Has Sadiq gone completely bonkers??

[GroundAlmonds]

How exactly does this make sense?

He wants non-Londoners (drivers) to pay a charge to enter Greater London, because...oh it’s complicated. I’ll link.

He does realise that Londoners drive out of London to wear out non-London roads too, though, right? It’s literally two way traffic.

I would support this, to drive down pollution. As someone who lived in London for 15 years (mostly without a car) and now lives 50 miles away and goes to London quite regularly (by train generally).

Pollution my arse.

They clogged up everywhere with their stupid LTN and the ‘ temporary’ cycle lanes and the pollution in some parts of London it is now worse than ever. He’s encouraged big ecologically unsustainable developments for his own reason.

Now he’s worried about pollution.

The man is batsh-t crazy - in these times business needs trade.

I can't wait to vote for him. The Tories have behaved even more appallingly than normal trying to get their brain free candidate in place.

Nothing would induce me to drive into London if I can get a train.
£3.50 is what many people are happy to spend on takeaway coffee and a cake daily (I expect it costs more than that really), so it’s not exactly a huge amount.

They clogged up everywhere with their stupid LTN and the ‘ temporary’ cycle lanes and the pollution in some parts of London it is now worse than ever. He’s encouraged big ecologically unsustainable developments for his own reason

LTNs were local council decisions @ChardonnaysPetDragon

And you're wrong. The number of people living with illegal levels of pollution has fallen by 94% since Khan became Mayor.

www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/oct/03/dramatic-plunge-in-london-air-pollution-since-2016-report-finds

What is his own reason?

Cheap populism, that’s what.

As a Londoner I am always amazed at how much more people outside London expect to use their cars.

We are in congestion charge so though we get a discount we pay each time we move our car. And charges now extend into the evening and at weekends.

When gong out we make a decision. Is the trip walkable? If not can we get there by Boris bike. Or bus, or tube. (Real Londoners tend not to take tubes - its nicer staying above ground.) Then, and only then, would be use our car.

I have spent a lot of time this summer on the south coast. People use their cars for everything. They seem unable to take kids to school, go to the shops, or even out for a coffee without using the car. I suspect they even drive to the gym.

I don't know if it is as bad elsewhere. If it is, good on Sadiq for causing people to at least think about the impact their car has on others.

I think buses and lorries chugging out toxins - yes - reduce this and make the businesses using polluting vehicles pay for this to change behaviour. I am not entirely sure I believe those statistics - but but - if they are correct then I stand corrected,

Most people I know will walk or take a bus or tube. But there are some times a car is useful - so I think more car club things or more electric vehicle charging stations . Where I live there are 6 ( built up area - so many many houses / flats ) 6 electric charging stations isn't even going to touch the sides if we want to move to electric vehicles,

There needs to be more done, maybe following Cambridge example.

Cambridge, CuriousaboutSamphire? God help London if that's the model. Non-pandemic Cambridge has been gridlocked for years, with terrible air quality in many areas. The Chisholm Trail, designed to get more people out of cars and onto bikes, has somehow managed to cost millions more than its budget. Meanwhile, in the Mill Road area (one of the areas of the city with a horrible pollution problem) the county council has managed to reverse the idea of a low traffic neighbourhood - shutting the main road to car traffic and forcing it into residential side streets, many of which were already accident and pollution hot spots. It's an absolute shitshow.

There was a plan to introduce a congestion charge a few years ago, but local politicians were scared of losing votes. Instead, they do things like spend £2.4m on a 'dutch roundabout' which seems to be little more than an accident-magnet, and waste fuck knows how much on a 'ghost roundabout' that has had zero effect other than to get Cambridge laughed at all over the national news.

London is infinitely better off with Sadiq Khan running things than we are with the idiots in Cambridgeshire County Council.

@Needmoresleep - Ha ha Cross post - we walk / bus / and indeed tube ( we are real Londoners but do occasionally take the tube ) but mostly walking , bicycle or bus ) It is amazing how little we use our car nowadays. Also - lovely to see how local primary school more walking now they have put zig zag lines & no parking signs - rather than massive cars stopping in the road to offload children. Ha ha - I agree with your point @Nomoresleep - I think there are many in London who do not use cars as much as those in other places or those driving in

He’s dreadful. All about virtue signalling but no substance whatsoever.

I remember as a child in the eighties my parents would drive us all to the west end for a meal at our favourite restaurant...I remember parking outside...those were the days

The Tory governments (and the so-called one now) want to reduce central government funding to the London Mayor, partly because he is a Labour Mayor, and partly because it accords with the wish to be seen to 'level up' with the midlands and the north.

So Sadiq Khan or any non-Tory London Mayor has to find income from somewhere. Personally I would end free bus travel for children (except those in low income families) and not have free travel at 60 but at the state pension age.

To be fair, this isn't about Covid or money making or even congestion or pollution.

The government has completely screwed over TfL and has imposed these ridiculous demands on it to raise funds (for example, the extended CC, no more free travelcard, etc) in return for it being helped financially.

He also needs to find ways to raise money and this is one of them.

I don't agree with it, but the blame sits with the government, not him.

@BungleandGeorge

I could never understand why tfl gave so many free concessions. They need to be brought into line with the rest of the country in that regard to increase profits. Most of the country have to run a car because there’s no public transport, any subsidies for public transport have gone and they’ve ceased operating. The elderly or others who can’t drive have to take taxis. I think tfl should receive some subsidies but London can’t always be insulated from what the rest of the country experiences.

There’s a lot in this. Everyone with a London postcode gets a Freedom card at 60. The rest of the country only gets a bus pass when they qualify for their pension. That’s six years per person of free transport that could be saved.

Sadiq Khan't needs to accept that his increasingly unaffordable schemes to give free travel to many groups who have to pay elsewhere in the country are not sustainable and that its simply ridiculous to expect lower paid taxpayers elsewhere in the country to subsidise benefits that they aren't entitled to.

What this lockdown has showed us very very clearly is that we have been wasting a lot of time and resources, not to mention putting the environment in danger, by travelling unnecessarily.
So I am quite happy to for some sort of ban to discourage this post-COVID.

@FatherBuzzCagney

There needs to be more done, maybe following Cambridge example.

Cambridge, CuriousaboutSamphire? God help London if that's the model. Non-pandemic Cambridge has been gridlocked for years, with terrible air quality in many areas. The Chisholm Trail, designed to get more people out of cars and onto bikes, has somehow managed to cost millions more than its budget. Meanwhile, in the Mill Road area (one of the areas of the city with a horrible pollution problem) the county council has managed to reverse the idea of a low traffic neighbourhood - shutting the main road to car traffic and forcing it into residential side streets, many of which were already accident and pollution hot spots. It's an absolute shitshow.

There was a plan to introduce a congestion charge a few years ago, but local politicians were scared of losing votes. Instead, they do things like spend £2.4m on a 'dutch roundabout' which seems to be little more than an accident-magnet, and waste fuck knows how much on a 'ghost roundabout' that has had zero effect other than to get Cambridge laughed at all over the national news.

London is infinitely better off with Sadiq Khan running things than we are with the idiots in Cambridgeshire County Council.

This^. Driving in Cambridge is enough to give you nightmares.

I don't think that £3.50 to drive into London is unreasonable. When I go in with the family, I frequently drive in and park in central London. It's usually at the weekend but even by paying to park and then walking or cycling it's MUCH cheaper than the train for all of us and quicker too. I'd happily pay for them to extend the congestion zone, doesn't seem unreasonable. Also free to park in much of London on a Sunday.

@StatisticalSense - I do think that some subsided transport is OK for people paying more for rent etc in London - but I do have a friend who used her free bus pass to go to an airport for a business class flight. I think there should be an easy & cheap way to say for those pensioners who do not need it - then no free bus pass, but I have to say - for school children - that's OK as not being driven to school . Ah - its hard and visitors and tourists benefit from easy & cheap transport - but the hope is they spend more than we save ( I guess - if they wish to - obviously really easy to visit London with a bag of sandwiches and a few drinks from home )

is it instead of the congestion charge?

my dh works in london and some weekends (once or twice a month) i have to take him in as ironically pt doesnt start early enough to get him in on time

@HoneysuckIejasmine

Is there a link?

I previously lived north of London in home counties. The congestion charge ensured I never took a private vehicle in. The furthest I would drive towards the city would be the IKEA in Edmonton just inside the North Circular. Any further in and it was the train.

Ergo, congestion charge achieved its aim where I was concerned.

Snap

@RandomLondoner

I had to google to find out what you were talking about. Apparently he wants to charge people £3.50 a day to come into London. Presumably this is instead of charging everyone driving inside the North/South circular £15 a day, so it sounds like a relatively modest proposal to me.

He needs to raise vast amounts to pay for public transport, as their finances have been devastated by COVID. Raising it from cars in the area covered by public transport seems like a good idea.

His proposal for charging people to drive in means that people who live in London who might want to drive short distance near their home still can, without paying.

Of course I may be wrong and the £3.50 is on top of an expanded congestion charge, so it's really £18.50...

For more than a decade I paid the congestion charge 5 days a week so I could drive to work. £3.50 sounds like bugger-all to me.

I haven’t rtft but this sounds ok?

Is this just private or does it include business trips, my contractors (and for deliveries) already have to pay premiums so this would kill off much of the business as they’ll start to refuse and have to be reimbursed and that would become an issue for already struggling businesses.