consultant unreasonable, hospital or me?

[thesootherfairy]

Long back story...
After years of pain, finally referred to rheumatology last year. Was diagnosed with an degenerative inflammatory arthritis condition.
Second appointment, same consultant in Feb this year.

Appointment was absolutely awful. he was rude, abrupt, talked over me the whole time. Insisted I take Biologics injections. I had made it clear I didn't want this as I object to the way this medication is made (religious views which were ignored) and side effects are absolutely brutal.
The appointment was a Saturday morning and there was only him, me and a nurse at the other end of a very long corridor.
Halfway through, he locked the door and then became almost abusive because I refused to take dangerous life changing drugs which could potentially kill me or at best make me really sick and rarely work for people with my type of arthritis.
He carried on intimidating me for a good half hour before unlocking the door and letting me go.
He talked over me, part way through stood up from his chair and stood over me whilst berating me. I ended up being frightened because I couldn't get out of the room, he was standing over me pratically yelling at me - I just wanted to leave.
He told me I would only be allowed physiotherapy (the cornerstone of treatment for my condition) if I took part in one of his Biologics clinical trials (am of child bearing age so no thanks to that!)
I made a complaint to the hospital. I received a 3 page apology.
A month after the apology, he wrote to me directly! Completely unrepentant about what happened.
I wrote to the hospital again but received no reply due to COVID lock down etc.
I had a letter in a while ago for a telephone appointment with rheumatology dept. I called the appointments line to check it wouldn't be this man again. I was assured that under no circumstances would he be contacting me again. And that they have 15 other rheumatology consultants and registrars who would take care of me instead.
The phone call was today.
Yes, you guessed it, it was him, again!
He was well aware of my complaints and my wishes not to have any further interaction with him. He said, he "couldn't see what my problem was". I asked to end the call and I had to ask 3 times before he listened (I know, I should just have hung up!). He was very rude and said he would "speak to the powers that be" about me.
I am so upset. Not only was it him again being rude to me.
I also waited 9 months for this appointment and for physio referral. And now I could wait another 9 to 12 months before anything happens, having already waiting 18 months for treatment so far.
Anyway, I'm very upset. So am I being unreasonable? Should I just suck up the rudeness, being ignored and talked over because the NHS is under pressure (covid, money etc)??

This thread is harrowing. I too have been inappropriately treated, spoken to & touched by a Doctor - he’s my GP.

Apparently to change GP’s you need a “damn good reason” (receptionists words) and it gets reviewed by the partner GP’s - obviously he is one of the partners. So I am trapped unless I come up with a “damn good reason”.

Nobody will believe me over him. He’s a dapper blonde GP who appears to be a popular friend and family man.

All of my friends have him too but they describe him as a bit standoffish & patronising - that’s it!

I just know if I tell anyone in real life that he’ll gaslight me.

We only have one doctor surgery here and I have long term health issues so unfortunately - I am trapped!

I do ask for female doctors and it seems to work but he gets involved with any blood results / prescriptions and overrides what the female doctors do!!

OP - have you tried turmeric for your arthritis? Best form to take it is in ''golden paste'' - which is - 1 cup organic turmeric powder, 1/4 cup organic coconut oil, teasp. freshly ground organic black pepper and water - simmered for about 8 mins. Take spoonful it every day.

@metooMe2 its really not hard to change gP. I have no idea why the surgery wont just change your GP? Even if they dont believe you (I do) they cant continue the patient dr relationship once theres been accusations of assault. Its total bs.

@MeTooMe2 - GMC and police!
They’ll listen then.
Please think about it.
The consultant who touched me is (gay apparently) popular, married to a man, funny etc etc.
Ok so I didn’t win, but he has a police record for his DBS checks, a documented GMC investigation which remains on his record forever, and has his Revalidation coming up. If the GMC isn’t happy with his remediation attempts he could be struck off (I’ll be reminding them when it’s coming up).
His colleagues know about him.
Possibly his husband now knows.
Sadly, it’s just the public who doesn’t.
@OP - please think about reporting him

Thanks to you all.
I've drafted another letter to the trusts complaint department. I looked at the local CCG and I could write to them as well.

I'll contact PALS tomorrow.

I feel very angry and upset by the whole thing.

[quote UncleFoster]@metooMe2 its really not hard to change gP. I have no idea why the surgery wont just change your GP? Even if they dont believe you (I do) they cant continue the patient dr relationship once theres been accusations of assault. Its total bs.[/quote]
I am not sure this is correct. Find another GP practice you would like to move to and ask to transfer to them. Last time I moved it was up to the receiving practice to decide if they wanted me. It was nothing to do with the practice I left.

@metooMe2

Oops. Linked the wrong quote. Meant to send it Poster who was trying to change practice.

Oh god that sounds awful. I don’t know why some people in the medical profession are so arrogant and people hating. They can’t cope with people it seems. I hope you never cross paths with him again. He sounds like he’s bloody harassing you!

She just needs to see another GP in the practice though @areallthenamesusedup. Theres really no reason the pratice cant just transfer her care, I have changed GP in a practice. It was simple. Its not even a he said she said scenario. Its not doing any damage to him to swap GPs but could be doing a lot of damage to her. Plus shes given a pretty fucking good reason tbh

I don't suffer from Psa. Its AX Spa. for which most biologics are not effective

The National Society for Ank Spond would disagree - it's own information suggests 8 out of 10 patients with Ank Spond prescribed biologics get a response good enough for them to want to carry on with them.

And yes the pathway they describe is try 2 NSAIDs then biologics.

I am no rheumatologist but there honestly is no benefit in trying all 16 NSAIDs. You try a weak one, a strong one and then really you are done.

You may hate this doctor but he has given you clinically appropriate advice.

nass.co.uk/managing-my-as/medication/biologic-therapy/

My only thought is that if it is a clinical trial - the clinical trials company ought to be interested that one of the consultants is intimidating/ bullying patients to become involved.

If you feel that you are being intimidated and bullied, is it probably likely that other patients are too?

For a clinical trial aren’t the specialists under pressure to sign up as many patients as possible into the trial and don’t they get paid for this.....- i.e. a financial motivation?

No. I've been a specialist signing patients up to a clinical trial - there is precisely nothing in it for you except a large quantity of paperwork and when I managed to sign up zero patients despite them putting in a load of work to our centre, they were not bothered.

@AnnaMagnani
It wasn't about his advice. I only put that in there for back ground.

This was about his behaviour and that after a complaint, he phoned me.

I'm not upset about his medical opinion. I'm upset about the way I was treated and that he was simply allowed to contact me again twice after I complained and expressly asked never to have any dealings with him again.
The local trust has 12 consultant rheumatologists and plenty more registrars. Surely one of them could have taken over my care.
This is what I'm upset about.

Being locked in and unable to leave is a police matter. The matter should also be referred to the GMC.

I do think you are very foolish indeed to take the experience of your neighbours rather than review evidence in its entirety. All medications have potential side effects - it stands to reason, if a medication can do something positive for you, it can also do something negative - and a broad overview of the experience and results of many patients is more illuminating than the layman’s explanation of the experience of two in different circumstances.

Your understanding of the role of anti-inflammatories is also faulty.

However you are entitled to make decisions about your own healthcare, including foolish decisions. The conduct you report is a separate issue and clearly so far from acceptable practice that in my jurisdiction it would certainly result in disciplinary action.

I was prescribed MTX for my autoimmune condition. It was stressed to me that I must not be planning on getting pregnant on this drug.

I now take Cellcept and was also warned about pregnancy and how dangerous the drug is if you are pregnant or trying to get pregnant. So if you are of childbearing age and could be planning a pregnancy, this should have been addressed while discussing the possible treatment.

The part about your story that worried me most, was that he got annoyed with you for not accepting to be part of his clinical trials for the drug. That is a separate issue completely. Being offered a drug for your illness is one thing and you are entitled to refuse it. But trying to bully a patient into a clinical trial that the doctor is connected with in is another entirely and he should have respected your decision on that and backed off. Clinical trials rely on volunteers, not patients forced or bullied in to participating.

On a side note, these drugs can really give back a quality of life and I know they carry risks, but all drugs have their risks.

The Cellcept that I take has a long list of what it can cause and I try not to think about it. But the drug means the difference of me having a next to normal life and for that, I am grateful.

Hard and all as it is, keep complaining. Think about the people you save from him, and eventually, and I'm sorry about that, he might be put in his place.. but if you don't, he'll keep bullying. Somewhere, someone will see the faultline..

This seems a very bizarre thread to me. I find it really difficult to believe a doctor would lock you up in a room and shout at you. Something doesnt seem quite right here....

How cruel and awful.
He should respect your consciousness objection, everyone has the right to choice in health care.
Whilst you're challenging the hospital, have you heard of Mikhaila Peterson? She's the founder of the Lion diet, has lots of interesting research following her idiopathic juvenile arthritis.
Might not help but reading her information has got to be nicer than enduring intimidation from that silly man.

Write asking for a response to your second complaint and then add the third complaint about the telephone call that should have been made by someone else.

Write to your Mp and the director of the hospital with all the issues. Ask them to resolve.

GMC and PALs.

CCG doesn't govern doctors in hospital trusts, I don't think.

And if any woman or man is touched inappropriately/locked in in such circumstances, be as firm and make as much noise as you can to get the attention of others.
I know easier said than done...

It takes a very, very long time on NHS protocols to be offered Biologics.

This is completely right. I'm on a biologic (adalimumab) and it wasn't given to me quickly. I had to satisfy specific criteria (basically be really bloody ill and have a high disease score) before I was considered.

I'm still on MTX (injections) and the other cocktail of drugs. The biologic hasn't been life changing, but I'm better than I was.

I have to be really careful about infections, etc. because of the biologic and it's shafted my immune system more than it is already, but I've had zero side effects and it hasn't changed my life in an adverse way. MTX on the other hand, bugger me, it wipes me out for a couple of hours after shooting up on that!!

I am a consultant in a teaching hospital (in Australia, though) but can tell you that this is completely unacceptable and it is perfectly reasonable that you are upset. He should not have spoken to you like that in the first place, and it is amazing in a bad way that he was allowed to contact you directly afterwards. I would take the complaint higher with the hospital (even consultants have line managers and the hospital should be getting them involved) and you should not have to be treated by him, especially since there are other available consultants to take on your case.

Despite what some of them may believe, consultants are not gods!

Would a consultant really lock someone in with him? If that was really the case you wouldn't be getting an apology letter from the NHS trust, it would be a police matter! If someone locked me in a room with them I would be screaming for help and phoning someone on my mobile phone.

@MoreCookiesPlease

This seems a very bizarre thread to me. I find it really difficult to believe a doctor would lock you up in a room and shout at you. Something doesnt seem quite right here....

Well there are usually two sides to every story...

And on another point, it is very difficult to change GP. In theory, you can go to any GP you like, in practice you have to be in catchment, and if you're not, tough.