Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

WIBU to print an artist's work at home?

296 replies

zatarontoast · 02/10/2020 11:49

Asking as I really don't know if this is appropriate or not. I follow an artist on Instagram who does oil paintings and I really wanted one so enquired about the price. At £500 for a small size it is way beyond my budget or what I could justify in spending. But... I still want one. She doesn't do prints, so I was thinking I could print one off at home for my own use. I don't know much about these things so don't know if this is considering stealing or is just a no-no in general? My rationale is that she isn't losing by me doing this as I wasn't going to buy it anyway.

OP posts:
NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 17:54

I just thought of a similar thing-

Back in the day, people used to record the songs they liked off the top 40 onto tape. The result was pretty crap what with having to try and avoid recording the presenter at the beginning and end. And it was therorectically a copyright infringement I believe.

But people did it loads.

For the people saying no, and who are old enough, did you never record any songs like that? Similar to op as in immoral, pretty sure illegal, poor quality etc.

Any thoughts?

NekoShiro · 02/10/2020 17:55

To that people saying YABU, can you honestly say that you could walk into your kids room and not find any printed out pieces of other peoples work? Not being cut up and used for collages, decoration for fun printed out and on the walls? Printing out a photo of art is never going to equate to owning a real piece, people know this, personally I think theres no issue printing out something you like, not even morally, if you try to sell it then it is morally wrong, you're profiting off of someone else, but enriching your life with a piece of art to look at is fine.

Can I not save photos of art I like to my pc and use it as a wallpaper? the background of my phone? where is the line? it's not okay printed out on my walls but carried around with me everyday is fine?

wontonwoman · 02/10/2020 18:09

Would you work for free? Do you think its fair to ask someone to work but not get paid??

Piglet89 · 02/10/2020 18:11

@anditgoeson your suggestion is also a good preventative measure.

SantaClaritaDiet · 02/10/2020 18:14

It's not the same as expecting people to work for free though, is it.
Expecting someone to work for free is asking them for a free item for the "privilege" to mention them on your publication or social media...

You will sleep a lot better if you take it as a tribute and a praise for your work.

I get that it's infuriating and very difficult do fight. You do get a much bigger audience than ever before, but you also waste time trying to get your copyright respected and remove copies of your work from all over the web.

anditgoeson · 02/10/2020 18:16

@NekoShiro you dont have to guess at the line, it is already drawn up for you in the form of copyright law. If you're comfortable in stealing somebody else's intellectual property then as other users have said - do it, it's unenforceable apparently, and therefore acceptable.

What some people arent grasping is the individual nature of this issue. The closest comparison you could use is that of illegally downloading movies from the internet. We all agree this is wrong and illegal and yet if some posters are to go by there's nothing wrong with this either as long as you dont get caught?

You are downloading and reproducing work for use in the way it has been intended, just without the actual buying it part. How can anybody say that isnt wrong is beyond me.

NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 18:19

Wonton if someone wanted to print out something I'd produced in the course of my work and put it in a little frame because they liked it so much I would have zero issues with that at all.

It loses me nothing and it gains then something.

MN is a bit odd sometimes.

Any takers on the top 40 tape recording thing?

SantaClaritaDiet · 02/10/2020 18:47

We all agree this is wrong and illegal and yet if some posters are to go by there's nothing wrong with this either as long as you dont get caught?

that's not exactly that.

More that, as you KNOW it happens and people will do, it's time to start safe and good quality download sites. If you can't stop it, change your business to join in and not lose out.

anditgoeson · 02/10/2020 19:03

@SantaClaritasDiet I'm not concerned about my business because I dont post my work in a way that makes it downloadable. Fortunately I am naturally cautious person and I am very aware of how accessible anything uploaded onto the internet is. I do however make prints available for people who ask me for them. That way they get art they like and I get to sustain my business.

Posters have said that they are comfortable in doing something that infringes copyright law because it's 'not enforceable' and who would know right? So it is 'exactly' that in reference to the point that I was making.

I am just upset at the general attitude towards art work. I just dont think people have the same attitude towards anything else people work for/provide or make. It's almost as if it's not valued as a profession at all.

Piglet89 · 02/10/2020 19:28

@anditgoeson I am a lawyer by training, but I have also trained in a more artistic and performance-related field. Both required tertiary-level qualifications. It totally AMAZED me how many people asked me whether I would work free of charge in the former when they never would in the latter, had I been a specialist, sole practitioner lawyer.

tornadoalley · 02/10/2020 19:38

Well you could print it out and bugger the copyright issue because it's for your own personal use, and she'd never find out unless you sold it. However it's almost certain the image you can pick up from Instagram or any other web based image would be of such appalling quality it wouldn't be worth printing. This is because the pixel count would be far too low to enlarge to anything satisfactorily. I sell art and never ever put out my work in its full printable size, but reduce the ppi to make it pixellate horribly. To get my printable images which are around 4000 pixels square and print to around 20x30" you have to pay me 😂

TheSandman · 02/10/2020 19:46

As an artist, I'd be annoyed if I knew that someone had done it to me. If you want a painting that badly, save up for it. It is a breach of her copyright and also a pretty mean-spirited thing to do.

This.

I draw. I give my art away - post it on the internet knowing full well that once it's out there there is nothing I can do to stop people copying it. I'm happy not getting money for my art though the odd word of appreciation is... erm.... appreciated.
But I do know people who make their (sometimes precarious) living by selling their work. They're professional artists. It's stealing.

anditgoeson · 02/10/2020 19:46

@Piglet89 it's really sad actually how undervalued the arts are in general. Its as though artists should just provide their art for the love it.

I feel that there is an attitude of 'art is important...until you have to pay for it' unfortunately.

tornadoalley · 02/10/2020 19:47

@zatarontoast

Regarding your daughters homework. Google images used to be a great source of images, but they had their arm well and truly twisted and threatened with legal action for putting good size images on their pages which were happily stolen (by the likes of myself when compositing). This has now stopped and their image sizes are reduced and are crap. As are Facebook images. I suggest your dd searches in Bing as there are still plenty of nice size images to copy (but not sell commercially). There are also 'Creative Commons' images which are not under copyright, and super websites like 'unsplash' which give away high quality images for free. Search copyright free images. She can use the paid websites, like dreamstime and adobe images, but this works out pretty expensive.

Re your favourite artist......if it's an abstract it will be low quality low pixel count, but if you have photoshop, you can use the enlarge image facility as it 'fills in' the missing pixels using sophisticated algorithms and will make you a decent image. Personally I think everyone should enjoy art but not make a profit from other people's work.

tornadoalley · 02/10/2020 19:51

It is illegal though!

GlummyMcGlummerson · 02/10/2020 20:06

Would people have a problem and cal it stealing if the OP:

  1. Had the digital picture as a background/screensaver?
  2. Used the image on a digital photo frame?
NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 20:14

The Sandman op has shown appreciation. She contacted the artist asking if it would be possible to get a print.

I am baffled by the people who are so outraged about op printing out a shit quality home printed thing and putting it in a little frame to look at.

No one has commented on the 80s top 40 shit tape recordings either. Very similar principle.

TheSandman · 02/10/2020 20:24

The Sandman op has shown appreciation. She contacted the artist asking if it would be possible to get a print.

And if the artist says 'no'?

I'm presuming the artist is asking what she considers a fair price for her work. So am I. My fair price is a 'like'. Hers is £500. If I was her I would appreciate a' like' but be extremely pissed off if it was followed by 'I made a copy'.

tornadoalley · 02/10/2020 21:04

I sell artwork too, and wouldn't be too bothered. However it's not my main source of income. I only once got outraged when an American client demanded I give him full and exclusive rights to a particular artwork I had done on commission. He demanded I gave him the copyright and threatened me with legal action if I dared print out any of my own work! Told him to do one, kept the work, and refunded him his money. It's why I only do commissioned work. Other artworks I do that are not custom I'm not really bothered about. I put a watermark on it and copyright protected. Only an idiot puts on full art works with no protection. You can't sue everyone.

Veryverycalmnow · 02/10/2020 21:21

YABU! Copyright and who wants a shit print- out?

NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 21:22

The artist did say no, she doesn't do prints.

You would be angry about someone printing off a shit copy on a home printer 6 by 8 putting it in a little frame in their house for them to look at and feel happy because it reminded them of their childhood/ where their parents live.

Really?

NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 21:25

I've got stacks of original artwork. My brother is an artist. I am lucky to be able to pay £100s to have something I have fallen in love with on my wall.

I find this thread pretty pathetic.

A person with no cash falls in love with a pic, can't afford, asks if a print is available, no.

But to print out a low quality copy on a home printer for them to look at is a moral, legal, ethical, total and utter no no.

I mean fucks sake.

PomBearsArentNaice · 02/10/2020 21:26

@NiceGerbil

£500 isn't a lot of money Hmm
For many of us it is
NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 21:30

She could save the picture on her phone and look at it every morning instead.

That ok?

The point of art is... Multi faceted.

I feel uncomfortable with the idea that in general. People who don't have money who see something that speaks to them. Makes them feel love, joy. Or sadness. Anything.

According to this thread can't print off a low definition copy and look at it in their room when they're feeling sad or whatever.

I do not understand. Seriously.

NiceGerbil · 02/10/2020 21:31

Pombears you will notice the eyebrow.

It wasn't me who said that. I was saying WTF