AIBU or are the lives of school staff worthless?

[Witchcraftandhokum]

I fully appreciate that the education and mental well-being of children is important but why does it trump the physical and mental health of school staff? The facts are simple, people are being told to stay at home because it is unsafe to do otherwise, unless you work in education or the NHS who are provided with effective PPE.

On a daily basis I am expected to supervise the diner where 150 students eat lunch (obviously mask free) if I wish to eat I am also mask free. I have to supervise the same 150 children in narrow corridors. For this pupils are supposed to wear masks but there are a number who refuse (not the students who are exempt) and we cannot enforce it. We hand out hundreds of masks per week to students whose parents don't ensure they have one with them.

We are not allowed to wear masks in classrooms but are given visors which aren't as effective. The children are not allowed to wear masks in classrooms. None of this are rules imposed by the school but are in-line with the government guidance.

We have students who say they have developed a cough knowing we have to send them home, we cannot make the decision as to whether they are lying or not, but I've been verbally abused by parents calling me "fucking stupid" for not knowing when a child is lying.

Before half-term we had 25% of staff off sick as they had tested positive (including myself). There are many experts stating schools should be shut but Boris has done a fantastic job of insinuating that school staff are lazy and don't want to work, and the early response to the unions concerns shows that this is working. I've never suffered with stress or anxiety but the thought of a return to school tomorrow is making me feel sick.

Talking to colleagues who work in other schools it appears my experience is not unusual. So AIBU to think that this government doesn't give a shiny shit about school staff.

Given that the majority of people on this thread are saying that schools are essential, can we reach a consensus that the government should be funding them properly so that they have more chance of staying open?

Covid costs are coming out of existing school budgets. This includes paying for additional cleaners, hand sanitiser (huge amounts are needed as each child must use it 6X a day minimum), additional photocopying for work packs, leasing iPads to send home with isolating children, buying in programmes at the cost of £1000s for remote learning, lidded bins for each classroom etc etc

In amongst all this what is the DfE doing and where is Gavin Williamson?

I thought people would understand the difference between being taxed on income that has already come from public money and the tax revenue that the private sector raise from scratch that is used to fund public services.

That is all.

My only point is raising it is to demonstrate why it’s important (at a societal level) for private sector workers to be able to do their jobs too.

@stairway

Masks are now compulsory at my son’s school when in lessons. I put my son in a fresh surgical mask every day like many parents. The mask issue appears to be a head teacher issue rather than a government issue. Why aren’t teachers putting pressure on the head teachers who ban masks?

Because some Heads are unapproachable or actively disagree with masks on children or would use any suggestions from lowly teachers as a criticism and would seek to make life difficult for said teacher, people go on 'support' programmers for less, some Heads have Exec heads above them (who are often not visible in schools and again would a teacher fear 'rocking the boat' if they sent an email). In the past I have known heads like this or heads in these circumstances.

@stairway also some teachers don't feel scared by Covid possibly due to young age (teachers in uk have youngest average age in oecd) therefore there may be less adult adherence to promoting Covid safety. Some Heads 'stick by the guidance' because that, and that alone is their legal responsibility.

@echt we are not discouraged but we are not provided ppe and we can't use it in most situations because I'm in the home of very vulnerable people often with communication difficulties. I need to get down and play with the children on their level and I'm in and out of their kitchen and bedrooms etc a mask even if I wear one is not going to do a thing. We are not expecting children and parents to wear ppe when we entre their homes.
I have visited people in isolation and with positive tests because its my job.
In my office we don't wear ppe but share the space.
Its not a race to the bottom but I'm just pointing out that teachers are not the only ones to do this. I'm not complaining because I like my job and if I didn't want to do it and felt that unsafe I'd leave. What's the point in complaining anyway and being dramatic like the op. We still need teachers, prison staff, NHS staff, social workers, retail staff etc etc yes we are in a pandemic but we cannot just grind to a halt and we have to do what's best for society which may mean not wearing masks with children so they can learn.
Just to add teachers wear masks at my childrens school.
Also I work in schools most weeks and have not come across any teachers complaining, in fact they all tell me they are glad to get back to some type of normal in their classroom. It just seems to be in mumsnet.

I teach overseas - nice private international school with big, airy classrooms, a climate that allows for regular use of outdoor spaces on campus for teaching. Small groups - usually

@CorvusPurpureus the school you describe is light years away from my experience of teaching in England. We’re currently in lockdown yet parents at my school still do not have to wear a mask when they enter the school office. We’re not even allowed a visor in the classroom but are expected to sit alongside children for marking and reading and to have a small group around us. This is all allowed due to the government guidance.

The country you teach in seem to have really prioritised education by putting many sensible measures in place. This requires decent funding and student + parental support of the measures.

We have poor guidance and funding in England hence the mess that we’re in now with frequent bubble closures, unequal access to education due to lack of tech for home learning and many school staff feeling at risk in their workplace.

This again.
I'll have your job if you dont want it , I lost mine

@Dontforgetyourbrolly please join us getintoteaching.education.gov.uk

Apply for teacher training then @Dontforgetyourbrolly, probably be a load of vacancies next year for you.

@Cookiecrisps That is a death trap.
No parents are allowed passed the gate here. Even the juniors/p1 the teachers form a line 2 mtrs between them to watch the DC pass. All teachers and parents masked.
My DS SNA has to be close to him she wears a visor and face mask I make sure he is spotless daily hands and nails etc.
Though from previous teacher threads the UK treats teachers awful.
They make the job very hard.

France just announced going to rotas/remote learning for year 11-13 equivalent.

@monkeytennis97 and that’s with all students age 6+ wearing masks in the classroom and all staff too.

I think our secondary schools are ticking time bombs. The DfE, Williamson and the government have wasted the opportunity to make the return to school safer and as a result I can see our secondaries will end up closing never mind going to blended learning. It’ll be at the 11th hour like this second lockdown when so many staff and students have become ill.

I’m so angry that the government haven’t even cared enough to fund hand sanitiser. It’s appalling.

@Cookiecrisps totally agree.

France's death toll is rising sharply 828 today.

O.P is not unreasonable. But, the provision schools make to give adapted teaching is unfortunately variable. Here and elsewhere, there are accounts of some schools, and some teachers, keeping their students enthusiastically engaged by working online, or partly online and attending the school building on an extremely reduced basis, so the building is at most only half full at any time.

It is beginning to seem possible/probable that young and old children and students are not, as once thought, virtually immune from being infected, but are merely asymptomatic, while infected and spreading disease.

Some countries have different ways, including surround-screens, and masks all the time indoors and out.

It does appear that economists and businesses which influence governments tend to view schools mainly as day-kennels to allow parents to go to work. (Which is a peculiarly illogical notion, since the 'day-kennels' have frequent holiday breaks, which would presumably preclude the parents going to work in any case)

Wow, the latest threads on here are making me even more thankful about my decision. Parents complaining about classrooms being ventilated and complaining about being asked to wear a mask.

@Witchcraftandhokum

Wow, the latest threads on here are making me even more thankful about my decision. Parents complaining about classrooms being ventilated and complaining about being asked to wear a mask.

Why are you still reading threads that are so obviously upsetting you? You’ve made your decision. These issues will no longer affect you. It’s healthier to avoid subjects that are clearly causing so much angst.

Why are you still reading threads that are so obviously upsetting you?
You’ve made your decision. These issues will no longer affect you. It’s healthier to avoid subjects that are clearly causing so much angst

It's the OP, so yes they would be reading this thread.

HTH.

@echt

*Why are you still reading threads that are so obviously upsetting you? You’ve made your decision. These issues will no longer affect you. It’s healthier to avoid subjects that are clearly causing so much angst*

It's the OP, so yes they would be reading this thread.

HTH.

Given that the OP mentions ‘Threads’ rather than ‘posts’, one would assume that she’s talking about OTHER THREADS on MN, as opposed to POSTS on her OWN THREAD.

Hth

I'm neither a teacher nor an NHS worker but I'm currently working in public health consulting so have an idea of both sectors.

It's not safe in either. However, the attitudes of the public towards MHS staff and teaching staff is vastly different. The NHS gets sympathy, funds raised to help them, claps, praise and free food delivered.

Teachers get told to shut up, put up and if they don't like it find another job. Well, many many of them will do that and as teaching already has a recruitment crisis, what are you going to do then?

Teachers are highly qualified people with a lot of transferable skills. They aren't the ones who are going to be competing for NMW jobs in supermarkets. There are a lot of jobs out there in the private sector, in tutoring, even in the NHS that teachers leaving the profession are able to do. Their futures are bright. Your children....not so much.

Arf at buying in programs...

So many schools use Google which is free and there is no need to buy in programs.
Oak academy is free... And teaching is part of the paid for requirements.

Some people just have mountains of excuses.. How come some schools afford this and some can't?

Also much of the mask stuff is coming from head teachers.

• we are in a pandemic, I think parents who are don't support ventilation measures should be allowed to remove their dc.. I think parents who don't support masks should also remove the it dc along with parents who are genuinely concerned about the petri dish of schools.

All schools should allow the children to wear whatever clothes they need to keep warm.
Lessons should be tweaked to the allow for movement or time to air classrooms.. Or getting dc out...

Heating should be on in Al schools with the window open.

@SecretSpAD it’s interesting to hear from someone who has experiences of both schools and the NHS.

My long term concern is that my secondary aged children will not have a qualified subject teacher particularly in shortage subjects such as maths and the sciences. It will be because these teachers will just leave as working conditions worsen, choose another career, take early retirement or be forced to go due to ill health.

I think we’ll end up with lots of new trainees in September due to the jobs market but there will not be enough experienced teachers to mentor them and the drop out rate will increase when people realise what they’ve let themselves in for.

Parents will then start complaining that their child is being taught long term by cover supervisors and supply teachers and that they don’t have a qualified teacher teaching their subject. Retention rates were poor in teaching anyway. It will be interesting to see what happens in the long term as a result of the pandemic.

We've had 4 teachers already hand in notice for the end of term. None of them have another job to go to. If I could, I would.
My friends who work in the NHS are telling me the big difference between the NHS and schools is that it's accepted that the NHS isn't 'covid-safe' so ECV and CV staff are moved into non-clinical and telephone roles. Everyone is trying to pretend schools are safe and leaving CV and even ECV staff and children in classrooms, but of course they aren't safe.
We also can't recruit or get supply for the subject specialists leaving. Teacher shortage, unsafe working conditions (which are unacknowledged and therefore not mitigated against) and hate piled on us by the public.
Next term, we'll cover those colleagues roles and work even more overtimetable, set and mark work whilst a TA sits with them because we care about the kids but it will push more of us to breaking point.