To ask if you know diets very rarely work in the long term?

[purplefig]

Lately I've heard so many people (on here and offline) beating themselves up about not being able to lose weight.

It's led me to wonder: do most people still think that diets work?

If so, this talk by a neuroscientist is well worth a watch: https://www.ted.com/talks/sandraaamodttwhydietinggdoesnttusuallywork/details

Two aspects to why diets don't work: restricting your food is miserable and for many people very difficult, for a million different reasons. And then, people diet and then stop. If you're 10 stone and want to be 9 stone, you get there by eating like a 9 stone person. Once you're 9 stone, you have to continue eating like a 9 stone person to stay there.

Mindful eating, intuitive eating, lifestyle changes etc are all just a different and socially accepted way of saying DIET.

The word diet implies a temporary burden in order to lose a few pounds.

The reality is that you need to make permanent healthy eating choices to lose and keep weight off. That's not a diet, it's normal eating and becomes as such. The trouble with being "on a diet" is that it psychologically implies you could take yourself off the diet if you so wished, which is what people do. They then blame "the diet".

if you're someone who really struggles with their relationship with food that's going to be a huge challenge

This is the key point.

Unfortunately, 99.99% of weight/food/diet threads on here go the same way. Various posters wade in with, eat less and move more, stop eating lard, go for a walk etc. etc. Then the "I'm 5 foot 5 and 9 stone" posters arrive and anything useful is lost.

I would also agree with the second or third post in that a huge amount of the diet "advice" on here is downright dangerous, posted by people who have absolutely no idea about health or nutrition.

If there was an easy answer then the diet industry wouldn't be the multi-billion £ monster that it is.

I think the issue is with people who go along with Slimming World and Weight Watchers and then end up restricting their favourite foods, and see it as a quick diet rather than lifestyle change etc etc.

I've lost two stone, now have a 20 BMI but still eat cake, chocolate and biscuits if I feel like it. I just calculate it into my daily calories.

My mum is constantly falling on and off the SW band wagon and has never kept her weight off. It's because she sees it as a one off diet, rather than a healthy lifestyle change. She can't understand how I can eat big pieces of cake and still lose weight , it's simple for most people: Calories in, calories out.

@BrandNewShinyThings I really don't see how I am 'part of the problem'. My only point was that diets do work - but you have to be them permanently. So I don't agree with the blanket statement 'diets don't work' because they do for me. You obviously feel differently. Neither of is is right or wrong, but we do disprove the blanket statement made by the OP.

I think a poster had it right when they more or less said that if you 'go on a diet' it implies that when you've lost the weight, you come off the diet, which is where it all falls down.
I was always slim until I got to my mid 40s then the weight very gradually began to creep on. You really don't have to overeat very much at all to put on 2 or 3 pounds a year. I mean, that is probably just the cumulative effect of ten years or so of christmas and summer holiday indulgence. What you must not do is what I did and ignore it, because after 10 years you are 25 or 30 pounds overweight and having trouble shifting it, because it really does get more difficult to do so as you get older.
I am working on the same principle that made me put the weight on in the first place, by creating a small calorie deficit each day. Our diet has always been very healthy, but my portions were simply a bit too big. I have lost a stone in 9 months and have one more stoneto lose. This is something I can keep up because I don't feel deprived at all. I really can't stand diets that leave you faint with hunger like the fast 800. It simply isn't a way of eating that is sustainable as far as I'm concerned.

@reedwarbler I'm the same - eating the right food but too much of it. I've reduced my portions over the last 6 weeks and have lost dimensions (don't have scales, so I'm measuring instead). But I see this as a permanent change, not a diet. I'm not depriving myself of anything in particular - just making sure that I don't eat too much of it.

To me, a diet has an end point and this doesn't.

I think it's true the body tries very hard to maintain homeostasis, so every time you diet it tries to 'right itself' and also add a little extra hence our amazing survival through time but current obesity problems.

The evidence for treating obesity is pretty poor apart from bariatrics and there are a lot of problems with that too when you talk to people working in those services. I have reviewed the evidence professionally. Losing a modest 5% and keeping it off has the best evidence for health improvement I believe.

However, I do meet eg obese youngsters in my work who have been taught crap eating habits and when they change them they lose weight easily. I also think eating can be wrapped up in emotional problems and I think those people can lose weight if they get happier first and don't need their weight to keep them safe anymore. People are different and obesity is complex.

I think that the secret to losing weight and keeping it off is to replace high calorie meals with lower calorie meals which you really enjoy and in quantities that keep you satisfied. It takes time to find out what works for you but then you aren't tempted back to poor choices because you actually prefer your new meals. Don't go too low in terms of calories, you're in it for the long term (ie for good), lose slowly and it is more likely to stay off. I have lost over 4 stone since 2016. "Diets" fail because you are eating too little for it to be sustainable or because you don't really like what you're eating. It is a very individual thing, takes a lot of trial and error to work out what suits you.

@ScrapThatThen love this comment, so insightful. Interestingly, the scientist in that talk I linked to did say that it's difficult to lose weight with mindfulness/IE unless you habitually overeat.

It all becomes a bit philosophical - diet, lifestyle change, habits etc.
If you learn about nutrition you don't need sw, ww, keto etc.

I think most of us know that when you stop a 'diet' you tend to revert back to old habits and put the weight back on.

It's very hard to change habits long term as it's typically slow if you want them to stick. Looking at the weight loss threads people don't want to wait years to get their weight down and a drastic change produces quick results and is an initial motivator but often it isn't sustainable as you haven't cemented any good habits in that time.

Like most people on here I have followed many diets in the past, some successfully in the short term.

I have finally changed my relationship with food but it took a long time and had to come to my own realisation about how following 'diets' didn't work for me.

My parents have been doing the 5:2 diet for years. They initially lost the weight they needed to lose, about a stone each, within a few months of starting, and since then have carried on for the other health benefits. They intend to do it forever. I think it depends what you mean by ‘diet’, your diet is just what you happen to eat, after all, whether it’s healthy, unhealthy, faddy, restrictive, eating whatever you want to eat, etc.

YANBU, and much of dieting culture is deeply toxic. The only thing that works is to change your relationship with food and your body, away from self - loathing and deprivation and towards understanding what you want and need to eat and how it makes you feel. I'd definitely recommend the book Intuitive Eating, or the same principles but more lightly written, The F*uck It Diet.
I'm still 'on the journey' to acceptance but im more relaxed and at peace with my body, enjoying the food I eat, and enjoying movement that my body needs. It's a world away from eating artificial crap that is fat free but rammed with rubbish, confessing to your group you ate pizza 😱 or trying to eat 10 muller lights in place of the 1 piece of chocolate you actually want. The amount of people who are like 'oh yes I lost 4 stone, it really works.- of course I regained it all when...' Of course the companies want you to regain it all - it's literally the business model 😂

@TacosTuesday your post really resonated with me. I've had a similar experience. Agree it's a journey but I am so much happier and more content for it.

I think you have to consider what you mean by diets "working". Yes, most people put weight back on. But if they never went on that diet, they might have continued gaining and be way over their original weight. Many people find that a cycle of dieting, then relaxing does work to keep them at a certain level. That level might be overweight or even obese, but not morbidly so.

And sorry but diet alternatives ("lifestyle change", "new way of eating", "intuitive eating") don't work either (probably because they are diets, just with a different name). It's the exact same cycle of trying something, lose weight, then get bored/hungry/life gets in the way and stop doing it.

@RaisinGhost I'm not convinced that the diet/binge cycle is healthier to be honest. Did you watch the talk I linked? The neuroscientist who gave it cited research that found intuitive eaters were more likely to have a healthy bmi than dieters.

I think over time losing and regaining weight is a) rough on mental health and b) puts you in danger of lowering your metabolism and push up the weight your body considers normal for you.

Whereas if instead we learnt how to eat when we're hungry and stop when we're full (which is actually a really hard skill for most of us...that neuroscientist said it took her a year! And I, a much more average Joe, am still working on it!) then we wouldn't have the issue of weight gain to deal with. Presumably our weight would just settle in it's set point range.

I don't know, I'm just going on what the research seems to indicate and my lived experience of miserable, unsuccessful dieting. I just have a great deal of empathy for people stuck in this cycle because I know how consuming and crushing it can be.

I gain weight easily unless I constantly monitor what I eat. I can't be fucked with doing that forever. I tend to practice 'intermittent dieting'. I have spells of eating what I please and spells of quite harsh restriction. This works well for me and keeps my weight under control.
I eat lots of veg, am quite active and don't smoke. My appetite far exceeds my calorie needs however, unless I'm really paying attention I just eat too much and my weight creeps up.

The neuroscientist who gave it cited research that found intuitive eaters were more likely to have a healthy bmi than dieters.
Correlation does not mean causation. If eating intuitively worked for me i wouldn't need to diet!

If you’re the type of person to be able to keep weight off by intuitively eating then you’re possibly the type of person that doesn’t have destructive food/weight issues in the first place. People I know who have been slim their whole lives are generally those who intuitively eat and don’t have any compulsion to snack or overeat due to emotional reasons.

I keep my weight steady by not restricting myself, but I do have to count calories most of the time as well, as eating intuitively doesn’t work that well for me as I rarely eat due to hunger, but due to other reasons.

I've lost over a stone just by logging my food and doing cardio 4 times a week. It's kind of my new normal and if I want to have a blow out with my rugby mates I do.
I'm convinced this will work for me.
I despise slimming world and it's approach, yes I lost 4 stone with them, but it went back on again (plus more) really fast when I stopped depriving myself.

Diet's don't work because people don't stick to them. I'd always recommend counselling before a diet, you need to headspace. They don't not work because there's some inherent flaw with them, or physiological reason preventing people from losing fat.

Excluding pregnancy I have never been as heavy as when I first lost weight about 20 years ago. My weight does go up and down a bit, I particularly crave sugar when stressed, but I'd say dieting has worked for me along with cutting down on carbs as a lifestyle change.

The problem is, that we are used to eating way more than what we actually need. Our portion sizes are crazy and they seem normal.
After my second pregnancy i had trouble losing weight because i just ate like always. My portions increased gradually during the pregnancy and when baby was born, thats what i was used to.
I went on a diet and restricted calories to 1000-1200. I was literally hungry for a year! Really hungry! And it was so hard to stick to it.
Its now 4 years later and i eat 1200-1300 calories a day (mostly healthy calories) and i work out 5x a week. Im never hungry anymore. My body got used to smaller portions. And i have kept my weight down in this time.
When i eat out at restaurants i order starter portions, because its plenty. I could never finish an entire meal anymore. When i order pizza with DH if i eat more than half a pizza im so full i feel really bloated for the rest of the day. I used to eat 1 pizza by myself without a problem before.
Its a slow process and it takes a long rime to adjust the body, but it does work if you eat less obviously.

Diets do work.

You diet, you lose weight. You put it back on. You go on a diet and lose it again. Over the course of your life your average weight is healthy.

This is far preferable to never going on a diet and constantly getting fatter and fatter until you are morbidly obese.