Aibu or is this discrimination? Mask exemption

[Lowhangingfruit]

Got challenged in a pub about not wearing a mask. I have an exemption card, she said it wasn't a big deal just wear one. It's our policy. Then 2 people walk in not wearing masks and walk around and she didn't say a word to them??? So aibu to be pissed off.

And as above I don't think that insurance would cover intentional discrimination. Any individuals acting in a discriminatory manner could be sued in their personal capacity and I would assume the insurance would not cover that.

Its been proven they dont reduce oxygen

Actually they’ve been proven to reduce oxygen but not to dangerous levels for healthy people:

“Preliminary report on surgical mask induced deoxygenation during major surgery” pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18500410/
Our study revealed a decrease in the oxygen saturation of arterial pulsations (SpO2) and a slight increase in pulse rates compared to preoperative values in all surgeon groups. The decrease was more prominent in the surgeons aged over 35.

“COVID-19 prompts Stanford engineers to rethink the humble face mask” news.stanford.edu/2020/04/14/stanford-researchers-reengineer-covid-19-face-masks/

Based on literature and confirmed by our measurements, N95 masks are estimated to reduce oxygen intake by anywhere from 5 percent to 20 percent. That’s significant, even for a healthy person. It can cause dizziness and lightheadedness. For healthy people, these side effects are temporary and usually not an issue. But if you are severely ill and are continuously wearing an N95 mask for several hours at a time, it can damage the lungs. For a patient in respiratory distress, it can even be life threatening.

Even where Stanford “debunks” the “myth” that masks reduce oxygen they are careful to state it doesn’t reduce oxygen for healthy people who are breathing normally.

“Myth: Face masks can reduce oxygen getting to the lungs and bloodstream:
digitalmedic.stanford.edu/myth/myth-face-masks-can-reduce-oxygen-getting-to-the-lungs-and-bloodstream/

“This is not true for healthy people wearing surgical or cloth masks....Masks should not be worn by children under the age of 2 years or by anyone with breathing problems. Remember, if you are healthy and breathing normally, a mask will not lower your blood oxygen levels.”

The mask not lowering oxygen levels only applies to the healthy who are breathing normally. It doesn’t apply to everyone, especially those with breathing problems.

Christ there are some disgusting attitudes displayed on this thread.

I think some of you need to take a fucking good look at yourselves. How dare you sit in judgment of someone else's ability to wear a mask, deciding if their disability passes muster or not!

I've read some disablist shit on here before but this is the worst.

Try to get some perspective: there's still only a tiny percentage of people who have CV right now, fewer still who are asymptomatic, and even fewer of those will also be unable to wear a mask. If you socially distance from anyone not wearing a mask the risk is pretty low. Just as it has been since we started wearing masks. And despite that we're still seeing posts telling those unable to wear a mask they can stay at home. Or they need to try harder to wear one

@loulouljh
So it’s ok for people clinically vulnerable to Covid suffer from anxiety every single day. For people not to see their children or parents for months. It’s all ok. But it’s not ok to ask questions about people not wearing a mask? I wish the “exempt” badges were given only to people with proven health conditions/disabilities so poor staff is not responsible to distinguish between abusers and people who are truly exempt. It’s not ok how it works at the moment.

To go back to the Swiss cheese analogy upthread, people who are genuinely unable to wear a mask due to disability are likely to be at increased risk of becoming seriously ill or worse if they contract coronavirus.

Always interesting when people without masks ignore social distancing and hygiene measures too.

It is these twats that make it more difficult for people with disabilities.

There are very few people who cannot wear a mask as it puts their health truly at risk so I do not understand why so many people are exempt. I think the problem is that some people perceive themselves not to be able to wear a mask and if they really had to, they would find a way. Op I don’t know your individual circumstances so this isn’t aimed at you specifically but I think that’s one of the reasons why it’s an emotive subject and why mask wearers don’t always understand non-mask wearers. As people up thread have said, non-mask wearers have the potential to have an impact on everyone in their vicinity.

I do agree op though that if the person was challenged you, she should have challenged the others too.

People who don’t wear masks are making the choice that their life is more important than anyone else’s

Yes, how fucking dare disabled people think they are important. Those bastards.

If wearing a mask is that much of a problem, stay at home - why do you need to go to pub?

Because a disabled person is still a person and has a right to live their life just as a non-disabled person does.

Shops? Shop online and get a drink whilst you’re at it.

As above, a disabled person has as much rights to shop in person as a non-disabled person does.

Once more the hard of thinking: disabled people are people too

oblada

We are trying to reduce the risk of people contracting Coronavirus, which thankfully, our clients in the real world (as opposed to Mumsnet) actually understand. Anyone wanting to sue us for trying to do so probably doesn't have the best intentions at heart.

PPE is necessary for certain environments. People don't get around that by being exempt. You wouldn't be allowed to walk onto a building site without protection, regardless of your disability, this is no different. It's about safety. How can people not see that?

I am shocked at the level of discrimination towards disabled people. It’s pretty disgusting how some people refuse to accept that God forbid, some people are genuinely unable to wear a mask.

I really hope those companies that are refusing entry find themselves in serious trouble.

I think the problem is that some people perceive themselves not to be able to wear a mask and if they really had to, they would find a way.

I think the problem is that some people perceive themselves to be adversely affected by their disability and if they really had to, they would find a way to not be disabled by it - that is essentially what you are saying. That if disabled people/people with medical conditions really had to then they would find a way to not be disabled/affected.

Its ableist and comes from the same place as people who say things like "have you, y'know, tried being normal?"

For anyone saying disabled / neurodivergent people should just stay inside, you BETTER have not left the house since March. Going outside into the public at all is putting other people at risk even with the precautions, so if you're going to be that sanctimonious about it I expect sheer perfection on your part.

So what do I say to the vet who contracts Coronavirus and becomes seriously ill after I allow someone into our practice who refused to wear a mask?

How do I keep my vet safe, if I truly have no choice but to let that person in?

The mask not lowering oxygen levels only applies to the healthy who are breathing normally. It doesn’t apply to everyone, especially those with breathing problems

Thank you plan

Thats actually confirmed my thinking about my breathing

."You wouldn't be allowed to walk onto a building site without protection, regardless of your disability, this is no different. It's about safety. How can people not see that?" If someone with a disability making wearing the standard PPE impossible works on a construction site/needs access to a construction site then reasonable adjustments would be put in place to allow them to access etc. Such as alternative PPE etc. Same here. If someone cannot wear a mask you have to make reasonable adjustments. Currently the government guidance would suggest that the reasonable adjustment you need to make is to allow them without a mask in unless you can find an alternative suitable compromise. But you cannot point blank refuse the service.

I am exempt but I choose to wear a mask anyway, before anyone accuses me of “bashing” someone for not wearing a mask.

The truth is that the system is open to abuse and regularly is, purely because all anyone has to say is “I’m exempt” and they’re apparently not allowed to be challenged.

There absolutely should be a system to prove exemption, not to the general public, but to those who are enforcing the wearing of masks such as shop assistants, restaurant staff, rail staff etc. Some may say that’s unfair but why? If you have a disability and are entitled to a disability rail card you have to show that rail card when travelling or you don’t get the discount. So why shouldn’t you have to show the mask exemption card if you’re genuinely exempt?

The fact that nobody has to prove their exemption is precisely why so many people take the piss, and why so many people who are genuinely entitled to exemption are not believed.

"People who don’t wear masks are making the choice that their life is more important than anyone else’s"

I get the impression you are very good at doing that yourself.

You can't fully keep anyone safe unless you seal them up in a germ free environment, that's what the Swiss cheese model explains. Each layer of protective measures has holes in it which is why you layer up multiple layers and use them alongside one another. The vet washing hands, wearing their own PPE correctly, and keeping an appropriate distance will lower their risk. One mask exempt customer does not wipe out those other measures. You are being discriminatory and, frankly, I hope you do get sued. I sincerely hope you are not my vet.

"I am exempt but I choose to wear a mask anyway, before anyone accuses me of “bashing” someone for not wearing a mask."

If you can wear a mask you are not exempt.

FoxyTheFox

I hope I'm not your vet too.

I actually find it quite sad that you think its okay to discriminate against disabled people, let's hope you never find yourself disabled and on the receiving end of it.

The hate towards disabled people on here is breath taking.

Yes I am exempt from wearing a mask. I have chronic sinusitis, MRSA, ptsd from childhood sexual abuse, I'm clinically extremely vulnerable due to several Auto immune diseases and being on chemo and biological injections, I have a blue badge.....

...... and I'm supposed to just get the hell on with mask wearing or stay at home? Surely it would be for the greater god to just euthanise me and save the benefit payments too?

How disabled and how many reasons should I have to be mask exempt for you haters? Or should I just get on with the euthanasia ?

@FoxyTheFox
No one here thinks it’s ok to discriminate against disabled people. A lot of people who are suffering from health disabilities will actually benefit from measures reducing virus transmission.
People here are trying to say that there should be a system that requires a proof before an exempt badge/pass is issued. This way people with disabilities will have to show the without sharing their personal information to the staff in shops/pubs/transport etc

The pass*

@Lowhangingfruit

So I'm not allowed to go out and enjoy myself because I can't wear a mask? Just hide indoors for the rest of my life? 👎

It wouldn’t be for the rest of your life, it would be until the instruction is to no longer wears masks in public places. I think that those who are exempt from mask wearing should restrict their outings to essential ones only. We all need to do our bit to get this pandemic over as soon as possible.