Help - childcare arrangements

[IcyPenguin101]

Hello wise Mumsnetters - long time lurker (penis beaker, Maui, poo knife ) first time poster.

I am hoping to get your wisdom to help with coming up with an out of the box solution to my childcare arrangement issue.

Background: DS father and I broke up before DS (now 5 years old) was born. Initially the contact agreement while he was a baby was visitation at my house, then when he was a little bit older DS father took him for the day, working up to overnight then to the current arrangement we have now with DS father having him EOW (Fri to Sun) - so effectively 4 nights out of 28.

This year DS father had been sick at the start of the year so I had to take on more of the childcare responsibilities. A bit into lockdown he was better so was taking DS a bit more (thurs-fri and thurs-sun). Over the school holidays we effectively split the holidays in terms of care.

It has been on my mind for some time to suggest that we increase DS father’s contact and now seemed like a good time as he had seen DS more over the last 3 months. I broached this the other week and DS father was receptive to the idea. I had originally suggested 1 night a week (for example Thursday) so he would collect DS from school Thursday and bring him back to school on Friday. This is in addition to EOW.

I hadn’t heard anything back from DS father so I followed up with him, his response was to suggest he collects DS from mine at 5pm take him to dinner, bath him then put him to bed AT MINE. I went back and said I didn’t think that would work practically as that would effectively mean I would be stuck at home (not to mention I would need to do the school collection) and would need to be available so I can’t do what I like with my “free time”.

He responded that (i) it’s not about me having free time but about him seeing DS, (ii) lawyers told him (back when we did mediation about 3 years ago) that that was an acceptable approach (maybe for a 2 year old but surely not a 5 year old), (iii) as he’s been sick he can’t get stressed and (iv) as he would have to drive DS to school in the morning (40mins), the way from his house to the school is an awkward route and if there’s an accident (this happens rarely ), the route would be blocked.

AIBU to think this is a ridiculous suggestion from him? I will effectively have to babysit them both and, to be fair, I don’t particularly like DS father (all my family and friends hate him for the way in which things ended) and don’t want him spending loads of time at my house. While things are civil at the moment, it’s because I keep my mouth shut to the ridiculous things he says.

He’s come back with another suggestion of taking him the Friday nights he doesn’t already have DS and bringing him back Saturday morning so an extra 2 nights a month. This is also problematic as (i) it would mean I effectively wouldn’t be able to do “fun” things with DS as often we travel to London to museums etc as it would be too late by the time DS came home to me, (ii) if I were to travel with DS (well when Covid blows over as all my family is overseas) I would usually go on a Friday night and (iii) there may be times I want to have DS for my whole weekend. On the other hand, I may be more amenable to this option if DS father agreed to put him into a sport on Saturday mornings (with the current EOW arrangement it wouldn’t be possible due to the distance between his fathers and my houses) so at least I would feel the time I’m losing with DS would be worthwhile for him. I suspect if I suggest the sport thing DS father will tell me I’m trying to control his time with DS

I have felt the whole way through it’s always him always dictating when he spends time with DS.

So my question is do I (i) agree to the 2 extra Friday nights although DS father will need to be flexible for my travel plans and ask that he put him into Saturday morning sport, (ii) agree to the 2 extra fridays and the stupid few hours at mine the other weeks so there is in total an additional 4 days contact or (iii) does anyone else have any other suggestions??

Thank you for reading if you got this far

I'd keep things as they are.
Like you've said, you can't dictate what he does with your DS on his contact time so the sports class is a no go.
The random hours at your house would be horrendous so that would be a definite no from me.
I wouldn't give up my Friday night / Saturday mornings with DS either.

So basically he wants to have the majority of the relaxed/fun time and none of the time that may require him to put himself out - like school/afterschool club drop offs and pick ups.

No way would I agree to the times he’s suggested

I would just keep things as they are.

The option of not changing hadn’t occurred to me.

Yes, he just wants the easy/fun bits. I almost laughed out loud when he said he couldn’t get stressed with his illness as I thought do you want to see him at all in that case

My mum is telling me to take the Friday nights as at least it is something. I have a stressful job and while I am wfh at the moment, I’m working late into the night when DS is asleep. She thinks I need the extra break.

I need to take control of this situation back.

He has no right to see DS in your home.

Suggest EOW increases to include the Sunday night.

He could collect from school
Midweek and drop him back after dinner.

He could have 50% of the school holidays.

Can't you add the extra night onto his existing time? So he would have DS either Thurs after school til Sun, or Fri after school to dropoff on Mon AM, but still EOW? From what you've said I would expect him to kick off about the first option as he would be solely responsible for the Friday school run, but if he did it the other way he would get an extra night with DS and the only cost to him would be one extra dropoff on the Monday morning.

This would give him (and you) the extra 2 days without disrupting all your current routines too badly.

If he could do a night routine at yours I think that would be positive for your son, but I could imagine that been difficult. I thijk his Friday suggestion is good. Surely putting him in a sports club would make it harder for your outings?

Can you imagine NEVER getting a full weekend with your child? No way would I give up every Friday!

Definite no to both of those. I’d get back to him with “ok let’s just keep things as they are then”.

“I don’t want you in my home” is an acceptable reason not to agree to the first plan - no need to bring anything else you might want to do into the equation. You certainly can’t be made to do this- it might be acceptable if everyone was happy but you can’t be forced. He’s also not supposed to tell you what his lawyer says - if he did that cherry picking bits of his lawyers supposed advice while you were in litigation he could then end up obliged to tell you EVERYTHING that’s been said between him and his lawyer, and he won’t want to do that.

You should stand firm with not wanting to give up more weekend time. Why doesn’t he have ds on the Sunday night of his existing weekends, so he does the school run on Monday morning and then you pick him up? That’s quite a common arrangement- for the weekend to be three nights - and leads to less uniform getting lost.

Having that three night weekend plus a night in the week - usually Wednesday- is also extremely common.

Basically you were suggesting he take over an actual school night so he does some real parenting and he doesn’t want that!

Random and Yambabe - I hadn’t considered the tacking on of the Sunday night on the EOW. See that’s why I love mumsnet, gives me ideas I hadn’t considered

My ideal is the Thursday night every week as that would double my free time from 4 to 8 nights a week. As you’ve pointed out, it’s the school run he has an issue with (to be honest I think that is the real issue and the other excuses are just fluff). He’s complained it would be too much for DS to get him up early to take him to school. I said when I was going into the office he’d be up at 6.30am to be at breakfast club at 7.30am in the dot

I think you are being a bit unreasonable here tbh op, and I sympathise because I'm in a very similar set up with DS dad. I would love him to have him an extra week night but in reality it's not practical as he lives about 40 mins away and he would have to get him and ds up really early then do an 80 min round trip before work and I dont think that's fair. Honestly I'd take the Friday nights as that seems very reasonable and just try and work around any weekend trips you have (let him know a month or so in advance and ask if he would like to swap to say the Thursday and just do the taking him out for dinner option on that week.
I really dislike ds dad but I've had to put it aside so that we cooperate better with childcare, it does make life easier in the long run (even if it means venting to my friends about what a tosser he is)

Stannis - I didn’t realise fri-mon morning plus every wed is the usual arrangement...I may mention this!

Yep, you got it - he doesn’t what to do the real parenting as he “can’t get stressed right now”. It’s laughable as the last 5 years have been the hard work - it’s easy now, relatively speaking!

@AllTheUserNamesAreTaken

So basically he wants to have the majority of the relaxed/fun time and none of the time that may require him to put himself out - like school/afterschool club drop offs and pick ups.

No way would I agree to the times he’s suggested

This was my thought as well

@IcyPenguin101 It might also be time to talk about how things like sports/clubs/parties affect things long term. I know there isn't as much going on at the moment but normality will at some point resume and having been a child who had to give up dance because it didn't work with access arrangements when my parents divorced and DF moved 1.5 hours away I would always urge parents to think about these kinds of things. Children who's parents are not together are just as entitled to see friends, pursue activities and go to birthday parties and spending time with each parent should still allow for this even if it's not terribly convenient.

How about suggesting he extends the EOW so that he picks up from school on Thursday nights does drop off and pick up on Friday and brings him back in Sunday or as pp suggests has him Sunday night to drop off on Monday.

Moustache- it’s frustrating isn’t it!? You are saying what my mum is saying, to basically take what I can get re Fridays. Haha I know re the venting - I think my friends are sick of hearing about it. I just feel annoyed as I have always agreed to change days or extra time or whatever (expect for one weekend when I had children’s theatre tickets) and it just seems to be whatever he says goes

It is shit op but tbh I try and think of it as the fewer days he sees DS the less of a bad influence he can be on him and the more he has to contribute to his upkeep 🙈 (and I dont just say that in a snarky bitter ex kind of way, ds dad spent the first 2 years of ds life in prison 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️)
Despite all of that and the underlying frustrations you have he does have some valid points about logistics and practicalities which can be hard to admit particularly when you are annoyed and feeling a but burnt out.

[quote TheTeenageYears]@IcyPenguin101 It might also be time to talk about how things like sports/clubs/parties affect things long term. I know there isn't as much going on at the moment but normality will at some point resume and having been a child who had to give up dance because it didn't work with access arrangements when my parents divorced and DF moved 1.5 hours away I would always urge parents to think about these kinds of things. Children who's parents are not together are just as entitled to see friends, pursue activities and go to birthday parties and spending time with each parent should still allow for this even if it's not terribly convenient. [/quote]
Luckily birthday parties have fallen on most of my weekends. There have been 2 on DS father’s and, to be fair to him, he took DS to one and agreed to the other but it was then cancelled due to Covid.

I’m all for sports/groups on weekends. My childhood was spent doing hockey, ballet, jazz ballet etc. With the EOW as they stand, it would be difficult for DS to do sports on weekends. I don’t have a car (if they are near DS father’s house) and DS father would never agree to driving back to my area on his weekends for DS to participate. It’s for the sports reason I was almost willing to give up my Saturday mornings with DS so he could participate in these things (though I know his fathers reaction will be that I’m trying to dictate the time).

I can’t win!

What was/is wrong with your ex? Is it mental health issues? Toilet related issues? What’s the problem with doing one school run a week?

Seems to me he’s just plain lazy. Does he work?

I definitely wouldn’t agree to the Friday nights, you need weekend time with your DS as well. Him spending time with your DS at your house is also off the table. Fetching from school on a Friday and returning to school on a Monday would dramatically increase your free time and his time with your son.

@Elieza

What was/is wrong with your ex? Is it mental health issues? Toilet related issues? What’s the problem with doing one school run a week?

Seems to me he’s just plain lazy. Does he work?

Haha - no, any of those issues would be easy. To be fair to him he had 2 serious health issues one after another - the kinds you wouldn’t expect a mid-40s person to have.

I think he just doesn’t want the hassle. He wants minimum impact to his routine. He works (wfh at the moment) and it’s not like he goes out (even pre-Covid).

I would just reply "Oh I thought you wanted to be more involved in parenting DS and being involved in his life. Don't worry about it, DS can always Skype if he wants to see you."

@DontTouchTheMoustache

It is shit op but tbh I try and think of it as the fewer days he sees DS the less of a bad influence he can be on him and the more he has to contribute to his upkeep 🙈 (and I dont just say that in a snarky bitter ex kind of way, ds dad spent the first 2 years of ds life in prison 🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️) Despite all of that and the underlying frustrations you have he does have some valid points about logistics and practicalities which can be hard to admit particularly when you are annoyed and feeling a but burnt out.

It is shit . Sounds like you’ve had a bit of a difficult time too.

I am trying to do the right thing and fostering a good relationship with the two. When I said his suggestion of coming to my house wasn’t going to work as I would likely want to be out - he said it’s not about me dating or having fun (he also actually asked me where I would be going/what I was planning to do that time!!), it’s about him seeing DS. So from that statement alone you can tell it’s all about him (and not really DS).

Just see him as a "uncle" role
I wouldn't be keen to have someone with those sort of attitudes a huge part of your DS life.

Can you focus on fostering some good friendships where you can swap sleepovers/after school play dates etc that are reciprocal?

Paid babysitters for going out.

@RandomMess

Just see him as a "uncle" role I wouldn't be keen to have someone with those sort of attitudes a huge part of your DS life.

Can you focus on fostering some good friendships where you can swap sleepovers/after school play dates etc that are reciprocal?

Paid babysitters for going out.

Sadly all my family live overseas so I’m here on my own. I do have 2 babysitters and would use them pre-Covid say 1-3 times a month. The issue is their day jobs are a paramedic and prison officer so with Covid, I’d prefer to limit that potential exposure.

As I work a lot I don’t really know any of the school mums. I should make more of an effort though. I’m not sure I’d be comfortable with sleepovers yet as he’s 5.

Argh, there’s never an easy answer 😩 If only DS father was a little more flexible 😩