Jobs with few hours that want massive flexibility

[Realii]

I keep looking at jobs, part-time and with pretty low hours that want massive flexibility. For example one wants 15hrs but presence at meetings that can be any day of the week as part of that. Others have totally unfixed shifts.
I used to easily get 2/3 jobs sometimes, and fit a few around each other. This seems impossible in the modern job markets. So many seem to not offer hours, yet feel they are buying you.
Is it just me?

No, DD saw a job advertised for 4 hours on a Saturday at a major retailer - and the person had to be available 7 days a week! Who does not have any other commitments all week, except perhaps the retired, but can live on 4 hours wages a week?

Aye - the flexibility only flows one way, doesn't it?

My job has no hours but is full time so easier to manage.

I was being made redundant and looking for jobs. I found one that was only alternate Sundays but they wanted me to be available at any other time to cover leave or sickness. I turned it down and got a lecture about how I'd let them down

No, it's not just you and it's utterly soul destroying to see so many jobs which want you to all but sell your soul for such small return.

But of course it's absolutely an employer's market out there right now which means all sorts of shitty demands can be made of prospective employees by unscrupulous employers because they can be reasonably confident someone will be desperate enough to bite.

One job wanted a qualified teacher with leadership experience, for £10ph and flexibility across the week (!)

@DarkMintChocolate that’s pretty much top end of the worst. Even zero hours often ted to be picking up if your free, these ones explicitly want stuff like attending two half hour meetings on two non-working days. Or just being obligated to be present whenever summoned

No you’re correct, I tried a zero hours contract years ago it was ridiculous, I couldn’t make plans ever because I didn’t know if they would ring at 7am for me to be in, some months I’d make £800 others £8. It was soul destroying.

This for example: qualified teacher, two years experience at least. Leadership experience of ofsted (so pretty much head/ deputy). Also experience as a school governor, your own quality internet connection (I guess and software/ hardware to fund) for £10.50 ph hour, and you must also still be in post www.twinkl.co.uk/careers/teacher/content-writer-slt-product
It’s not just teaching, that’s the demands of an experienced school leader!
Job adverts like this are depressing

I have a team of relief staff and we state that they may be called upon to cover sickness and holidays (7 day a week operation) but i also understand if they are unable to cover the shift. Flexibility has to go both ways.

Depends on the notice given, I have an 8 hour a week job but I know the schedule for 2021 already and I made it. Most of it is flexible and it's wfh except meetings (which this year are virtual so also wfh). All depends on the business as to if they are being reasonable

This has been happening for a long while. More and more entry level assistant jobs in each sector require specialist qualifications too, that you can only get in the jobs once you have one in the sector, which you can't get without the qualifications. Have you only just noticed? What do you think people have been complaining about for the last 20 years or more?

This is why we used to have unions and solid employment rights. But that's all communist talk innit?

My husband has been looking at supermarket delivery driver jobs and some describe the hours as: Full time hours between Mon-Sun, 06.00-23.00.

Well that's helpful. 🙄

It's awful. I'd love to have a part-time job. But pretty much ALL the low level part time work, the advert says 'must be completely flexible to work any days/hours. I mean who can do that with small children? It's really depressing.
I'd need to know what days/times and to be the same very week to sort nursery.

I remember going into Holland and Barratt years ago to ask about a Saturday job and the manager was horrified that I was a student. She rudely told me "look, you need to be available every day for last minute shifts. If someone calls in sick I need you to be here like that" and snapped her fingers in my face.

Well, fuck her. I haven't set foot in their stinky shops since and buy my vitamins from a supermarket for half the price.

It’s like the zero hour contracts that specifically bar you from taking another part time job. Never understood how business have been allowed to get away with such practices.

@Realii I’d be ignoring any job advert that wanted knowledge of the U.K. National Curriculum given such a thing doesn’t exist. Nonsense job advert.

@Jellycatspyjamas good point!

As a recruiter, I really try to avoid this where possible. I'm working some senior partners at the moment on a massive project and we really need an administrator to help out with various bits. We've worked out that there really isn't any more than 15 hours of work available per week and decided that we'd be happy for the person to work this in any pattern that suits them. Of course, then the senior partners started talking about their own diaries and commitments, noting that the person would obviously have to be flexible in order to attend meetings when it suited them and that this would change week to week. I'm banging my head against a brick wall trying to explain to them that we'll need to agree set meeting times which coincide with the administrator's working pattern and trying to make them see that they might have another job or other personal commitments which they can't just abandon.

On the other hand though, I'm about to advertise a role in my own immediate department. Again, there is definitely not a full-time workload here - the job will be around 20 hours per week but due to the nature of our work, this person must be present every day Mon-Fri. So long as they are in for at least three hours every day, the hours can be configured in any way they want. This is absolutely due to the nature and demands of this particular job but I'm being told by our HR department that this is too rigid and will put people off applying. Surely though, it's worse to advertise a job as fully flexible, put someone through an interview and then turn them down (possibly having to re-advertise) because they can't do Wednesdays and Fridays?

@SpaceRaiders

It’s like the zero hour contracts that specifically bar you from taking another part time job. Never understood how business have been allowed to get away with such practices.

That's actually been illegal since 2015, but of course they get around it by not offering you any hours if you turn down a shift.

Honestly tho someone MUST be agreeing to these terms, or they would have to offer better to ensure they got staff.

Stop ever agreeing to it! If everyone says no, the problem goes away.

Fact is the employment market is broken and has been for a long time, along with the housing market. It's only when it starts to impact middle class families and employment that it starts to be talked about though. Even then nothing has actually been done. This is socioeconomic collapse happening all around us.

@NoIDontWatchLoveIsland

Honestly tho someone MUST be agreeing to these terms, or they would have to offer better to ensure they got staff.

Stop ever agreeing to it! If everyone says no, the problem goes away.

If youre under the threat of benefit sanctions youll take pretty much anything because if you dont you get your UC stopped

Or if you need the job to feed kids and pay bills when you're in that squeezed lower middle ground of getting nothing off the state but are not really better off than those on benefits.