If you're in Wales, Scotland or Northern Ireland, do you still feel part of a 'united' kingdom?

[JesusInTheCabbageVan]

I'm in Wales, with family in England. Obviously I've always been aware of the divide (with some aspects more divided than others) but I feel increasingly like I don't even recognise England. It doesn't sound safe, the government is so chaotic it's not even funny any more, and now yesterday. Does anyone else feel like England's handling of the pandemic will permanently and fundamentally change the dynamics of the UK?

In NI and would vote alliance or SDLP but from a unionist background. Neither of the unionist parties endear me to vote for them. Definitely labour leaning in terms of English politics.

Despite being a unionist I feel that a united Ireland is more likely than ever now. Like a previous poster said the cost of living and the loss of the NHS would be my biggest concerns. Im not sure we as a family could afford to live in Ireland. But in my view it has been made apparent that we are not wanted. I mean a lot of people in mainland GB don't even know we are part of the UK. Try to buy something online to post to NI and too many times the reply is sorry we dont post internationally. I mean seriously? The same royal mail delivers to us as the rest of the uk.
We are the forgotten and poor relations and just seen as an inconvenience or nuisance. A few weeks ago parts of NI had the highest cases er 100K in the whole UK. We were over 1000 at one point. Was it mentioned? No. Did Boris and his cronies offer any help ? It astounded me on saturday night that the information valance and whitty were presentingwas so called UK data but it was all england. So what are the scots, welsh and NI supposed to think?

NI, alliance voter though I would vote Labour if I could. Feeling less and less connected to England but do not want a united Ireland for the reasons given by the pp, loss of NHS and price increases. The latter are coming anyway due to Brexshit. I feel like England just wants us to go away and the English still think of us as "other" and an inconvenience as they did decades ago. I also get incandescent with rage at how often I see "mainland only"

I grew up during The Troubles in NI. When I moved to England I was really surprised by how little people knew or cared about it. Most people thought it was part of Ireland. When I think of all the deaths and bombings and fear, and all for the love or loathing of a union that barely knows of its existence, and couldn’t care less about it, I’m baffled as to why anyone in NI would want to be in the UK. It’s like being in an abusive marriage with a raging narcissist.

@Mamimawr

The furlough scheme was refused to Scotland and Wales when needed but extended in a day when England decides to go into lockdown. This is a perfect illustration of how the ‘United Kingdom’ actually works.

I haven't felt part of an 'United' Kingdom for a long time but I didn't believe I'd ever see the strength of feeling for Welsh independence as we have over these last few months.

Yes Cymru (the pressure group for Welsh independence) has seen it's membership triple since March.

A perfect illustration of how the ‘United Kingdom’ works is that when Greater Manchester went into Tier 3, the furlough scheme was only funding about 67% of salaries. Now the whole of England is going into a stricter lockdown (including the South) it’s now 80%.

This government couldn’t care less about any where outside of London and the South East, so don’t think for one minute it’s just Wales.

I'm finding the presumption of England as 'national' on mumsnet increasingly irritating too. Threads are so often started with England rules being discussed as if they are standard, with the op not indicating in the post that they are in England, whereas the non-English nation ops will say. E.g. (this is made up but giving broad example). Welsh op: Will DIY shops close during the Welsh lockdown?', English op 'will DIY shops lose during the lockdown?'. As if English rules are the only rules. I wish English posters would be more mindful of their language when posting.

I'm Scottish and no. I have never felt part of a 'United Kingdom' because it's very clearly not the case. And I genuinely cannot wait for the next independece vote.

When all is said and done, England is divided (between Brexiteers and Remainers, London / SE and “The North”). Wales is equally divided on Brexit and Welsh independence; Scotland is divided on Brexit and Scottish independence. Same scenario for NI.

I’m from a European country but have been in London since I was 24. To be perfectly honest, it feels like everywhere hates London. Scottish and Welsh seem to have this habit of referring to us as “Westminster.” People in other regions of England have huge chips on their shoulders about London. And to be honest - I can completely see why 100%. But increasingly now, when you leave the London, it feels like a foreign country everywhere else. You feel more at home in another mega-city such as Paris and NY or similar - because it’s the same kind of atmosphere, attitudes, lifestyle, diversity of people. I’ve been trying to put my finger in what it is, but I think it can be summed up as this. Everywhere else, there’s this nationalist sentiment. Even if it’s Andy Burnham talking about “the North” as if it’s a different country. The truth is, there are 10 million people in London and they don’t really care about who identifiers as what outside of London. A huge proportion of us aren’t even British, so it’s not as if anyone gives any thought to the ins and outs of the Welsh assembly or NS latest. It’s a divide between those if of with nationalist sentiment (whether this be Welsh, Scottish, NI or the flag/waving Little Englanders) and those if us who are not interested in this kind of sentiment, full stop. We are looking elsewhere (anywhere)!

So yes, there is a massive comprehension gap across the whole of the UK and I can totally see how if you live in Wales, Scotland or NI you would think nobody in London is interested. In particular, NI snd Scotland feel more remote than Europe. It takes me longer to get to Edinburgh than Paris.

All that’s actually happened, is that Wales went into lockdown a few days earlier than England

Nope, Wales has taken a different approach to the pandemic from the outset. It's just that you've only started hearing about it in the last week or so.

“Nope, Wales has taken a different approach to the pandemic from the outset. It's just that you've only started hearing about it in the last week or so.”

But with the greatest respect, so what? And why wouldn’t Wales have taken its own approach anyway? It’s a devolved power! What did you actually expect? I would have been surprised if its approach had been the same. And why would anyone be any more interested in Wales’ Covid strategies - any more than they are interested in what’s going on in France or Spain or anywhere else. Unless you happen to live in Wales, it’s irrelevant. There were different levels of lockdown everywhere.

@quest1on I was responding specifically to a pp (and not the only posted on this thread) who is of the mistaken belief that Wales only started to do things differently to England in the last week or so.

This (and your own post, for that matter) tends to prove the point about the one-way disconnect between England and the other three nations. Whether we like it or not, we tend to be much more aware of what's going on in England at any given time. I would be willing to bet that my 8yo knows more about the England rules than the average English adult knows about Wales! Because, as you say, England just isn't interested in the devolved nations.

Btw I'm not saying the English should know what we're up to. Just that they shouldn't spout bollocks on an otherwise very enlightening and interesting thread about how people who aren't in England feel.

I’m not even English OP. Nor do I identify with my birth country. I used to say I was British, but don’t feel that way since Brexit. Nationalism of any kind doesn’t sit very comfortably with me, personally.

As for “Get off this thread, you’re English” - come on. You know exactly why you started this thread.

There have been several posts from English people on here and I haven't said anything like 'Get off, you're English'.

I haven't said that to you either, although I agree I could have worded my reply better. What I'm objecting to is people in England condescending to us on the basis of something they've actually got wrong.

I started this thread because I wanted to know how other people felt about something that's been bothering me lately, and I wanted to learn something. I'm really glad I did, because it's been eye-opening with many thoughtful and considered replies.

If I had started it to stir up anti-English feeling (is that what you're insinuating?) then I think we can agree I've failed in that. I've seen a lot of anger directed at the Tories, but little or no anti-English feeling.

It's not anti-English to start a thread asking how people outside England feel about the UK.

Well I just think the world has gone mad and it’s all driven by petty, populist politics. Look at America - “America First - build a wall!” And then Brexit here - “Close the Borders Take Back Control.” And inevitably this nationalist sentiment exacerbates Welsh nationalism and NI and Scottish. So much fragmentation and misunderstanding. The entire UK is depressing in so many ways and it’s screwed whether we all fracture into individual nations or not. Personally, we might emigrate (but not to the US)!

I wonder what would happen if someone started a thread asking women to post about, I don't know, their relationship experiences just as an example, and a load of men piled in bitching about why they hadn't been asked to post....

@IncludeWomenInTheSequel

I wonder what would happen if someone started a thread asking women to post about, I don't know, their relationship experiences just as an example, and a load of men piled in bitching about why they hadn't been asked to post....

That does happen all the time though. Its like a red rag to a bull if you post something excluding men.

@IncludeWomenInTheSequel

I wonder what would happen if someone started a thread asking women to post about, I don't know, their relationship experiences just as an example, and a load of men piled in bitching about why they hadn't been asked to post....

Just stick around for a few hours, and you'll get to see ....

No, not only do I not feel part of the Union, in recent years I feel that those of us not in England are being pushed towards some outcome that we haven’t quite grasped yet, and I don’t know what it is or why, but I feel Scottish Independence has widened and been incorporated into somebody’s Project.

Aside from that tin-foil-hatted fear, I’m in Scotland and I lived a quarter of my life in England, where I was constantly having to explain that it’s a country not an administrative region, and that no we don’t hate the English, we just can’t get along with Westminster.

Everywhere you look we’re being characterised as having our caps in our hands, begging for money. We pay in, we have an arrangement whereby Westminster then pays out and we distribute that money according to how the Scottish govt sees fit. A lot of us are keen to cut out the middleman. Of course it’s complicated but those people are routinely put on a par with fascist nationalists in the media - they’re so far from that (mainly!) that it really confuses me. Like, you’re a London journalist...do you not research stuff?

Don’t even get me started on NI. You guys have a great chance to break away relatively cleanly, I hope you do it as soon as you can.

Wales I know it’ll be a long road but I wish you the best.

I feel so sorry for the English people I know who would love not to be ruled like this. I have nothing but good memories of good people.

This is a very interesting thread.

I'm Scottish but have lived in England for 15 years and have an English husband and child. I'd consider myself media-savvy (I work in the media) and reasonably intelligent. BUT when the latest lockdown was announced it took me a whole day to realise the announcement just covered England. I felt so ashamed of myself and how I was viewing things.

If I was still living in Scotland - or even the north of England - I think I'd be so furious about how things have been handled, financially in particular. I was extremely pro-devolution but fairly anti-independence (not that it mattered as I'd lived away too long to have a vote in the referendum) but post-Brexit and especially after the Covid response, I think Scottish independence is probably inevitable and I'd probably vote for it myself if I had a say.

@Zahra2 I think, sadly, the pandemic had been divisive in just about every way you could possibly think of. Not just between countries, but rich/poor, North/South, old/young, men/women, state vs privately educated children, those in and outside London. Fault lines opening up and spreading everywhere. And I don't class myself as a doom-monger usually! (Maybe I should now.)

@everybodysang it's been genuinely eye-opening for me too. I was very much in two minds about starting it as I thought it might turn into a pile-on. Glad it didn't!

@nibdedibble

Haven't felt part of it for a long time. Brexit was just the last straw really. I think it's only a matter of time for Scottish independence now and I'm ok with that.

@JesusInTheCabbageVan and that’s why roughly half of Scotland want independence. Scotland did not vote the torries in in fact the exact opposite and here we again being governed by an English elected party.
So I’d say the English Tory voters have to take responsibility for the fuckshow that is running the UK.
In answer to the original question I am Scottish and not a royalist although will put my hands up as a Gers fan and have never in my entire life felt British or that I belonged/ aligned to the UK.
Interesting when I lived abroad we were described as European which sat better with me.

@everybodysang SH is that you?