Andy Burnham is just showboating now - AIBU?

[1u1a]

Ok, so he wanted £65 million. He was offered £60 million. But is refusing to take it. Then he sets up a press opportunity on the town hall steps, where he feigns shock at stooges showing him the news in their phones and tries to pretend he’s only been offered £22 million - even though he has known full well for hours what the deal is - £60 million- and had been discussing it all day.

I mean I was sympathetic with him at first, but now he is just looking daft. Why does he think “the people of Manchester” are any different to “the people of... “ anywhere else? He is tripping over his own ego and his city needs that £60 million.

He will go from hero to zero very fast if the death toll in Manchester spikes out of proportion compared to elsewhere because he was trying to have his moment. Believe me, I am no fan of this govt, but this is ridiculous now.

I don't want to engage because you're twisting my words, (deliberately?) misinterpreting what I'm saying, and offensively accusing me of things I'm not.

Insulting and plain rude. I wasn't even disagreeing with you about Manchester deserving support, which is the most bizarre part of all of this!

I simply want everywhere else (across the UK - North, South, East, and West) to get support.

People are suffering everywhere. It doesn't harm one area if another also gets support.

You're angry with Westminster MPs, take it up with them.

I can assure you I'm not Boris or Dominic.

Put simply.
Absolutely it's right to ask for support.
But there's absolutely no need to attack other (also suffering) regions.

[quote Hopoindown31]@sheepandcow I think you are mistaking many people in "the regions" constantly getting a shit deal from Westminster and particularly the Tory party for bashing poor people in London. I'm not sure why other than it is an attempt at whataboutery.

London enters tier 2 and the Chancellor announces new support measures, coincidence? Of course we all know he isn't doing it for the poor and deprived of London. They are just lucky they live in the same city as his chums.[/quote]
The tier system is very recent. As soon as it happened, tier 3 areas were offered support packages. Now tier 2 areas have been too (except actually they haven't yet as it's not been detailed properly).

Tier 2 includes very deprived NE areas.

Whether anywhere - tier 2, 3, 1 or anywhere else, has enough is another matter.

It's absolutely fuck all to do with London getting 'special treatment'. As if! Have a chat with the Mayor, Sadiq Khan, and he'll explain to you how London really is not getting support needed.

You think Manchester needs more? Ask for more. No need to bash other areas. It doesn't help anyone.

Btw...Lucky?? Tell that to the people living in the most overcrowded housing in the whole country. As detailed in the article I linked. In any case they don't live in the same area as the chancellor and his chums - who work there but have their permanent homes in the shires and home counties.

AB has embarrassed himself. In his efforts to be hailed as a hero he has made himself look ridiculous to anyone outside Greater Manchester. And I say that as someone who would have previously supported him.

And in fact, that argument is utter (to quote another poster, bollocks). London has been in tier 2 for longer than Manchester has been in tier 3.

A support package was offered to Manchester first. Whether it's satisfactory or not is a separate issue. But clearly London is very much not getting help others aren't. Tier 2 support packages haven't yet been detailed. No idea how much money will be offered.

And like I said. The media might overlook the north east (as usual) but tier 2 is not just London and Birmingham. It's not the fault of London and Birmingham if the media focuses on them and ignores the NE.

I really must get to bed. I'll say it one more time.

Everywhere - across the UK - should get support where needed. That includes non tiered but still economically suffering places like Cornwall.

This thread has derailed my bedtime.
Nevermind. I'd like to make clear. I don't have an issue with the shires or home counties. I point out where the more affluent supposed Londoners live purely for the sake of accuracy and to correct ignorant (often dangerous) misperceptions some people have about London. Dangerous, because the false notion that London is rich (by equating workplaces with homes) makes it easier for those in charge to ignore and dismiss the financial needs of the many very deprived communities in London.

I'm finally very belatedly off to bed! Good thing I don't have an early start in the morning.

The tiered system was always going to cause division in the country. The first lockdown was a national effort, people felt united together. This just isnt the case now and I can only see it getting much worse, no deal brexit and a hard winter with COVID. I am from Manchester. I love this city. As an aside, it makes me sad seeing some news reports still talking about the Hacienda and drugs as though it is our identity here. There is so much more to Manchester than that. There are huge pockets of deprivation and unfortunately, these areas will be hit the hardest if proper support is not in place for Tier 3. £5 million might sound a small amount, but when it is divvied up to those who need it, it might be the difference between eating or not, being cold or not, having a home or not.

It was utter madness to allow all schools and universities go back at the same time here when the rates were still high. Its a huge problem in schools and there has been a large outbreak in one of our university communities. It should have been staggered with supplemental online learning.

I don't blame AB for making a stand. It has demonstrated very eloquently that "working with local leaders" means "telling local leaders". Manchester never really had a choice. Just the illusion of one.

Going full Scargill is not the way to deal with this bunch of lizards, Keir has the right approach. Lull them into a false sense of security then strike.

“Going full Scargill” is the only option though. Because this isn’t just for show - people are going to die because of the poverty being inflicted in Manchester. He’s not single handedly fighting this either btw. Lisa Nandy is doing a damn good job too although obviously it’s suiting the right wing press to quickly paint AB as some kind of Corbynesque figure and hope for the best 🙄

A tually Andy Burnham was fighting for all areas that will eventually be in Tier 3 and this is why.

Yesterday labour put forward a bill to give all areas in Tier 3 a fair economic package for both businesses and low paid workers. It was voted down by a majority of 79. So Tories who voted it down voted to NOT give their constituencies a fair economic package to save businesses and jobs.
Secondly a bill to continue with food vouchers for children on free school meals during school holidays was also voted down by the Tories.
We have had food banks in this country long before Covid and if any of you can survive on a fiver an hour and feed your families and pay your rents mortgages bills etc then you r superhuman because that what those on minimum wage will have to live on in tier 3 lockdown. Most will lose their jobs.
So b4 u fall for the rhetoric of this Government and condemn someone who was fighting for those who have no voice u need to think on exactly what is going on behind the scenes. What the Government offered ALL areas was a shut amount both Liverpool and lancashire were bullied into submission and Yorkshire admits they were offered a very low amount to start with. And the money can only be spent on what the government says it can be done to on mainly businesses and not the workers. U want to thank your lucky stars you have someone fighting yourcir et because here in my area we have a Tory MP who has never ever voted against the Government and was one of them to vote against giving our areas a fair economic package if we have to go into Tier 3. We are a deprived area.

And lastly come February you may fervently wish for someone like Andy Burnham when there is no food in the shops or u can't get yr meds to stand up for you.

South Yorks here. Sheffield City Region Mayor Dan Jarvis. Also Labour, but different approach. Pragmatic, dignified, positive rather than divisive. Doesn't appear nearly as ego driven as AB. Worth watching IMO.

And lastly if u cannot see how Boris is playing one council up against another then u are not only deaf but blind too.

I’m from Greater Manchester and back him all the way. We quietly went into tier two type restrictions back in July... our businesses never really got going again and many are lost or on their knees from the numbers were ridiculously low and he agreed to do it with I presume the thinking it would help keep the covid cases down. It hasn’t, yes some don’t follow restrictions but like everywhere including the south the large bulk of us do. This virus is spreading in schools/education and washed under the carpet. But did the restrictions work? Nope!

The government are now trying to divide the council leaders and pick them off one by one for funding individually. It’s an absolute shit
Show. No Manchester isn’t special but this could be happening in your areas very soon and wouldn’t you want someone fighting for the best deal for the lowest paid?

Andy has always like a bit of limelight but I’ve followed him throughout this and really believe he is trying to be a voice for those that will suffer. Lots of other leaders are backing him in the north.

Now London is in tier 2 extra funding is being looked at

I don't agree at all. Boris is using covid to punish labour metro mayors. This stuff shows up his "one nation" speeches as a pile of steaming crap. He seems completely unable to govern without dividing and in my view that is extremely poor leadership.

@NellyJames

And let’s not forget that AB gives 15% of his salary to the charity to end homelessness in Manchester.

How could we? We are constantly reminded...

Andy Burnham is fighting for the people he represents. That's his job.

He's doing his job.

gran22 they were offered 22 million in South Yorkshire to start with. They were told the money they did get is only for business not for the workers or to save jobs. At end of his interview he said if the Tier 3 is too long a period he will have to go back to Government for more money because you see 42 million really just isn't enough. So b4 u shoot down someone who was not only fighting for Manchester but for ALL areas that will eventually be on Tier 3 u need to ponder on the Governments treatment of Pacific areas and the pitching of areas against others and while Boris continues to divide the nation more and more and making examples of people like Andy Burnham that stick up for those most deprived he is taking away workers rights, health and safety at work, keeping the south prosperous, ensuring he keeps his voters that are newly tories by making sure their constituencies get money others dont thus keeping him in No 10. But I believe that this time Dominic Cummings ( cos that's who really runs the country) has underestimated the North.

I'm from Yorkshire and I was impressed with Burnham- I hope our representatives fight as hard for us. Even DH ( disgruntled and disenchanted Tory party member) was team AB.

Very shady set up in Manchester. AB is just one problem they have. Richard Leese the head of the council and his band of merry men and women are all corrupt. This was another case of Manchester pretending to be ‘World class big bollocks’ as per usual.

AB cares about AB.

Before u make statements like that thewiseoneincognito where's your proof? Prove it right here and now all your allegations!

@SheepandCow I think you misinterpreted my comment on decisions being made to suit London, I was referring to that rhetoric coming from AB and areas outside London who are trying to pin the blame for community spread on other people (politicians) to deflect from their own mistakes. Scotland another example, they had almost eliminated it and it came back, proving that the spread is about behaviour more than about the starting level.

Anyway, I agree with the overall sentiment on here that all politicians are now deliberately inciting and stoking division and disunity. Not helped by Westminster’s outrageous lies about how SK has managed TfL (he’s taken it from the £1.5bn operating deficit he inherited from BJ to 200m and they say he bankrupted it). They’re looking to make Londoners pay for it through increased and extended congestion charging and council tax and pretend that it’s someone else’s fault. So there’s a pretty good example of how London most certainty isn’t getting any kind of sweet deal!!

And don’t forget, most London boroughs are labour boroughs. So the Tories are hardly looking after their own there. More than anything the sentiment here in the south is that we are likely to end up bearing the brunt of the costs, despite the carnage that has been wreaked on our own livelihoods and out of control living costs that we face, we’re seen as some sort of cash cow.

Interestingly, I wonder whether AB has kicked a very important own goal... by raising his head so high he’s given the Tories another group of people to blame for their own failures - local council leaders. It’s divide and rule in its most basic form, attack local leaders and point public unrest towards them, then use it as a mask behind which to introduce unpopular new measures, blaming local govt for its “incompetence“ when actually it’s all to do with national level failures. Cue communities fighting between and amongst themselves and govt trying to appear strong and stable throughout, perfect distraction.

I wonder how it plays out?? AB might have inadvertently ended up giving govt much more ammunition than he intended to. I think we could live to regret it and it will ultimately result in weakening local govt to our more power in the hands of Westminster which ultimately is exactly how they like it.

@RedToothBrush you’re great on these things, what do you think?

But u can't can you? Nope didn't think so.

yabu

Mr Johnson is targeting places that have Labour Mayors. Notice how no part of the west Midlands with a Tory Mayor is in tier 3. Or some Tory constituencies with higher than average levels being in tier 2.

It goes to show that people will see what they want to see and hear what they want to hear. People support Boris, People support Andy. Our children are obese, our children are starving. I give up, the sooner it's all over the better. I'm going out and rubbing myself over rich people, I'm a cleaner so I can do that! I'm not surviving on Benefits and have no idea of how to claim anyway. If I have symptoms I will mask them easy enough. I've just thought, rubbing up against them might tip them off, so licking toothbrushes, ugh no! Spitting is worse, disgusting but I will make the sacrifice!