Reporting dangerous dogs?

[LondonLassi]

Something has been on my mind for a few days after hearing about the poor 12 day old baby who died after being attacked by a dog.

My sister’s neighbour has a 16 year old son who is regularly in trouble with the police. I spend a lot of time there. The screaming and shouting that comes from next door is horrendous and the police are often called out to restrain him. He is not in school. Smokes weed all day. I’ve never seen his face because he wears a hoodie over a face covering (even pre-COVID) I’m just trying to paint a picture of the kind of troubled youth we’re dealing with here. If you make eye contact with him he will swear at you, call you names and threaten you. He is quite frankly a bit scary.

About a year ago they got two puppies from the same litter. They are fully grown now and they look like some sort of pit bull cross. Possibly pit bull/mastiff. They are huge. I’ll attach a pic of what I think they might be. When we sit out in the garden we can hear them next door fighting and growling, they barge my sisters fence to try to get to her small jack Russell terriers. They’ve had to repair the fence three times already after the dogs broke it.

This boy walks the dogs regularly. They are not muzzled. If we happen to leave the house at the same time the dogs go up on their hind legs and get very over excited. The boy has to pull them back to get them away. They try to break free to get to anyone walking near them if they’re out for a walk. Tonight we happened to be leaving as the boy was walking home. The dogs immediately started barking at us and were trying to run towards us and had to be restrained. We often hear people shouting when they walk by because of the dogs trying to get to them. It’s very scary when it happens because they are big and intimidating.

I am terrified of what would happen if these dogs managed to get loose. They have been raised by someone with a violent, anti social background. I can’t shake the image of them getting hold of a child. The boy has a little brother in the house, probably around 6 years old.

What would you do in this situation? I’m thinking of reporting them as potentially dangerous dogs. If IABU please tell me. It just seems like an awful attack waiting to happen.

Those dogs sound terrifying, definitely report to your local dog warden.
You’ll never get a sensible answer out of Mumsnetters about dogs though, OP. They’re their babies, don’t you know

@ALittlePitchy

Those dogs sound terrifying, definitely report to your local dog warden. You’ll never get a sensible answer out of Mumsnetters about dogs though, OP. They’re their babies, don’t you know

yes, that's what it comes down to they become emotionally attached to the animal and can only see it 'through the eyes of a mother' although sometimes it seems more like the animal is a quasi partner for them (as opposed to quasi child)

I'd definitely report, to the HA or council re the fence and also to the police or dog warden re your concerns that the dogs may be a banned breed. If you are very concerned for the child I'd also ring Social Services, if the older brother has been arrested they will most likely already have been involved with this family.

If it turns out the dogs are not a risk then no harm done, if not they'll be removed.

Posters saying all breeds can be dangerous, this is ridiculous. Whilst all dogs could harm or kill a baby or small child (which is why they should never be left alone with any dog) it would be highly unlikely the likes of a Cocker, Border Collie, Terrier, Labrador etc. could or would kill an older child or adult and if they did attack it would be easy for an adult to stop them. I doubt I could stop a bull breed, Akita or certain other large breed dogs. I would never own a dog I could not control if for whatever reason it attacked someone.

@Honeyhoops
What a stupid comment, do you think every labrador, collie, spaniel is perfect? the first two can be bigger than bull breeds, why do you make the ignorant assumption they’d be easier to stop? There a labradoodle near me much bigger than my recently deceased cane corso and nasty too.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8479029/amp/Jealous-Labrador-mauls-two-newborn-twins-death-Brazil.html

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1288786/Familys-border-collie-leaps-car-mauls-baby.html

If you google UK fatal dog attacks there is a Wiki list going back 30 years and the vast majority of attacks are by Bull breeds. I was actually shocked by the number of Staffordshire Bull Terrier attacks. In the description of the attacks a couple state that the owners stabbed the dogs to try to stop them, the dogs had to be shot by police.

This is why I would never have a bull breed or any other heavy, muscular dog which were originally bred to guard or attack.

French bulldogs are a bull breed, Honeyhoops. I'm sure you'd stand a chance restraining one of those at least. And actually SBTs aren't large dogs. They're often crossbred with or mistaken for other larger dogs.

@SBTLove

Bull breeds are far more muscular and have a much stronger bite than spaniels, labs etc. I know for a fact I could stop my spaniel if it attacked anyone, I'm pretty certain I would be unable to stop a Mastiff, Cane Corso, Rottweiler or Akita.

No dog is perfect but imo choosing to own any of those dogs (and others) when you have children is stupid. Why take the risk?

@ScribblingMilly

I grew up with an English Bull Terrier, I played with Rottweilers and Alsatians as a child. I know Staffy's are great with kids and can make good family dogs hence being shocked at the number of Staffy's on the list of fatal attacks.

I'm not saying all Bull breeds are unsuitable as family pets, but personally I would not choose to have one. Some due to potential risk and the rest due to health issues.

Tbh I don't understand why anyone with or planning to have children would choose, for example a Cane Corso, Bull Mastiff, Akita or Rottweiler over a Spaniel, Lab, Collie.

@SBTLove

Posters saying all breeds can be dangerous, this is ridiculous. Whilst all dogs could harm or kill a baby or small child (which is why they should never be left alone with any dog*

As above I already stated that ANY dog could harm or kill a baby or small child so why link an articles re a Lab killing newborns?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ListofffataldoggattacksinntheUniteddKingdom

Here's the link if anyone wants to check the number of fatal attacks by Spaniels (0) vs Bull breeds (a lot).

YABU - barking and hind legs doesn't mean aggression.
My small dog does this, she wants to say hello and is frustrated she can't.

@Pineappletop They are problem behaviours and shouldn’t be encouraged. Especially in big dogs that could hurt someone. It’s not cute and is a sign of a poorly trained, undisciplined dog.

This is exactly what posters further up were saying. You think it’s cute that a dog wants to jump up to ‘say hello’. We don’t. People must just accept that a lunging, jumping, over excited, terrifying bull mastiff being walked by a hooded shady character that stinks of weed and has a violent history, is just a happy, curious puppy that wants you to give it some attention. Ffs.

You are never going to get a sensible post here. Especially with peters called ‘dogsarebetterthanpeople’. There’s some crazy, biased dog nutters out there who totally anthropomorphise their animals and lose all reason when discussing any subject related to dogs. Jumping and barking is bad behaviour, if your dog does it, it’s not because it’s cute and needs attention, it’s because you’ve not trained it properly.

*people!

Tbh I don't understand why anyone with or planning to have children would choose, for example a Cane Corso, Bull Mastiff, Akita or Rottweiler over a Spaniel, Lab, Collie.

Personally I would never, ever have a collie around young children. While they're lovely dogs in the right hands, they have a strong herding instinct and can be fairly mouthy, nippy and anxious as a whole. I walk several and they're fantastic when tired out, but if not they can be a whole different kettle of fish. Fine with older children or if they're older when the kids arrive, but otherwise I just think it's far too much work for the owners.

Again I don't really "get" the Labrador love either. I know they have the reputation of being easily trained and good with children, but all the young labs I've met have been clumsy, energetic, mouthy and epic food thieves. I guess I just don't get the appeal of them at all though - I actually find them rather dull

@vanillandhoney
I had a Border Collie from when I was 20, pre kids, he died aged 14 when my dd's were 18 mths and 6 years. He was amazing with them and they adored him, I never had any issues with him snapping or reacting to them in any way. Fair enough if you're clueless about dogs and don't put the effort in to train and socialise them around kids they could be a problem, but that goes for any dog. We have a Working Cocker now and he's also great with children.

Do you have a dog and children?

@LondonLassi did I say they weren't problem behaviours? I don't encourage it we've worked hard with her to curb it but sometimes it happens. However my point was it does not mean the dog is dangerous and wants to attack.

@Pineappletop you may know that or think you know that as the owner but when it’s somebody’s dog doing it to you how are you supposed to know it’s intentions? Especially in a big dog, it can be extremely intimidating and I would personally be worried, especially around kids.

@Pineappletop and my point is that the owner clearly hasn’t trained the dogs. These breeds need stringent training and discipline to ensure that they will be safe to have around humans. If he can’t even get the things to stop jumping God knows what will happen if they get loose and come across a child.

@Tadpolesandfroglets again didn't say any of this I am simply saying it does not automatically mean they are dangerous dogs! Because my dog is small and fluffy and cute if she does it people who walk past go 'oh she wants to say hello' children still come over. This is why it's hard to train these behaviours as you have to rely on people around you acting appropriately. These are things that would not happen if she was a staffie or Great Dane etc for example, you would see it and think oh shit it wants to attack me. OP cannot report a dog for being dangerous if it has not actually done anything to indicate it would want to attack

@LondonLassi If IABU please tell me. If you put this in your OP expect people to tell you as everyone has different opinions. Jumping is an issue but does not mean they are dangerous dogs. Same way any dog has the potential to jump up. If said dogs were fluffy spaniels for example would you have this reaction and report them?

@Pineappletop I could ask you a similar question. If you came across a mean looking bull breed being walked by a thug would you let your small, fluffy and cute dog go and say hello? I don’t think you would. It would be ripped to shreds. However, if you came across another small, fluffy and cute pup you’d probably encourage the interaction. People steer clear of these breeds for a damn good reason.

@LondonLassi no because if you come across a dog on a lead you should never approach it, you should never encourage your dog to approach it either. This is why there are so many issues because people think all small dogs are friendly and approachable.
Why is it so hard don't approach other people's dogs no matter the size, cuteness etc if they are on a lead!!
If the dogs were off lead and my dog was ok with other dogs then they could interact till their hearts content. I find bigger bull breeds are friendlier then say jack Russell types but that's my experience

Do you have a dog and children?

I have a dog and no children. However, I'm also a dog walker and have qualifications in dog behaviour and am around multiple dogs everyday, of all breeds. So no, I'm not remotely clueless about dogs.

Out of all the breeds I'm around, the only ones who have regularly displayed worrying behaviour are the collies, terriers (mostly JRT's or mixes of), chihuahuas and pomeranians.

That's not to say I dislike any of those breeds, but blanketly staying "it's bull breeds that are dangerous!" does more harm than good. Are you including, for example, French bulldogs? What about Boston terriers? Both examples of bully breeds but both far smaller and weaker than your average Labrador or spaniel.