It shouldn’t be close the schools, it should be make the schools safer!

[Clearasmuddypuddles]

I am a teacher in a secondary school. I do not want schools to close. But I do want my job to be safer.

How about instead of the pointless campaigning to close schools we actually try and get people to listen to ways that will make it safer.

1. mask wearing compulsory for teenagers even in classrooms. Yes they are uncomfortable and not nice, but it’s safer.

2. cut class sizes in half at least, preferable to groups of 8. Logistics are difficult here, but stripping schooling back to just 3 hours a day, or a one week on one off plan would help with this. Cutting the curriculum to essential content only would also help.

3. clean down desks after every lesson. Ours are done twice a day which isn’t enough.

4. stop students congregating as groups of 100 in the canteen whilst queuing to buy junk food. Provide each child with a pack up that they eat at a classroom desk. No walking around site in large groups.

I would be interest to hear any other ideas people have that would make our schools safer!

Absolutely

Just watching Kier Starmer saying school staff and children should be elevated to priority status equivalent to the nhs with regards to testing.
We need mass regular testing across schools.

Especially when only a small group of children are being sent home when someone tests positive as bubbles isolating is no longer happening. Those classes should all be tested as matter of priority.

Our experience here in France shows that mask wearing in class isn't enough if students have to take their masks off to eat at school.

It's necessary but not sufficient.

(NB: France will have all pupils aged 6 and over wearing masks from tomorrow. It still probably won't be enough).

You need a solution to reduce density in the classroom and more importantly a safe way of feeding children in a well ventilated room with social distancing at lunchtime.

I honestly don't know why governments aren't commandeering closed buildings for this purpose.

We've been calling for this since summer, but have been summarily dismissed by certain Mumsnetters who are simply happy that their children are in school and who literally claim not to care about anything else (I only slightly paraphrase here). Others think that because there have been no cases in their children's school, there aren't case numbers in the teens in other - Tier 1 - areas.

Because it isn't likely to happen, schools will have to close when staffing falls to unsafe levels.

How about instead of the pointless campaigning to close schools we actually try and get people to listen to ways that will make it safer.

My list from another thread:

We could start with an effective test and trace system, which we were told was essential for the safe re-opening of schools, but we opened without.

We could move onto making sure that all classrooms have windows. And then that those windows open. A national WEAR A VEST campaign to stop parents and kid complaining that it's cold. Germany have just invested a large amount of money in improving ventilation in schools, the UK should follow them.

Masks. Why do the government keep insisting they're not needed in corridors (from the comfort of a socially distanced parliament) and that it's impossible to use them in classrooms when the rest of the world seem to manage? What lessons can we learn from the international experience?

Marquees/covers on the playgrounds so that kids aren't inside for wet break. I know that wet break caused a whole year group to be sent home in a local school as it was uncontrolled indoor close contact.

For it to be mandatory (not simply 'where possible') that classrooms are arranged so that teachers are 2m from the kids when teaching. If smaller class sizes are needed to facilitate this, then solutions must be found even if the government needs to pay money for bigger spaces.

Parents to be supported/sanctioned to avoid kids being sent into school with symptoms or when they're supposed to be isolating.

The government to update its list of symptoms for children requiring a test to include the main ones that children experience, instead of the adult symptoms which they mainly don't.

Regular testing in schools, particularly when there are outbreaks, to enable more effective isolation.

Clinically vulnerable kids or kids with clinically vulnerable family members to be allowed the option of staying at home. Schooling could be provided by Oak Academy (why spend millions on it and not use it?) and the army of 'catch-up tutors' to provide feedback on work (or ECV teachers also permitted to stay at home)

I agree. I work for a private school. We have spent thousands on making the place Covid secure. We obviously have the money.

Some of the back office can’t be changed adequately but all of the older children wear masks during all transitions (which are limited) Staff wear masks for all transitions.

Meetings must take place in a room where we can maintain 2 metres or using Teams/Zooms.

We haven’t had a single case but other local
Schools have had multiple cases and bubbles have closed in some.

It’s not cheap but it’s necessary.

Totally agree op, bring class sizes right down, masks for over certain ages, regular breaks for a full airing of the room, get dc and dp on board, allow dp to keep dc at home, esp the ones who feel their darlings are getting too cold, take them out.

Teach on line 2 days, in 3 days or slow learning down and do it on a rota.
Public info film to be played in school showing corona coming out of breath, remind people it's a respitory illness... From breath...

Noble :

They keep insisting based on flawed evidence and data and modelling by Dr jenny harries who said ppe wasn't needed due to facing forward at desks and teachers remaining 2 meters away.

• I had my secondary dd tested after a nasty cold developed into a cough, headache etc.

I was made to feel silly and guilty of wasting a test....

Dr Jenny Harries is very welcome to come and compare her modelling to my Y10 lessons.

The masks thing drives me mad. They should be wearing them.
Reduce hours etc.
My dc's are at different secondaries and one is much better than the other.

There should be mass testing available. Staff prioritised but then all students. Minimum twice per week. Surely that would help enormously.

Parents need to control their kids and stop them mixing outside school or when they're meant to be isolating.

Kids to be sent home immediately for non compliance with cv rules. A lot think it's a joke.

My dds sixth form seem to have done quite a bit to reduce risk.
Part time learning seems to be working ok. Rota system so either y12 or y13 on site but not both together. Biggest classrooms used for year in school, smaller ones for teachers to do msteams lessons for the year at home. Kids encouraged to use empty classrooms to spread out at lunch, and to go home if they have free periods at the start and end of the day. More double lessons timetabled to reduce movement. Masks in communal areas unless eating or at least 2m apart. They have avoided masks in classrooms so far.
Im happy that they have done all they can and would rather they continue if possible. I think having some time in school has made a huge improvement to both my dds motivation and mental health.

These are all great ideas.

Children need regular testing too. Children who are less likely to be affected may also be more likely to be asymptomatic which means no reason to test them. COVID could be spreading silently in schools until it reaches someone who will be worse off.

I completely agree op.

I think extra curricular activities need to stop for longer. Children in my boys classes often do multiple extras in the week where they are meeting indoors with multiple extra groups of 20/30 children.

Our secondary school

• wipes desks every lesson
• compulsory masks in corridors
• marquees for breaks

In my local area what would help a lot was if the schools management teams were following the guidance and not making their own rules up - putting both the teaching staff and the children at risk.

So far, from a number of schools btw, we've had:

• a child should come in at all times unless a family member actually tests positive, school overrides isolation
• no need to test a child with a cough if they normally get winter coughs 🤷‍♀️
• no need to worry if you or your child has been a close contact of someone who was positive if they were asymptomatic (in these cases they were positives found during prescreens for medical procedures)

Also these unworkable and overly stressful ones, where people have felt caught between fines:

• at the end of the 10 days if a test couldn't be taken the child must come into school regardless of the fact the rest of the household is isolating and failure to get them in goes as unauthorised potentially finable absence
• if we tell you that your child needs to isolate but they have siblings you must get the siblings to school, even if the isolating child is too young or unable to be left alone, childcare is not our problem, siblings will be marked unauthorised

Appreciate my area may not be indicative of all areas but if that's happening in just a few areas it's bad enough.

Suppose the long way around saying they shouldn't be overly pressing absence levels this year. And let those who's kids are vulnerable or who live with vulnerable people learn from home if they wish to without dereging.

Yes to regular testing. Every single week. They could nip outbreaks in the bud.

I emailed my Tory MP about this two weeks ago.

I'd like some scientist to actually take a look at the need for wiping desks because every time I look at any modelling about transmission or contact tracing or whatever, it is all about breathing. How many people are actually catching coronavirus from touching stuff?

If we're going to make schools safer, I would like the scientific evidence behind measures - ventilation, masks and social distancing seem to be backed by evidence, whereas people who wash their shopping are derided as overly cautious.
The desk-cleaning schools have massively increased staff (it's usually teachers) workload and I'm not even convinced it's making a difference. It certainly isn't taken into account when doing any contact tracing.

Big yes to enforcing isolation rules when kids are sent home from school. Even on here you see people saying 'I don't think it's a legal requirement so we're going out'.

The big thing is ventilation - lessons should be shortened, windows all opened and after each lesson the room needs to be emptied and aired out before the next lesson.

Reduced numbers so all children in on a rota.

Masks.

Better access to testing and unwell children stay home - covid symptoms are cold symptoms to children with any kind of cough, sore throat, headache or runny nose should stay home.

I agree - I work in a private school and we are doing all this (apart from the masks in classrooms...so far).

@noblegiraffe. I read this week that there is no evidence of any transmission from touching surfaces. At least, that’s how I understood it. Something about for* something transmission. I will try and find the information as I think it was from ONS or PHE and I read a link on the data thread.

I was very interested as I also work somewhere (not a school) where we spend a lot of time wiping surfaces.

I'd be interested in seeing any conclusions from touching shared surfaces as this gives my DD huge anxiety. Her school are not wiping desks between classes which has been a real worry for her.
I have wondered about teaching part time in class and part from home to reduce numbers but I realise that doesn't suit everyone.

@noblegiraffe Thank you for prompting me to look up some Australian research that my mother has mentioned to me.

www.csiro.au/en/Research/Health/Infectious-diseases-coronavirus/Understanding-the-virus/how-long-the-virus-can-survive

Cleaning surfaces does need to be thought through to ensure effort is focussed on things that are most likely to make a difference, and to have routines that are achievable (and allow enough time for these where necessary).