Rule breakers are NOT the reason we’re having another lockdown

[ProfessorInkling]

I don’t think that people who break the rules by eg meeting in a 7 instead of a 6, seeing long-term partners who live elsewhere, hugging their mum or not wearing a mask in the supermarket because while they may not be ‘medically exempt’ it’s still a struggle, are to blame for another lockdown.

Misinformation and misunderstanding however seem rife - the number of threads about people who are told to isolate after contact with a positive case and then not doing so because they get a negative test before the 14 days are up (a wasted test without symptoms), or not isolating for long enough, or isolating ‘except for’ supermarket trips, etc etc.. these are the actions that spread the virus, not making your own risk assessments and using common sense. AIBU?

I'll be honest - I don't see the distinction between the 2 groups you e mentioned.

Agreed. The virus is circulating because we didn't eradicate it and now people are back at work and mixing and going to pubs etc. Masks and social distancing aren't 100% effective and aren't used everywhere all the time, so it was inevitable that cases would rise. But people like to blame...

The virus is circulating because we didn't eradicate it

Eradication of the virus was not the reason for lockdown

As it stands ATM, eradication is impossible. We locked down to slow down the spread and so save the health services from being overwhelmed in a short space of time

It is exactly rule breaking that is spreading the virus and its also people who don't break the rules who are spreading it. If you meet anyone and sit closely and converse with them it can spread. It doesn't matter if that's one person, five or fifteen.
The only way to reduce the spread is to lockdown because people mixing is spreading it.
Is that so difficult to understand? I don't want lockdowns either. I suffered terribly in the first one because of isolation.

I think you are being unreasonable - everyone has a reason why the rules don’t apply to them and oddly enough “using common sense” usually equates to people doing exactly what they want to. I’ve yet to see someone say I want to do X but common sense says I should just stay home.

You have no idea, so don't post threads stating your ill-formed opinions as facts, thanks. Especially when you also say, "Misinformation and misunderstanding however seem rife"

Glass houses.

The government is to blame. For underfunding the NHS, not following the rules themselves, leaving it far too late to introduce measures, leaving many things unclear, and not putting in place a robust testing system.

Maybe not, but it's definitely not reducing infection rates either.

What’s the difference between the 2 groups you have mentioned? Both are increasing the number of connections, therefore increasing instances of virus spread

Wow....op..... have you gone to the scientists and Boris himself with your news??

Ah, it's not the rule breakers, it's the people breaking the rules. Got it. All makes sense now.

The people in your second group would probably say they were making risk assessments and using common sense. Which is why we need rules, but actually it turns out that most people are not that good at "common sense".

The trouble is that often the rules are inconsistent.

How could it be less risky to follow the rules and sit at the same table as DM in a cafe with lots of other people in the vincinity, but be against them to sit at opposite ends of a room in her house over 2m apart.

How could it be less risky to meet 5 other people from different households at the pub, to meeting another family of 4 to go for a walk?

The virus doesn't care about rules. It simply spreads from one infected person to another by close proximity in poorly ventilated spaces. The more people you crowd in together and the poorer the air flow, the more the risk goes up.

Someone following the rules may have a far higher risk of catching the virus than another person who breaks them in low-risk environments with low numbers of people.

By the way, where's the common sense in not wearing a mask because you don't like it, or hugging people from other households?

I don't think the 400+ kids that had a 17 hour rave near us this weekend read the "hands face space" memo.

The virus will always spread whilst people are leaving the house and mixing with others. It doesn’t not spread because you’re in school, university or at work. It also doesn’t not spread when you’re at the pub, in the shop or in a restaurant.

It’s spreading again because we’re not in lockdown. The only way to fully keep it under control is to lockdown until it disappears / until the vaccine is approved. But obviously that isn’t practical, people need to work to earn money and kids need an education. We’re going to have to learn to live with it.

I think YABU. I think it's a mixture of all the little things that 'don't matter' that are the reason for another lockdown. Along with misinformation.

I assume you're in the first group

The government is to blame. For underfunding the NHS

Also this. But on top of this (in regards to the NHS) the public are also to blame for sustained misuse and abuse. As a healthcare professional, I see it on a daily basis. I also see it amongst friends of mine. The NHS needs more funding and resources put in but also less inappropriate use and blatant abuse.

YABU. You can also 'make your own risk assessment' re isolation. I.e. going for a walk in a rural area on day 13 of no symptoms. Are you saying that is more likely to cause spread than not wearing a mask and hugging?!

... considering the anti expert agenda the Government and its supporting press have bombarded the public with for the last however many years, where they have been anti the judges, anti the elite, anti immigrants, anti any kind of scientific experts ... why on earth should they expect the public to listen to 'experts now.

Reap what you sow comes to mind!

example 1 -

[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-39102840]

[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-4192182/World-leaders-duped-manipulated-global-warming-data.html]

I half agree with you because I don’t think it’s people doing things like seeing one extra person or not wearing a mask that is causing this. I think it’s still being spread in hospitals and care facilities more than anything else, and obviously it’s being spread in schools too.

People can’t spread the virus when they don’t have it.

I agree op and I’m getting fed up of all the posts on social media saying “if people followed the rules”, the rules make no sense anyway.

The reason we are in a 2nd lockdown is because people returned to schools and uni’s, people started eating out and shops reopened, it was going to happen when restrictions were lifted. Has nothing to do with Karen secretly meeting with 6 friends instead of 5.

I believe you right. Other people like believing in what they are told by someone in authority. I still follow the law and guidance even though I disagree with some of it.

Covid is a virus and it will act like virus no matter how much people want it it to. The government needs to cough up some more funding for the nhs or fund education sector better. My ds are primary age and lockdown was very hard for us and I’m not saying close down school just come up with better solutions to the problem.

The point is it’s not just one person meeting 7 instead of 6 is it, it’s loads of people doing this, it’s not just one person not wearing a mask whilst shopping it’s lots, and no one knows for sure how the virus is spread, and that new person hugging someone could be asymptomatic and pass it on, so could the non mask wearer

I also agree is those who should be isolating and dont is an issue but the use of ‘common sense’ is fife on MN and if that’s an indication for across the country then it is an issue