AIBU to sue a letting agent for not showing up with keys on moving in day?

[Margerine78]

...This is more a question of could I sue (hypothetically)?

I am moving in a few days, the letting agent has been incredibly uncommunicative and flakey ... They didn't know who I was when I showed up to view, tried to show me wrong flat, sent me tenants fees which are illegal, hasn't got back to me about sorting any pre-move issues that they promised would be sorted pre-move. (This is just a handful of issues).

For the last week, I've been trying to establish if they will meet me on the moving in day at the new house, I have no idea how it works in lockdown and so far radio silence from them.

I like to be an optimist but I have visions of showing up and the agent has totally forgotten and I'm left outside unable to get into new property during lockdown. Hypothetically, if an agent f**ked up on that massive a scale, I could sue right?

What are grounds for the suit? Maybe small claims court.
If you have a signed agreement you would normally go into the office to collect the keys - lockdown makes no difference.
Have you paid deposit and first month? Find out about an office (you must gave correspondence with them with an address).

OP,

Would it be less stressful for you to arrange removals for the day after your rental agreement starts, to give you a bit of breathing space?

Could you stay with family overnight and get the removals to store your stuff too?

You should have your tenancy agreement in advance of moving day so you have time to read, understand and seek legal advice prior to signing this important legal document.

Is the agent a one woman band or are there other offices? If it is just her does she operate as a self employed agent through an umbrella firm like purple bricks? There’s definitely routes to complain if that’s the case. How active is she on social media? If she’s posting regularly then I’d be on those posts asking why you’ve not had a response. Most firms, however small, aren’t stupid enough to risk their reputation by looking totally incompetent on social media. I’d also email her being very clear about your expectations including a timescale for reply and any actions she needs to complete. Who is managing the let, her or your landlord?

@Tessiot

He was trying to make me feel better but it got me on a chain of thought as to whether tenants ever have the legal power to make agents accountable. Some are so sht*

Do a Google on the the "seven types of power" @Margerine78 Sadly, estate agents rest their laurels on Legitimate Power. This is odd as their industry is about to be disrupted in ways they have not seen yet. Their main professional body is not up to speed.

There are other powers you will see. Don't sue, just give the information away to the public by social media against the letting agent, but not the landlord. Don't be aggressive, be subtle. Then your message will stay there.

The landlord may be part of your experience, but you don't know that now. Bank that for later. PM me if your landlord is in Bristol.

Thanks for this, I shall read up on it. I hate feeling powerless. Sadly new place isn't in Bristol but thanks anyway.

I've always had to collect the keys when renting apart from the one time when the landlord met me at the flat. You should have completed all the paperwork before moving in. I don't think this agent is legitimate and I wouldn't be moving until I had all the paperwork. It doesn't sound like you've actually rented this flat. Can you start looking for something else?

Unfortunately, estate agents are not regulated in the UK

Not the worst thing of the Blair government, but on the list in my opinion. Apparently it would reduce competition was the argument for not doing so.

You don’t have a tenancy agreement and the agent is ignoring you. That is not normal. Are you sure you’ve secured this place? My thoughts would be they’ve rented it to someone else. As Badger has said, you get this in advance of moving in and it states the move in date.

Do you need to move out on the same day as moving in?
I’m thinking you could get someone local to pick the keys up a couple of days before you move? Only if you know someone in the new area.

I'd be seriously worried this tenancy was not happening at all OP. No agreement means you have nothing (and certainly no right to sue). The fact she is not returning your calls makes me think she has already let it elsewhere or the landlord has pulled it.

Time to start looking again I think.

Our estate agent and others I know of are open as the housing market didn’t have to close down this time so if they have an office it will be open .

Well they’re on their way to being regulated. The legislation has been passed, awaiting what happens next because there’s obviously a lot to do. Additionally, it’s not true that they are completely unregulated. There are lots of laws they have to abide by and being part of a redress scheme is mandatory to join the Ombudsman scheme. Anyway, irrelevant but it does feck me off a bit to hear people describe estate agents as operating in some quasi-wild west situation when it’s a long way from true.

OP have you paid them anything yet?

@MyGazeboisLeaking

OP,

Would it be less stressful for you to arrange removals for the day after your rental agreement starts, to give you a bit of breathing space?

Could you stay with family overnight and get the removals to store your stuff too?

I did think of that, although I'm moving quite far away, so logistically it might be less stressful to pick up keys than to go back and forth. I'm working full time so it's time off work too. The only real stress is the lack of communication about how I get the keys, I think that's what bugging me. If the agent just got back to me and hadn't worried me by being so flakey, I'd be fine!

I would be seriously concerned that you don’t have a tenancy agreement yet. Surely this needs to be signed before you move in. Have you given the agent any money? Are you sure that this apartment is actually theirs to rent? Smells like a bit of a scam to me. When are you meant to be moving in?

You’re really moving and getting removals without a signed tenancy agreement in place?!

They is madness OP

@MyGazeboisLeaking

OP,

Would it be less stressful for you to arrange removals for the day after your rental agreement starts, to give you a bit of breathing space?

Could you stay with family overnight and get the removals to store your stuff too?

This is actually a brilliant idea, I might see if my removal men will reschedule. Get keys and tenancy agreement, drive back to (current) home, move a few days later. Thank-you!

What @CheshireDing said! I don't think you have actually secured this flat.

@CheshireDing

You’re really moving and getting removals without a signed tenancy agreement in place?!

They is madness OP

That's how it's always worked, pay holding deposit, sign contact on day of moving in, pick up keys. My current agent works that way and they're very above board...but now you have me worried!

I've never signed on the day. I would stop making plans until you have spoken to the agent. Have you paid the full deposit?

Anyway, irrelevant but it does feck me off a bit to hear people describe estate agents as operating in some quasi-wild west situation when it’s a long way from true.

It is very much true. After all you only need ONE Estate Agent to operate in that situation to establish a truth.

There is an Estate Agent in Bristol that is letting properties to unlicensed HMOs. The Estate Agent is very much aware those HMOs are illegal and aware of specific circumstances that make the situation criminal. I shudder to think of young women, similar to the one I know, who has parted money in good faith only to lose it. It could become worse.

There are good estate agents out there. But not all are good. In fact some are bad. That makes it a 'wild west' scenario (your words @BadgertheBodger ) for those who under that gun.

OP, am I right in saying that:

1. You don't think there's an office, and the agent is just one person working alone - and you mostly communicate via a mobile, or email.
2. The agent showed you the flat in person, but seemed really confused over who you were
3. The agent tried to charge you tenant's fees, which aren't legal now and all reputable agencies know that
4. You've had no tenancy agreement and don't expect to have one before moving day

My question would be: have you paid a deposit, and rent in advance? Usually the contract and the payments are linked.

20 years ago, friends of ours viewed a lovely flat that was just a bit below what you'd expect for the area and place itself - a bit of a bargain, but nothing dramatic. As you'd expect, they snapped it up. Paid the deposit, booked moving in fees - they did sign a tenancy agreement, and emailed it across together with the fees.

On the day they were meant to move in, they turned up... and so did four other couples and a couple of individuals. It was a scam and they'd all been played. The person who did it was never caught as the owners were away at the time and it was believed to be someone who'd clocked that, broken in and then had keys cut to do precisely this. In London, so very lucrative.

I'm not saying this is the same. It could just be incompetence. But have you checked the agency out properly - how long they've been going, if they're a registered business, etc? Creating a website isn't difficult. All sorts of scam ones exist, and house deposits plus a month's rent in advance would be very tempting to con artists.

You can sue without a tenancy agreement, though, yes. Contracts can be verbal. The important part in their creation is the offer, acceptance, payment and finally the performance of whatever was agreed in exchange, be that a good or service. Tenancy law largely exists to protect tenants. Landlords and agents can't opt out of responsibility by taking your money, giving you nothing for it, and then relying on their own failure to provide a formal written agreement.

I don't think I'd be moving in. Would be looking elsewhere.

What if you have a leak when you're living there and no one to help? Or other issues.

You want a reliable management company

Oh gosh OP, you really must sort out the tenancy agreement before you do anything else!

I've rented a zillion places, in every case I've signed the lease beforehand to start on a later date.

It's a well known scam to offer to rent the same flat to multiple people and disappear with the deposits.

Another one who thinks you may not be moving in at all. Presumably if you have no tenancy agreement you do not have details of the landlord so cannot find out if the letting is legitimate.

Do you have a receipt for the deposit? Do you know which deposit scheme it is being held in? Do you know anyone who has had any dealings with this agent?

I would be very concerned in your position OP.

I wouldnt arrange anything until you have a tenancy agreement in writing with the fees, rental cost, keys, available from date. If the agent is near your parents can they check that they are still operating and help.

Op I've rented for the last 8 yrs. 3 different properties. 3 different landlords and I've always had and signed a tenancy agreement before moving in.