...shrewsbury mat scandal cd have happened to you?

[stovetopespresso]

just watched such a moving interview with Rhiannon Davies,whose baby Kate died as a result of bad treatment. aibu to think that it could have been any of us? my midwife didn't turn up for last dc4's planned home birth, I got "we don't think you're in labour" after 4 or 5 frantic calls. dh delivered him.
for ds2's birth I was fed oxytocin to induce then told there was no midwife to deliver him and the one I ended up with panicked and said she hadn't delivered a baby in 20 years and please could I be quieter. agony. all ended fine but for dc4's experience I was shut down and told I had gone in to labour quickly etc (untrue). so this is not rare i think and I feel so lucky. so sad for the heroes who have had to put up with this sub standard treatment. yanabu= women don't get listened to and it's luck if it works out ok. yabu= let's keeps it as is

Oh god I was in tears watching it earlier. Absolutely heartbreaking.

I was left utterly speechless that they had told women it was their fault their baby had died. What kind of person can look a mother in the eye and tell her that kind of lie.

Based on my own experiences I’d say YADNBU.

Yes, the culture of covering up for staff failures and abuse is endemic in the NHS.

They do not give a shit about the harm they cause. They do not listen to patients. They have no ethics. They are only interested in protecting their own at any cost.

You can pretty much guarantee you will be piled on by NHS workers for saying this btw.

Just to prove the point.

It was the other way round for me, my wonderful midwife picked up on something that would have been fatal to DD2, I am eternally grateful.

@user1936863452 why would she be piled on by NHS workers? Do you not think we see this every day, risk our pins and jobs just by turning up for work? Do you think we WANT to be part of the absolute shambles? Luckily I have never and will never work at that trust.

It’s happening throughout the whole of the NHS, communication is at rock bottom, hierarchy from doctors is ridiculous, there are way to many chiefs! The lies that are told are eye watering!

But us little minions still keep going in, doing our best, and fighting for the women we believe in.

@stovetopespresso Kate and Pippas mums and dads broke my heart with that interview, absolutely devastating and yes you are right it could happen to any family. And it won’t be long until it does unless maternity services gets the massive shake up it needs

my other 2 births were amazing. just so moved at rhiannon's courage (dh and I cried too) and wondering if women generally aren't listened to sometimes. we came near ish to it and wondered whether there's a problem with women not being listened to and maybe ...dare I say it, with the midwife culture? sorry to all the great midwives out there, I know you exist.

Not directly related but I have recently read a book about whistleblowing in the NHS and how whistleblowers are ostracized. It was unbelievable to me how people who are, objectively, awful at their jobs, are protected while those who try and so something about it are vilified. In any job or organisation there should be checks and consequences for people who are found not to be doing their job properly. I'm sure the vast majority of people go into the medical profession to help and care for people and it's so sad how a toxic environment can mean that it is bottom of the list of priorities, and covering up mistakes is seen as more important than learning from them.

I am a (non clinical) NHS worker and I will be the first to say the care I received whilst in hospital giving birth to DS was absolutely shite. This could have easily been me. I was induced for reduced movement and not monitored. I did not see a midwife for near on 24 hours. I was denied pain medication and I have birth on induction suite after essentially being called a liar. It was utterly horrific and had there actually been something wrong with DS which was causing the lack of movement he absolutely would've died before they noticed. I really really regret not complaining. I discharged myself and left as soon as I could.

@OoohTheStatsdontlie tje 'Black box' approach taken by airlines contrasts with the NHS approach
if you are a pilo its ok to say 'I was tired but if that's NHS they have to find someone to blame so everyone closes ranks.

@TrustTheGeneGenie that sounds awful. more or less same here for one of the births which went 'well' for me. appalling and unacceptable.

@OoohTheStatsDontLie

Not directly related but I have recently read a book about whistleblowing in the NHS and how whistleblowers are ostracized. It was unbelievable to me how people who are, objectively, awful at their jobs, are protected while those who try and so something about it are vilified. In any job or organisation there should be checks and consequences for people who are found not to be doing their job properly. I'm sure the vast majority of people go into the medical profession to help and care for people and it's so sad how a toxic environment can mean that it is bottom of the list of priorities, and covering up mistakes is seen as more important than learning from them.

I could well believe this. Where worked the bullying was endemic.

YANBU, I get chills every time I hear these stories as it so easily could have been me and my babies. I was induced with twins, then left on a ward that didn't have monitoring equipment for twins, so they were trying to monitor both babies heart rates with one monitor, and kept wondering why they kept "losing" one of the heart beats.

I knew something was wrong about 7-8 hours after the induction started, but they told me nothing would be happening until the next day. My stomach was rock hard and I had to beg them to examine me to see how dilated I was. They then brutally examined me, bringing me to tears, then asked me why I was crying. I couldn't stop sobbing for the next half hour and had to beg them to listen to the babies heart beats again. They reluctantly did it and a few seconds later the shit hit the fan and I was in for a Category 1 c-section. The induction had caused my womb to hyperstimulate and the first twin was in distress with a low heart beat.

I just wish they'd listened and not let it get to an emergency situation. I knew something was wrong, but they were insistent that the induction would take 24 hours and I just had to lie there like a good girl until they felt it would be time for me to give birth. It still makes me feel sick to think about it.

IMO, midwives should be sacked and the whole midwifery shambles given a complete overhaul. The service that is provided is not fit for purpose. How many women do you know were denied pain relief, ignored during labour or ended up with an emergency section because the MW didn't monitor labour adequately or were just too busy chatting and gossiping with their chums? How many women are told that they are not in labour? How many more babies and mothers need to die before there is a nationwide serious case review? A few patronising words and a promise that "lessons will be learnt" isn't good enough. It's utterly heartbreaking to hear these stories when all the deaths could have been prevented if MWs just paid more attention and carried out their roles with care and compassion.

I have had to have 2 emergency c sections due to the shite care at the hospitals. My first was my DD and my waters went at 4:00AM so I waited for contractions then went into hospital for 7AM. They didn’t believe my waters had actually gone till around lunchtime and they put me on gas and air but then I swear they just left me for hours and hours until I was ready to go to the labour ward apparently this was around 8:00PM that night. They then left me again until I was 10CM and they told me to start pushing I didn’t feel ready but I tried and wore myself out even more. They then wheeled me round to theatre and tried forceps. They then said right c section it is then. I didn’t even feel like it was necessary as no one was in distress or anything.

My son was more critical as he stopped growing at 30 weeks and they did a scan at 32 and 34 weeks and he hadn’t grown at all so they admitted me. They told me they were going to keep him in for another 3 weeks and I had to argue the toss with them to get him taken out. They asked if I wanted inducing even though it would cause a risk to me and a risk to my baby so I told them no I wanted a c section. The smug ass doctor came out to me after and told me how well it went after the surgery and was basically blowing his own horn but then I bled out 5 minutes later.

I am never going through pregnancy again. The first pregnancy no one even picked up that I was suffering with gallstones and I was losing weight. I lost a stone a half during the pregnancy and by the time they took them out I had lost another 2 stone

What they said today about the obsession with "natural" birth struck a chord with me too. All too often you hear "never mind" when someone has to have a c section, as if it's a failure. It doesn't bother me at all that I had one, I just wish they'd recognised the need for it earlier and my daughter didn't nearly have to die for the sake of a "natural" birth.

YADNBU. I think it would help if it wasn't policy to confiscate your notes at delivery. If I have another child I'll be photocopying my notes regularly throughout the pregnancy so I have some evidence should it come to a complaint.

From the experience of a relative, who sued, the culture at Shrewsbury was absolutely appalling as long ago as 1984. I was amazed to read the BBC news piece today about the interim report. It is both heartbreaking and shocking that what was going on then has persisted for so long.

I had two horrific births at Shrewsbury and I wonder how close my babies came to tragedy. I know lots of mistakes were made. I was treated as if I was less than human. I was too traumatised to complain but I wonder if I still can as it was 2012 and 2014. It’s probably too late now.

I hate the way you’re dismissed as though it’s nothing.

With my second I had it agreed at 16 weeks that I’d be having a c sec. I went into suspected pre-term labour and I was regularly asked to consider a vaginal birth. ‘The baby will be smaller’ was bandied about a lot. Every time I said no and was told they’d come back and monitor me in a few hours and it’d repeat. In the end I lost my temper and cried and said there was no way on this earth I was giving birth naturally and forced them to write it on my notes that that is what I’d confirmed. I have no doubt that had I progressed (which thankfully I didn’t) it’d have been’oh you’re doing well’ and ‘it’s too late for a section now’ etc etc.
Incidentally I was down for a c sec because of the utterly horrific time I’d had at that hospital first time round. But my mental state didn’t seem to factor in their plans to force me to have a natural birth.

@Cantholdonanylonger from the sounds of it you wouldn’t be too late. The more people who hold them to account the better. I wish you luck.

This happened to me too. A week before I went into labour a midwife examined me and said she thought my son was back to back, this was written in my notes and I repeatedly told hospital midwives this and was dismissed. I had 36 hours in agony while being told I wasn't in labour. I heard one of the midwives telling another that I was making an awful fuss. Only when they broke my waters did they accept that he was back to back. By then he was in distress and I needed an emergency c section.
Worse, I have scoliosis and my pevis is tilted. All through pregnancy I'd been asking if I could actually give birth-again I was just dismissed and told I should give it a try. Only after my section did a midwife tell me I should have "fought more to be consultant led!" Still my fault, not theirs, whichever way you look at it.
I do feel lucky that me and my son survived. I was severely affected by this and have not had any more children as a result.

My children are grown up now but my recollection of midwifery care is one of incompetence, rudeness and lack of empathy.

My middle pregnancy was high risk and obstetrician/specialist led and the midwives in that team were far far better but they were managed by the consultants and dare I say chatted negligible shit. Sadly the baby died but that was due to nature rather than to medical care.

When I was pg with dd I put my foot down and insisted on consultant led care. I only had a vaginal birth because I was promised the midwives who looked after me would be competent and experienced.

There are so many horror stories and so much lack of empathy something has to be done and I struggle to comprehend how maternity care is so poor.

My antenatal midwife care was shite. Every appointment I spoke about how my pelvis was very painful and I was finding it difficult to walk from about 28 weeks but was never put in the notes and I was never referred to physio, I spoke about how thirsty I was all the time but never got a glucose test, they noted that baby was growing very big but never did a growth scan, I had protein or e.coli in my urine every single appointment but only the first time I was given antibiotics.

I had forceps delivery and baby was 4.2kgs (9lbs 3oz) and I was barely able to walk for 5 months after the birth as my pelvis was seriously painful even when sitting down. They had been in stirrups as I had an epidural and I think they had been pulled too wide. (Because nobody noted that my pelvis was sore and clicked when I moved)

They told me that if I get pregnant again they'll do a gestational diabetes test as baby was so big. When I asked why it wasn't done before as they were noting how big my bump was getting they said that I didn't have any other risk factors i.e. I'm white and a healthy bmi.

I was so cross about all of this and made a complaint but the hospital were unable to go through my notes with me as they had been misplaced.

I had a 52 hour back to back labour, followed by a high rotational forceps birth and major damage to me. I was informed by the obgyn in a very blunt way that I would not be able to carry another child on the morning after and also that my DS may be permanently disabled. I then had 6 months of dual incontinence for which I received no physio or treatment. My DS did get physio for his birth injuries but we both have long term damage. I don’t think my issues were caused by incompetence, just lack of resources on the day. That was 10 years ago in central London and I doubt things have improved. The NHS cannot cope even pre COVID and changes need to be made. I was one of the ‘lucky’ ones that my baby survived but it was touch and go and he will never live independently and I will be his carer for life. I would never have imagined when I got pregnant that this could happen in the 21st century.

I had mediocre care antenatally but quite good care in labour followed by excellent post natal care. Lots of 'dont worry about this, it's nothing' type stuff.

This goes right down to the culture of the NHS, of back covering and blaming complainants. Funny how despite Morecambe bay and now Shrewsbury it is still continues. I'd say it's because it's the bedrock of the NHS to minimise issues and to fail to deal with poor quality staff.

I photographed my antenatal notes before delivery with this in mind. Just in case.

My midwives were almost all fantastic, but I still find the treatment of new mothers pretty appalling. And maternity units do not seem to have been designed with giving birth in mind. I was induced and kept in a ward for almost 24 hours. I’m not shy, but the idea that I was in labour in front of three random men - there with their partners - just blows my mind. I am absolutely convinced it was the lack of privacy and constant activity around me that led to my emergency c section. You need peace and quiet when you’re trying to give birth!