To think that furlough at 80% is FAR too generous.....

[loveyouradvice]

I'm just interested about what others think... I think fine to do this for first three months but really do feel it should be down to 60% or 70% maximum by now....

People on 80% of salary, with no travel or expenses related to working away from home, are really not doing badly .... especially since so much less to spend your money on

It is everyone else I think is having a tough time - whether its kids not getting Free School Meals in holidays, or freelancers or those who've lost their jobs....

I would prefer the "pain" to be shared.... so if on furlough, yes lots of free time and yes, having to tighten your belt a bit....

Would it not be better to pay LESS in furlough - I'm thinking around 65% - and MORE to those who don't qualify but are having a very tough time financially..... ?

I sort of get you OP.

My DH and I both work in an industry that has been largely ignored (live events/arts/film). He is the co-director of a tiny (two man) company and I am freelance. Neither of us have had One Penny since march. We have earned nothing and been given nothing. We had very little savings but now we have none and are getting deeper and deeper into debt. Neither of us qualified for any help (DH because he earned £53K in the tax year that counted so was over the threshold) and me because of a different criteria that I didn't meet. We live in London, have two DC, a mortgage, and one of the highest council tax's in the country. None of our outgoings have stopped and we are completely fucked.

We have both worked hard all our lives to now have nothing to show for it in terms of savings and we are not eligible for any help. I've sold everything we can sell and literally don't know what we're going to do.

So yes, I'd be happy to be on any % of furlough and share with more people.

I'm a limited company business and pay myself the minimum wage, so my monthly wage is now roughly £770pcm I get no other financial help towards my business bills (rent etc...) Im one of the unlucky ones to be closed down but not eligible for a grant. (Yet some businesses are allowed to stay open and get the grant... don't get me started!)
I've considered getting another job but we just don't know when we can go back.

I've always been a working mum and my husband works hard so why shouldn't I be entitled to a little help from furlough when times are tough. Your obviously in a privileged position and don't understand the real term of hard Financial Times.

YABVVVVVU

and I say that as someone who’s DH was unemployed from July until 10 days ago due to covid. He got nothing other than JSA. Did we resent people on furlough, did we fuck. Just because he lost his job, doesn’t mean we felt everyone else should struggle too!

I can’t believe you actually thought that posting this thread was a good idea

I don’t agree with exactly what you’ve said but I do feel that we are no longer in an unprecedented situation and we should giving the scheme much more scrutiny, so many companies and taking the absolute piss and aren’t even bothering to hide it.

Yet some people (DH included) have had nothing.

What I would like to see is those business - like those that are in the hospitality sector who are a risk for spreading the virus stay closed or have much tighter restrictions put on their operations but then be properly compensated - so their employees on 100% plus the current grants the business owners are getting.

Then I’d like to see the Government clamping down on those taking the mick. A friend’s back on furlough again....the large multi-national have been fully operational since mid April and actually sales May-Sept were up yoy on 2019, yet they still had loads of staff furloughed with a skeleton staff working like idiots to keep the show on the road. Everyone who’d been furloughed went back on 2nd (no redundancies - why would they be) now those same people are furloughed again, these are office jobs which can be done from home no problem. It’s absolutely enraging.

@Muchtoomuchtodo exactly, lm burned out at work and so are my colleagues. I’m like fuck me another 6 months of this (minimum!!). Even doing a 37.5 hour week would be the dream but it never is. Part of me is willing to get the flu to get some rest. This week l might even get 2 days off -didn’t for the last few weeks

@cadburyegg it’s just people’s opinions and that’s the point of forums

Of course we are still in an unprecedented situation. And thanks to the government being an incompetent ship of fools we are not coming out of it any time soon.

Oh sorry for the misunderstanding @ComeOnBabyHauntMyBubble

No I definitely don't want people on furlough to struggle. It's just I'd rather we had universal basic income - fairer, and helps to ensure that no one falls through the gaps.

Just think what those billions spent on our failing test, track, and trace could've gone towards...

Oh slightly @SlightlyJaded you need to be shouting and shouting loud this is not right, im so sorry.

Thís is what I was meaning, we’ve had so much time to get it right and make sure everybody affected gets supported and give it a lot more scrutiny.

I think furlough should be the template for any unemployment benefit tbh

@Dumbie

Oh do give it a rest. Most people who are affected are on minimum wage. Even if they're not, there is a cap which impacts a lot of households.

By your logic, anyone wfh should take a pay cut.

I take it you have a lot of disposable income. Lucky you.

^ this. I’ve been v fortunate (fingers crossed), wfh

There is a cap, and most people live on 90/95/all of their salary.
Unless you are fortunate to save 20 pc of salary it would be a struggle, I’d have found it hard when I was younger / earning less. People going into debt/homeless helps no one

Some people will always take the piss, most won’t

I receive a CAR ALLOWANCE... we are still getting that,p. I’d find it reasonable if that benefit went tbh in exchange for wfh once this is over

@laudemio

I think furlough should be the template for any unemployment benefit tbh

Agree: it is in other countries, eg France

Most of the furlough jobs are minimum wage service jobs. 80% is not exactly great for them. I've worked all the way through, doing feel resentful? NO I FEEL LUCKY!!!!! I'm worried about the economy but for once let's try to look after it by looking after the average person in the street. If we can afford to waste billions on Brexit because of stupidity and hatred we can afford to buy some one enough to eat.

@SheepandCow

Do people think it's ok that all those made redundant or who got ill before Covid are left struggling on what's for some just £74 a week (plus some but often not all the rent paid if they're renters)?

Is it ok that they can't pay their mortgage or rent?

Should we not have ensured that no one was left struggling during this pandemic?

Do people - those speaking of struggles to survive financially during Covid related reduced income - support us having a better benefits system, so that everyone who needs support gets it?

I do hope that, this is all over - the concern for those struggling (through no fault of their own) will continue.

Yes . I always have . In voice,in actions and in voting.

I work in a school in a deprived area. We have classes where half the class is on FSM. I see first hand the effects of poverty and struggling on "my kids". That's before we get to the SEN children ,the lack of support,the lack of funding, the lack of specialist provisions etc.
Children going hungry,children going cold, children with ill fitting clothes or with holes, children that are neglected and sometimes put in unsafe situations because the parents work all hours, children struggling in an environment that isn't fit to their needs but there's nowhere else to go. Then we have the other side effects of poverty addiction,homelessness, chaotic home lives ,parents with significant mental health issues,being young carers etc.

It's fucking heartbreaking,which is why I don't understand how pushing even more people in that situation is seen like a solution.

@cadburyegg

YABVVVVVU

and I say that as someone who’s DH was unemployed from July until 10 days ago due to covid. He got nothing other than JSA. Did we resent people on furlough, did we fuck. Just because he lost his job, doesn’t mean we felt everyone else should struggle too!

I can’t believe you actually thought that posting this thread was a good idea

I thought OP's point was... is it not better that some people get a little less - so that everybody gets as much help as possible. As opposed to some people getting support (including some getting relatively high amounts) - and others (also with mortgages or rent) getting very little or nothing at all.

Me and dh were both on 80% pay decrease in the last lockdown. We really suffered. We had savings but with dropped income overnight we knew we had to be as frugal as possible to delay spending all of our savings.
Literally every penny counts when you're living one way and being forced to live a different way all of a sudden.

No we’re not @wewereliars we had nearly 6 months of some variety of a lockdown or another we know the drill ) 6 months is enough data to forecast from, and we we now know which business/sectors have floundered, flourished or carried on as normal and from that we should be able to provide a much more nuanced and targeted approach to the support available. It is just unacceptable for businesses who can operate via home working and who have seen no reduction in revenue to be paying some staff via furlough when some business and individuals who cannot/work or operate are getting nothing.

Or do people think of Furlough as the 'deserving' poor versus non Covid redundancy/illness/disability as 'undeserving' poor.

I've not rtft but wow YABU.
My rent isn't reduced to 80%
My bills will increase not decrease. The heating will be on for longer (unless I spend most of the day with it off to try and save money and then freeze) the electricity used will be more.
Last time we locked down ALL our bills apart from rent and council tax increases as all apart from one of us were at home.
We scraped by financially.
We would have been absolutely desperate on anything less than 80%

@Eng123 they’re not though. Not at all there’s lots of businesses who have remained solvent and can operate via home working who are using furlough to build up their rainy day pot which is absolutely outrageous!

@yellowcatss

People on furlough still pay tax and NI so they're not taking any more from people still working.

NO THEY DONT they get 80 percent of money from the government some of that the government takes back in tax and ni but every single penny they get on furlough is from the government.

Wrong employer are making contributions they have been for a couple of months .

Urgh I see the furlough haters are back. I was furloughed the first time round and luckily got my job back 3 weeks ago. I did NOT have a choice. I was paid 80% of my part-time wage whilst my husband lost his job of 12 years. We have 3 children. We literally kept our heads above water because we had a small amount of savings that are now gone. If they hadn't given me 80% of my salary we wouldnt have got through it. Others weren't as lucky as us so toddle back off on your high horse

I got emergency taxed on my furlough from work. They then decided as the football started back on 1st August that our furlough would end. I haven't had a shift with them at all. So people have went from guaranteed money to nothing. Other than being told they may go on a reserve list for shifts. So how are they meant to live off 65% of nothing?

@BowtieBling
People who got made redundant before Covid also have rent or mortgages to pay. They don't deserve to be left struggling during this pandemic. They matter too.

We should've had a fairer system. Something like universal basic income. Furlough simply reinforced the narrative of 'deserving' claimants/poor vs 'umdeserving'.

@loveyouradvice

My concern is with all those who HAVEN'T had anything like this level of financial support through Covid.... those that have fallen through the gaps and the fact this isn't being changed....So it looks like increasing the HAVES and the HAVE NOTS....

Agree ... moving towards a universal basic income/wage is the way I think we should go

And totally agree no one should be worse on furlough than on benefits... so perhaps I worded that wrongly ... certainly think they should get full whack... just not those who have significantly more

My understanding is that, although we are worse off than most of Europe for unemployment benefit, for furlough we have been paying FAR MORE... indeed Rishi boasted that we were the most generous. That seems wrong to me.

No it isn't you just want to complain that it's too generous you don't give too hoots for those that have fallen through the cracks . Don't make out you have some concern for others at all . Your also implying those furloughed have a choice .