To wonder if Americans hear spoken English differently?

[LordLancington]

Obv, not meaning that they have different eardrums or something, but more whether they don't have the same contextual associations that we do.

Started wondering this after going down the YouTube rabbithole earlier, as I sometimes do when aimlessly browsing. I watched a couple of UK drill videos out of interest - not at all my cup of tea, but I was interested to see what all the controversy was about.

I was surprised by how many Americans were saying things "can't take this seriously. Talking about stabbing people, but using the Queen's English." Thing is, it was about as far from the Queen's English as I could imagine. Proper London accents with loads of urban slang, and for want of a better term I'd have said pretty 'chavvy'.

I've read before that in studies English people tend to associate the Birmingham accent, for example, with being not particularly bright, and the Scottish accent with being 'authoritative'. However, American people found the Brummy accent as 'melodic' or 'friendly' - something like that.

I don’t think it’s that they/we hear it differently, it’s that we aren’t accustomed to picking up subtle differences in accent the same way.

I’m Canadian (Ontario) and while there might be some difference between how I would speak and how someone on the East Coast of the country would speak, for example, largely everyone around me speaks fairly similarly. That’s held true when I have visited Alberta and that’s a plane ride of several hours away from me. I couldn’t distinguish between how I sound and how most Americans sound either, unless they had a strong Southern accent or similar.

I lived in the UK for a while years ago and when you’re immersed in it you can start to pick up on the differences much more easily. When I first moved to the UK I would’ve said most English accents sound very similar but that changed fairly quickly. While I didn’t know where the accident was from I could certainly distinguish it from the way that the people local to me sounded generally.

I find it fascinating that there can be so much variation between accents! So interesting!

Here are three random drill videos from YouTube. I just don't get how anybody could watch it and not find it threatening. If anything, I find US rap less threatening as it's often funky despite the dark lyrical content. UK drill is most always grimy and depressing sounding.

I’m going to make some massive generalisations here but I am aware they are generalization and don’t apply to everyone -

Americans hear a British accent (any British accent) and contrast it with American accents (any American accents). Americans are more familiar with the stereotypes of upper class Britain (the Queen and Downton Abbey). When they hear a British accent, they assume it is posher than it actually is.

Now for the science part:

William Labov, a professor of sociolinguistics, conducted research into pronunciation and social class in the US. Specifically, rhotic and non-rhotic ‘r’. His conclusions were that the rhotic r is more common in the speech of higher social classes.

Interestingly, despite that being a signifier of US social class, it is not the case in UK where non-rhotic ‘r’s are favoured.

Oh, and all that talk of social class - Labov conducted his studies in the sixties when that was more acceptable than nowadays.

When I first moved to the UK I would’ve said most English accents sound very similar but that changed fairly quickly.

I certainly think this can be the case. However, I had an American mate years ago and he literally couldn't understand my friend from up north. I often had the same thing when I moved to the black country, but that was more the dialect they used than anything - e.g. "you'm" for "you are".

@LordLancington

When I first moved to the UK I would’ve said most English accents sound very similar but that changed fairly quickly.

I certainly think this can be the case. However, I had an American mate years ago and he literally couldn't understand my friend from up north. I often had the same thing when I moved to the black country, but that was more the dialect they used than anything - e.g. "you'm" for "you are".

What is the Black Country? I have a hard time understanding pe OP ple from the northern UK. To be fair they have an extremely hard understanding mine also

The Black Country is an area close to Birmingham. Dudley/Walsall/Wolverhampton etc. To the untrained ear sounds very close to a Brummy accent (don't dare say that to them though 😂) but very distinct due to the dialect - "are you" becomes "am you" etc.

Apparently the Black Country dialect is the closest to original Anglo Saxon dialect and had many Germanic phrases in its origins form - e.g. "housen" for "house".

What is the Black Country?

It's a region in the West Midlands of England. The name refers to heavy industry

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Country

First video is a pretty accurate yam yam accent. Second one not so much but does give an idea of some of the distinct phrases - these were what usually made me scratch my head at first rather than the actual accent.

Tik Tok has a load of videos on this. Really amusing and sometimes wtf ish :)

I heard some famous Tik Tokker doing a Brit accent which was amazing but she was sliding between an Adele type London to a pure Mancunian ...she obviously couldn't hear the difference!

No it was from a South London to Birmingham....she slides seamlessly into one from the other!

Obv, not meaning that they have different eardrums or something, but more whether they don't have the same contextual associations that we do.

well of course they don't have the same contextual associations that you do. That's the point of contextual associations. I am in massachusetts and there are real differences in accents in parts of Boston. You wouldn't hear them because you lack the contextual associations. It took me a while but now I do. I wouldn't think there was anything wrong with you though - just that you didn't live here.

In my experience, Americans can’t distinguish well between an upper class British ‘queens English’ accent and a more working class accent. I knew a guy at work with a Cockney accent that would cut butter - old school London like Michael Caine - and an American colleague described it as ‘posh’ which cracked me up. They really don’t hear social class the way British people do. Partly because there are so many gradations of class in British accents anyway whereas class in the US isn’t so tightly connected to accent in the same way.

I can tell the difference between a Boston accent and a Maine accent.

I can also tell the difference between north Manchester and south Manchester.

It’s just familiarity.

My DH is American and he genuinely has a hard time understanding strong regional accents in the UK. When we watch British TV and someone with an accent speaks fast he gets completely lost. He also has a hard time understanding what’s being said in historical programmes like Downton or Poldark.

I’m the same here though. I’ve got better over the years and can now tell the difference between accents from different states but I still can’t tell the difference between city accents within states, which he can. Some accents are completely impenetrable to me. I often struggle to understand people with thick country accents, especially from Oklahoma, Arkansas and Louisiana.

They hear British accents the way we hear American ones. Apparently there's a difference in accent between the American Midwest and the north and the east etc., but to me they all just sound American!

I had a South African friend who in England was always assumed to be Australian. It’s just about what you’re familiar with as far as accents go.

Kiwis are usually shocked if people pick them correctly instead of as Aussies too.

In my experience, Americans can’t distinguish well between an upper class British ‘queens English’ accent and a more working class accent. I knew a guy at work with a Cockney accent that would cut butter - old school London like Michael Caine - and an American colleague described it as ‘posh’ which cracked me up. They really don’t hear social class the way British people do. Partly because there are so many gradations of class in British accents anyway whereas class in the US isn’t so tightly connected to accent in the same way.

I think this may be it.

I can tell the difference between Obama and a gangster rapper from the Bronx, but some Americans seem to listen to UK mc's from East London like Dizzee Rascal and think they speak the Queen's English.

I mean, I feel like when you hear a guy say "this weed's peng innit, bruv" you'd almost immediately clock them to probably not have been an Eton schoolboy, but if you're not familiar with UK dialect maybe not.

Do any of you ever see a show called The Wire? That blew me away - I could not understand a bloody word. Wild.

I find this genuinely interesting as someone who has lived in the US for 15 years and obviously in lockdown, spent zero time with Brits. I genuinely didn’t think my accent had changed but all of a sudden, NOBODY can understand what the heckI’m talking about half the time. It’s completely bizarre and has never happened before!

Do any of you ever see a show called The Wire? That blew me away - I could not understand a bloody word. Wild.

Funnily enough, I started watching it recently and had to keep rewinding it for the same reason. It was as difficult as Matthew McMumblehey in True Detective.

@Harriedharriet

Do any of you ever see a show called The Wire? That blew me away - I could not understand a bloody word. Wild.

What’s funny is several of the main actors on The Wire are British! Dominic West, Idris Elba, and (Irish) Aidan Gillen.

@Harriedharriet

Do any of you ever see a show called The Wire? That blew me away - I could not understand a bloody word. Wild.

The funniest bit in this context is that Aidan Gillen's American accent is not very good! Dominic West and idris Elba do better.

Americans aren't tuned into the subtleties of English accents, generally. English people often can't tell American ones. I've moved back and forth so I'm fairly good but my husband still has difficulty. He can pick out big ones, but he'd struggle with, say, Philadelphia vs. Baltimore.