The government have fucked up the re-opening of schools

[noblegiraffe]

They have, haven't they?

Back in June their five tests for reopening schools were:

First we must protect the NHS’s ability to cope, and be sure that it can continue to provide critical care and specialist treatment right across the whole of the United Kingdom.

Second, we need to see daily death rates from coronavirus coming down.

Third, we need to have reliable data that shows the rate of infection is decreasing to manageable levels.

Four, we need to be confident that testing capacity and PPE is being managed, with supply able to meet, not just today’s demand, but future demand.

And fifth, and perhaps most crucially, we need to be confident that any changes we do make will not risk a second peak of infections.

I'm pretty sure I know the reason for not reminding people of those five tests this time round, but particularly test 4 - capacity within the testing system.

I was listening to the radio today about how the lack of testing is damaging the NHS's capacity to reopen services as nurses with symptoms cannot get tests and therefore cannot return to work. The same goes for schools - if teachers cannot get tests, either for themselves or for family members with symptoms, then they cannot go to work. This has been the case even with priority referrals.

There also seems to be utter chaos around who gets sent home when there is a positive test. Some schools are sending home a year group, others close contacts. Teachers often have no idea if they'll be sent home if one of their pupils tests positive.

But surely the government are tracking cases in schools carefully? No, it turns out they're not even storing that data. schoolsweek.co.uk/its-official-dfe-doesnt-know-how-many-schools-have-covid-cases

And a survey suggests that covid protection measures in some schools are poor. www.tes.com/news/third-teachers-lack-soap-and-water-school

So with an abysmal test and trace system, less than adequate measures to prevent the spread, and a department that isn't on top of its brief we can expect more disruption to come.

Even if your own kids' school is fine so far, parents really shouldn't be happy with this state of affairs, particularly the lack of testing capacity that will mean children will be out of school or missing a teacher unnecessarily.

YABU: The government have done a sterling job
YANBU: The government have not done a sterling job

The five tests were achieved.

But testing was one of the 5 tests.

And infections falling to manageable levels was another test. The fact that they've had to implement the Rule of 6 two weeks after the majority of schools in England went back suggests that they were not being managed.

"@noblegiraffe, You need to think about going off with stress I think, you are clearly very stressed about all of this and you aren't doing yourself or your pupils any good."

Why do you assume that noble is "very stressed?" She sounds extremely measured and realistic to me. It's just that you don't wish to hear the message that she's giving (which is echoed by the vast majority of teachers on this site).
And besides, if you had a child doing GCSE or A' level maths, you might be wanting to be more careful about what you're advocating. Who is going to teach your child maths if noble and her ilk "go off with stress?"

The dire financial straits that most schools are in won't help the situation either. There is no spare staffing capacity in most schools. If teachers or members of their household can't get tests they will be unable to work. There's no budget for supply staff so classes could end up closing if classes can't be staffed.

Firstly, no one cares if you post or don't, just keep it in the section where all the bull belongs.

Secondly, I don't care how long a test takes, they're back it might be intermittent, it might not be perfect but they are back and that is exactly what needs to happen

Schools need to be open. I'd prefer to see pubs/gyms/places of worship, temporarily close rather than the schools.

@Unsure33

False positives aren’t the issue, false negatives are. So my son had a terrible cough, result came back negative he went back to nursery... if it were a false negative he’s now possibly infected half his nursery. And the rate of false negatives is way too high for my liking.

‘Not be nannied’😂😂😂😂

This government can’t do anything right never mind nannying.

We are in Scotland in a big city. Kids have been back 6 weeks and it’s all going pretty smoothly. All kids got colds but no COVID, touch wood!

Truly, that's great. But how does it at all address the OP?

@Unsure33 I've heard this too

@lamnotheone

Apologies someone else mentioned false positives.

Luckily all the people I know in the last week who have had tests were all negative.

@BillywilliamV

Dont care, just glad that they are back at school!

That does, of course, pre-suppose that they will stay there.....

As tests are unavailable, a teacher with Covid symprtoms HAS to self-isolate for 14 days. There isn't another alternative, and there are no spare teachers in schools (and no supply teachers willing to work in current conditions in schools).

With no adult in front of the class, children will have to go home.

That's even before considering people managing to get tests and test positive, which of course closes yet more classes and schools. DD's school managed a week before a year group closure, and we are in an area with a TINY number of cases, one of the lowest in the country.

@MilesJuppIsMyBitch

I can't vote (which I'm taking personally), so popping on to say YADNBU.

(As you know, I agree with you on All Things).

How can you not vote?!

Is this the government limiting the number of votes so that the figures don't look so bad for them?

@Littleposh you seem quite bothered that ‘noble’ posted. Why can’t they post in AIBU as they want votes.

@noblegiraffe

The five tests were achieved.

But testing was one of the 5 tests.

And infections falling to manageable levels was another test. The fact that they've had to implement the Rule of 6 two weeks after the majority of schools in England went back suggests that they were not being managed.

Infections just have to not overwhelm NHS.

And introducing rule of 6 is managing that.

@Bupkis

They have completely fucking utterly cocked up in the most specfucktacular fashion... I am massively sleep deprived, so forgive my sweariness.

On all the previous schools opening up threads, I posted about medically vulnerable ds...10 years old, previously shielded, with complex needs, should we send in? Will we get fined? What about de registering?

No. Fucking. Point

8 days ds had back at school. 8 days...
Sunday night wakes up coughing, temperature of 38.4. Call in Monday morning, tell them we'll try to get test. Call dd1 and 2s secondary, explain situation. Dh calls his men at work tells them he'll be back when he can get a test....
Go online..Nothing..Call 119...Bupkis...back online Naff all. No tests anywhere.

Ds typically has 5 or 6 ish episodes of illness over the Winter months, usually with at least one or 2 hospital trips. With no tests, that means dh only getting ssp for potentially 70ish days, yr 9 and 10 dds potentially missing 84 days of school.

Or we keep ds home, get fined, he stays well..hopefully no hospital trips...and dh and dds can at least carry on as much as possible.

I am beyond fucked off (possibly partly because I have spent 2 nights sat up with a poorly ds propped up on me)

I'm sorry Bupkis. You've been so badly let down

My son had to try 20 times to get a postal test but managed in the end .

Wonder if it will calm down after the children initially all catching colds .

@Littleposh

Firstly, no one cares if you post or don't, just keep it in the section where all the bull belongs.

Secondly, I don't care how long a test takes, they're back it might be intermittent, it might not be perfect but they are back and that is exactly what needs to happen

It's not the delay getting tests back that is the issue. Locally, no tests can be obtained at all. So anyone with a covid symptom, and their household, has to self-isolate for 14 days regardless.

If we had good testing, 95-99/100 of those people would test negative. As it is, 100 of them have to isolate.

The implications for staffing of everything, from hospitals and care homes through schools and nurseries, are obvious. If 100 (plus their entire households) have to isolate for 14 days for every 1-5 actual cases, things will grind to a halt.

And introducing rule of 6 is managing that.

Bit early to say, don't you think?

@MarjorytheTrashHeap

The dire financial straits that most schools are in won't help the situation either. There is no spare staffing capacity in most schools. If teachers or members of their household can't get tests they will be unable to work. There's no budget for supply staff so classes could end up closing if classes can't be staffed.

Exactly this. We scraped together the cover for the 10% of staff off today. If they're all still off tomorrow, and anyone else is off, we have a problem. We can't afford supply and our internal cover is at capacity. None of these teachers wants to be off, but until they get the all clear, they have to be. That's not anyone in school's fault.

Realistically if there is a supply problem with tests, public health should determine the threshold of symptoms which warrants a test. The symptom threshold might vary depending on test availability and local incidence.

@noblegiraffe

And introducing rule of 6 is managing that.

Bit early to say, don't you think?

Do you think they should have introduced it or not?

Our local schools don't have any outbreaks and no bubbles/year groups etc off. All still going. The schools here are doing really well with the return.

Different parts of the country are having different outbreaks - perhaps some parts SD better than others etc - who knows.

Bupkis I seemed to miss your post first time around. I'm sorry that you have been so badly affected. The vulnerable and their families have been particularly let down. I hope you get a test soon.

@Namenic

Realistically if there is a supply problem with tests, public health should determine the threshold of symptoms which warrants a test. The symptom threshold might vary depending on test availability and local incidence.

There should also be a priority list of who can get tests urgently.

If parents want schools open, they MUST lobby the government to have teachers and other school staff on this list.

'How can you not vote?!

Is this the government limiting the number of votes so that the figures don't look so bad for them?'

Dominic is moonlighting at MNHQ in a dodgy wig and birkenstocks.