To sign up at the surgery as ‘Dr’

[Chocolatebutton43]

I got my PhD two months ago, moved to a new place and signed up to a new doctor’s surgery and dental practice.

Filling in the forms, I got a bit carried away with my new title and ticked the ‘dr’ box! I’ve been doing it a lot lately for silly little things partly ‘cause I’m just happy to have finished and passed my degree and also because I relish that I am no longer defined by my marital status.

But, I now need to visit the surgery and I feel like an idiot. The form also had occupation so the doctor will know I’m not a medical doctor. Is he/she going to think I am a total prat for using Dr outside my work and at the doctor’s surgery of all places? Cringe

I’m bored with the cryptic shit. If you have a point, make it.

I've been through several phases of how to use my title.

When I first got it I was keen to use it everywhere it was novel and I was proud of it.

I then left research and joined the corporate world and it seemed that some people took a dim view of people using titles so I started being selective about when I used it. This also included contexts where I was concerned about it being mistaken for a medical qualification.

More recently, after seeing a number of instances where other female friends have felt pressured not to use their titles professionally (and that it was my female friends who were disproportionately made to feel this way) and also seeing the massive rise in anti-intellectualism in this country I have switched to using my title as a default, unless there is a very good reason not to.

I have a doctorate, I am a doctor and it is not my problem if people get offended or confused by that fact. I have enough discriminatory shit going on being a female scientist to succumb to being shamed into not using my title by disgruntled members of the public.

You are the bore - and not the Dom-style monitor you appear to think you are.

I have never heard of a UK dentist using Dr. I always thought that was a US thing.

That just demonstrates that you are not very observant. Dentists have been allowed to use Dr as courtesy title for about 20 years. A lot do nowadays and number has increased a lot in recent years as more qualify. They all use it at the dental practice I go to. I'm sure people realise that they are dentists not medics.

You are the bore - and not the Dom-style monitor you appear to think you are.

Well that was an edifying little contribution to the thread. Looks like we can all move on now, cheers.

@Belladonna12

I have never heard of a UK dentist using Dr. I always thought that was a US thing.

That just demonstrates that you are not very observant. Dentists have been allowed to use Dr as courtesy title for about 20 years. A lot do nowadays and number has increased a lot in recent years as more qualify. They all use it at the dental practice I go to. I'm sure people realise that they are dentists not medics.

It demonstrates only that you are being rude in that studied Mumsnet manner. 🙄

@TheKeatingFive it's possible that Jane was drawing attention to the fact that whilst I have a PhD, I have been known to swear quite a bit. In which case:
Hi Mum.

[quote MilerVino]@TheKeatingFive it's possible that Jane was drawing attention to the fact that whilst I have a PhD, I have been known to swear quite a bit. In which case:
Hi Mum.[/quote]

Did you miss that it was a medical doctor who made the joke? Most doctors are confident enough in their own position not to be offended by other people having the same title as them. My wife is a medical doctor and I'm an academic in a completely non-medical field. We will happily book things as Dr & Dr. Who the 'real doctor' is has been an ongoing joke for our entire marriage. I promise she's not offended.

I thought it was a Rev Minister who made the joke, but looking back you’re right, it was a MD.

I agree there is generally mutual respect between MDs and PhDs especially within families who have a mix of both (my MD parents regularly address cards to us as ‘Dr and Mrs’ despite my husband choosing not to use his title outside of work, I guess they think it’s respectful to address the envelope in this way). They respect his profession the same way he respects theirs and have many interesting discussions. The use of titles has never really come up though.

I think academics who choose NOT to use their Dr title outside of work have every right to make that decision (without feeling they should use it to promote academia or feminism or educate ignorant people about academia as some previous posters have suggested). If someone is happier being Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms outside of their professional setting what’s wrong with that?

I have many friends with academic PhDs and most stopped using their title outside of work years ago, or never used it. That’s a personal choice. And yes sadly many did have negative experiences using it.

think academics who choose NOT to use their Dr title outside of work have every right to make that decision (without feeling they should use it to promote academia or feminism or educate ignorant people about academia as some previous posters have suggested). If someone is happier being Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms outside of their professional setting what’s wrong with that?

In my opinion that's fine. People should call themselves what they want. People with PhDs should also be entitled to call themselves doctor without being accused of being cringey, pompous or the cause of embarrassment and confusion for using their rightful title.

Hear hear @NerrSnerr.

More recently, after seeing a number of instances where other female friends have felt pressured not to use their titles professionally (and that it was my female friends who were disproportionately made to feel this way) and also seeing the massive rise in anti-intellectualism in this country I have switched to using my title as a default, unless there is a very good reason not to.

So you experienced negative reactions using your academic Dr title, chose not to use it, then felt pressured by the ‘rise of anti-intellectualism’ (and female friends’ negative experiences) so now make a point of using it to counteract this ‘anti-intellectualism’?

Do you think using an academic title of Dr helps counteracts anti-intellectualism?

Or do you think people see it as wearing a badge that says ‘I am more highly educated than you’?

I don’t think there’s a ‘massive rise in anti-intellectualism’ in this country, if anything more people (especially women) are achieving PhDs and Doctorates than ever before. Which means a lot more people have an academic Dr title, including in some very unusual and specialised subjects.

academics who choose NOT to use their Dr title outside of work have every right to make that decision

Well of course. I don't more often than I do.

I don’t think there’s a ‘massive rise in anti-intellectualism’ in this country, if anything more people (especially women) are achieving PhDs and Doctorates than ever before. Which means a lot more people have an academic Dr title, including in some very unusual and specialised subjects.

Historically, once something is on the rise, you do tend to get a reaction against it. The rise in women gaining PhDs doesn't preclude anti-intellectualism - in fact in many ways it makes it more likely.

You can be pleased for someone that they've gained an educational qualification without feeling slighted by that yourself. It's not saying 'I'm more educated than you'. It's just saying 'I am educated'. It doesn't reflect badly on you or anyone else. We can celebrate everyone's achievements.

I think academics who choose NOT to use their Dr title outside of work have every right to make that decision (without feeling they should use it to promote academia or feminism or educate ignorant people about academia as some previous posters have suggested). If someone is happier being Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms outside of their professional setting what’s wrong with that?

Of course they have a right to make that decision. I don't think anyone has said otherwise. A lot of the time it's because they are worried that people think they are boasting by using Dr or pretending to be a medic rather than just because they don't want to use it though.

I can see why your husband doesn't care but he probably never gets asked anyway. It only seems to happen to women because for some reason it is important for strangers to know whether women are married or not. In that context it seems bizarre that anyone would object to using a title that they are entitled to use because of their qualifications rather than give information on their marital status.

I think academics who choose NOT to use their Dr title outside of work have every right to make that decision (without feeling they should use it to promote academia or feminism or educate ignorant people about academia as some previous posters have suggested). If someone is happier being Mr/Mrs/Miss/Ms outside of their professional setting what’s wrong with that?

No-one has said anything different, as far as I can see. I've said I choose to use the title Dr for various reasons. I've never said other people have to do the same thing as me.
Are your arguments always so shot through with logical fallacies? It's hard to tell if you don't realise that's what they are, or you're just deliberately being goady. I choose to use the title Dr. I've never said anyone else with a PhD is also obliged to do so.

Dr Gillian McKeith's route to that title is bullshit. A PhD is a different beast - you weren't the least bit cringe to use it. I loathe people who use it when booking tables in restaurants, though. It always means they're going to throw their weight around.

But it’s their own ignorance that is apparent here. The embarrassment of realising that they foolishly thought every ‘Dr’ is to do with Medicine is all theirs

But many people who are not academics do think Dr means medical doctor. You make the assumption that only ‘foolish’ people don’t realise academics can be doctors.

Perhaps this thread is biased because the majority of posters here have been through academia or come from academic backgrounds. You might get a broader set of responses by putting the question to a wider audience.

Most schools don’t teach about PhDs and doctorates, and many people leave school after GCSEs or A-Levels. They may not move in academic circles or have family members who’ve studied to doctorate level. That doesn’t make them less bright. If they react with surprise, confusion or an ‘ignorant’ question when you tell them you’re a doctor in a non-medical field, is it fair to judge them?

Suppose you chat to a skilled tradesperson and mistake them for a different type of tradesperson? Does not knowing about their field and it’s subtleties or titles make you foolish?

The education system in this country is flawed, people from all backgrounds should be given more opportunities to access higher education. Unfortunately a university education isn’t an option for everyone.

Medical doctors are academics, so I guess they understand and have respect PhDs and Doctorates. And if your degree is in a medical science yes the MD can use more technical language. That makes sense.

I do find academics sometimes live in little bubbles of academia, socialising only with other academics and forgetting that many people in this country haven’t had a university education.

I don’t think there’s a ‘massive rise in anti-intellectualism’ in this country, if anything more people (especially women) are achieving PhDs and Doctorates than ever before. Which means a lot more people have an academic Dr title, including in some very unusual and specialised subjects.

But why has there been this increase unless people are just a great deal more clever these days? If there are more women in this already elevated group, are they now suddenly cleverer than their counterparts in the relatively recent past? How staggering if that is the case.

Regarding the rise in apparently “unusual subjects” does this suggest good ole Drama Studies et al are making inroads into the intellectual zone?

Is all this to be applauded? Really?

Not everyone who has a doctorate lectures - or otherwise works - in a university. Some posters appear not to appreciate that fact. There is such a plethora these days, that some may be doing rather more menial tasks or may even be unemployed. Makes one think there could be an issue and the floodgates have opened.

The education system in this country is flawed, people from all backgrounds should be given more opportunities to access higher education. Unfortunately a university education isn’t an option for everyone.

This was the exact focus of my PhD. So maybe non-scientific research has some value after all 🤷🏼‍♀️

I do find academics sometimes live in little bubbles of academia, socialising only with other academics and forgetting that many people in this country haven’t had a university education.

You do love your sweeping generalisations don't you?
Other than my colleagues I don't know a single person in my immediate or extended social circle who works in academia.

@Janegrey333

Not everyone who has a doctorate lectures - or otherwise works - in a university. Some posters appear not to appreciate that fact. There is such a plethora these days, that some may be doing rather more menial tasks or may even be unemployed. Makes one think there could be an issue and the floodgates have opened.

Of course not. I work in industry ... in a field where PhD is the entry level qualification. What's that got to do with anything?

That many are surplus to requirements. It’s quite simple.

To add, this thread is scattered to them all being “academics”.

@Janegrey333

That many are surplus to requirements. It’s quite simple.

Whose ‘requirements’?