To ask if you know diets very rarely work in the long term?

[purplefig]

Lately I've heard so many people (on here and offline) beating themselves up about not being able to lose weight.

It's led me to wonder: do most people still think that diets work?

If so, this talk by a neuroscientist is well worth a watch: https://www.ted.com/talks/sandraaamodttwhydietinggdoesnttusuallywork/details

@BrandNewShinyThings that's exactly it isn't it? Whatever you do to lose it has to be a life change. That's where I've found intuitive eating a huge help - it's taken bloody ages to learn my hunger/satiety cues, but that's something I can do for the rest of my life, I cannot day the same for cabbage soup / low carbs / skipping food on certain days / juice fasting etc.

I think it’s fairly well known. I’m losing generally less than a pound a week which means it’s painfully slow as I have a lot to lose but I don’t mind as I’m prioritising fitness

I think the word "diet" has become so loaded people associate it with different things so having a proper conversation becomes tricky.
You can't wish away weight, so you do need to change eating habits to lose weight. If you want to call that a diet then fine.
But as PP point out, the difficult thing is to maintain loss. A few "diets" or "healthier eating plans" whatever deal with this and set up well for maintenance. But clearly if you do the cabbage soup diet and then go back to eating as you were, you will put all the weight back on again.
So "diets don't work" is not true, it's the type of diet and what you do afterwards that often isn't addressed by the "diet industry" that let's people down.

Yep and if you're someone who really struggles with their relationship with food that's going to be a huge challenge. All those posters who love to say 'eat less move more' have absolutely zero understanding of how hard it can be for so many people, and for so many complex reasons.

[quote purplefig]@BrandNewShinyThings that's exactly it isn't it? Whatever you do to lose it has to be a life change. That's where I've found intuitive eating a huge help - it's taken bloody ages to learn my hunger/satiety cues, but that's something I can do for the rest of my life, I cannot day the same for cabbage soup / low carbs / skipping food on certain days / juice fasting etc. [/quote]
I can manage by eating less than I used to for the rest of my life. And that’s a diet.

If its any help to anyone, my current diet (number 5763) is following the Sweet Poison quit plan and feels less like a diet than anything else I've done before. But I'm only a few weeks in and only lost 3lb so who knows. At this stage I figure just not putting on any more would be a start. I do walk or bike most days so I'm not hugely inactive. But I am jn the obese category and have fluid retention on my ankles so something has to change,

Keeping weight off is usually about permanently redefining your relationship with food and exercise. Some people achieve thiswith a diet, but that is only the first step in the journey. The successful ones usually follow that up with the permanent habit changes. That is the really challenging part, and the reason many people don't keep weight off.

You know everyone has the same chance of death, right?

I'm team sustainable changes, anyhow. I'm pretty good at staying at the top of the healthy bmi range. It's getting to and staying at a point half a stone lighter that doesn't come easily, for me. I can sympathise with people with more to lose and keep off.

if you are overweight (i am) you need to improve the quality and monitor the quantity of food you eat.
what is that if not a 'diet'?

we evolved to want to eat high fat and high sugar foods for energy and then the food industry developed very rewarding high fat and high sugar to meet that 'want'.
to stay healthy we have to actively reject these easy rewards which cannot happen without effort, either conscious effort or developing habits to do it subconsciously.

This is a really interesting discussion - thanks for everyone who has chimed in so far.

In my experience, diets do not work for me. I decided I was fat in primary school (I was not) and from then until mid 20s I was always trying to lose weight. Sometimes I would, but it always came back. I had enough when I got to about 25 and decided I'd wasted way too much energy and time on it. (The book the Beauty Myth really changed how I looked at diet culture).

Then I read up on intuitive eating and it just made so much sense. Eat when you're hungry, stop when you're full. Pay attention to how different foods make you feel. Sounds so simple but so many of us don't do it. Took bloody ages to learn as well 😂

I started this thread as I've had some sad conversations with people berating themselves about their weight.

Anyway - I'll pop back later but DD is up from her nap now.

@ZaraW

I thought it was widely known diets don't work in the longterm and over 90% gain back the weight within 5 years.

So many people on MN have issues with food. I wouldn't listen to a lot of "advice" on here.

Any proof of that 90% figure? It just seems to be trotted out on a regular basis and I've never seen any data to back it up. I know quite a few people (including myself) who have lost weight and kept most or all of it off.

@PickAChew maybe I worded it a bit clumsily! Here: "Healthy lifestyle habits are associated with a significant decrease in mortality regardless of baseline body mass index."

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22218619/

For me it is the restrict/binge cycle that has been so destructive.
I was thinking the other day about all the diets/weight loss methods I've tried over the years. Off the top of my head:

Rosemary Conley (lost 5 stone, felt miserable the whole way through)
Weight Watchers (twice )
Slimming World (three times, fuck off with your star stickers and syns and a clap for losing half a pound )
Slim fast (gross)
Hypnotherapy (worked for a bit, wishful thinking)
Slim pod (listen to it each night)
No S (worked for a long time actually)
Low carb/Atkins
Calorie counting (from a book pre internet)
My Fitness pal
16/8

There's probably more. And I'm still overweight OP because I cannot do any of them long term. So I guess I've proved your point really.

Oh and Intuitive eating. Glad its worked for you OP but I can kid myself I'm hungry any time of day or night. I don't think anyone who is overweight wants to be, its bloody miserable, we all know we are judged for lacking willpower or being lazy. The truth is far more complex.

It is just quibbling about terminology though, isn't it?

I am in my 50s and slim, I have always been slim. I have never, ever, been able to eat whatever I want. I have always taken exercise, eaten healthy food in moderation and not eaten all the cake and puddings I so easily could. I have always stuck by 'nothing tastes as good as slim feels.' So I suppose I have been on a diet my entire adult life. And it has always worked.

Being sanctimonious about dieting is about as helpful as a cabbage soup meal plan. Full of useless gas and liable to make people miserable.

@TheNavigator

It is just quibbling about terminology though, isn't it?

I am in my 50s and slim, I have always been slim. I have never, ever, been able to eat whatever I want. I have always taken exercise, eaten healthy food in moderation and not eaten all the cake and puddings I so easily could. I have always stuck by 'nothing tastes as good as slim feels.' So I suppose I have been on a diet my entire adult life. And it has always worked.

Ah the marvellous oversimplification of one who can walk away from food. Do you have an internal struggle each time you refuse pudding? Do you sometimes get the urge to shovel it all down so fast you can't even taste it? Do you ever feel sickened by your lack of control and disgusted by what you see in the mirror. No, because you are one of the lucky ones who has a magical good relationship with food. Have some empathy for those of us who struggle. Attitudes like yours are part of the problem.

@JustCallMeGriffin

Being sanctimonious about dieting is about as helpful as a cabbage soup meal plan. Full of useless gas and liable to make people miserable.

You said it far more succinctly than me

@BrandNewShinyThings really sorry to hear about people thinking you're lazy - I agree it's such a complex topic. Re: IE, I really don't mean this patronisingly, but the whole point is you don't kid yourself (which I too was very good at)! You have to learn to tell when you're genuinely hungry and work out why you're eating when you're not (e.g. stress, boredom, anxiety, sad).

The food industry has got a lot to blame for all the fatness.

I could easily eat a full packet of commercial biscuits in one sitting and still be hungry afterwards.

I now make my own sugar free biscuits with almonds, xylitol, sultanas and oat bran and I'm struggling to eat two.

Sugar is the problem.

[quote purplefig]@BrandNewShinyThings really sorry to hear about people thinking you're lazy - I agree it's such a complex topic. Re: IE, I really don't mean this patronisingly, but the whole point is you don't kid yourself (which I too was very good at)! You have to learn to tell when you're genuinely hungry and work out why you're eating when you're not (e.g. stress, boredom, anxiety, sad). [/quote]
Yes but I know that. I know I'm eating because I've had a shit day or I am tired or I hate how I look, I'm intelligent and I have great insight into why I am the way I am. That does not help me change what is in my head.

A 'diet' while you are trying to lose weight will work followed by a change of diet combined with exercise to keep the weight you lost off.

@rosiethehen

The food industry has got a lot to blame for all the fatness.

I could easily eat a full packet of commercial biscuits in one sitting and still be hungry afterwards.

I now make my own sugar free biscuits with almonds, xylitol, sultanas and oat bran and I'm struggling to eat two.

Sugar is the problem.

I agree with this, since I cut out sugar I do feel calmer, and none of my previous diets have ever cut out sugar completely. We will see if it works for me. I bloody hope so.

@JustCallMeGriffin 😂😂😂👌🏼

I have got down to a healthy weight at least 4 times in my life. I usually keep it off for a couple of years and then regain it when something happens in my life: a bullying manager, a pregnancy etc.

Those diets didn't fail: life got in the way eventually.

I am glad I've lost weight (even if I regained it). Better that that keep gaining every time something stressful happens to you.