 'confined' I was shaking my head at. Such drama.

'they probably have told them, dozens and dozens and dozens of times'

So what! So you on telling them. Even I know teens need constant nagging.

Thats a big reason why so many staff are off with stress in my school.

Behaviour is awful and very little teaching takes place. Were constantly nagging about hygeine, dealing with the ones who spin masks around and flick them at people, and then we have kids with huge amount of anxiety about getting ill as they live with vulnerable people.

Cant remove the frankly dangerous pupils as they have to stay in the bubble.

Teaching has taken a back seat for many groups, its now just crowd control.

GetOffYourHighHorse - Surely they're all set up for live lessons now as we've been on/off for months? I can't imagine giving various year groups different start dates takes that much preparation.

Silly me, of course it'll be a doddle!
How about notifying the parents of vulnerable children that they can still go in?
Working out through contact with parents which children still need to attend as their parents are critical workers?
Working out a rota of staff to cover vunerable/key worker children while still trying to keep year group bubbles separate
Advising parents of the process of getting tests done in the new year.

@GetOffYourHighHorse schools have had all morning today to get the above arranged or can we agree that lastminute.com the DFE could have given them a little more notice that there would be a phased return? Perhaps the DFE were too busy earlier in the week starting the legal action against Greenwich for advising their schools to work remotely until the end of term?

@PheasantPlucker1

Thats a big reason why so many staff are off with stress in my school.

Behaviour is awful and very little teaching takes place. Were constantly nagging about hygeine, dealing with the ones who spin masks around and flick them at people, and then we have kids with huge amount of anxiety about getting ill as they live with vulnerable people.

Cant remove the frankly dangerous pupils as they have to stay in the bubble.

Teaching has taken a back seat for many groups, its now just crowd control.

Precisely! I have a syllabus to crack through before exams. I have to do live streaming of in-class lessons to those self-isolating at home so therefore a bit more careful preparation required to ensure all are on task.

Peeps have to decide what do they want me to be :-

Educator/teacher ensuring syllabus delivered and maximising marks

OR

Social worker/child minder/COVID tester/entertainer

@PheasantPlucker1

Thats a big reason why so many staff are off with stress in my school.

Behaviour is awful and very little teaching takes place. Were constantly nagging about hygeine, dealing with the ones who spin masks around and flick them at people, and then we have kids with huge amount of anxiety about getting ill as they live with vulnerable people.

Cant remove the frankly dangerous pupils as they have to stay in the bubble.

Teaching has taken a back seat for many groups, its now just crowd control.

This is why I feel so sorry for teachers. Teaching shouldn't be crowd control. I blame parents and society for allowing/enabling whatever word suits, the poor behaviour of our pupils.

In many ways, I am sure this is why our schools are so unsafe, and the difference is so marked between private and some states, and some other parts of the world, in particular Asia. The children don't behave. They don't do as they are told, they don't respect teachers, or adults in general.