Wealthy people living in Housing Association houses?

[Bookofdead]

Before I start, can I just say I am absolutely NOT making a dig at anyone that lives in HA properties. This thread is for information purposes for a relative of mine.

I have a relative who retired a few years ago and was struggling to make ends meat. She wanted to be able to give her DC some money for a house deposit and free up some equity to live on as she was struggling on her pension. She sold her house and bought another but in a not very nice area and one which was an hour away from family (it was the best she could afford) After 2 years, her car being vandalised and and house being broken into, she wanted to be in a nicer area but couldn’t afford to do so in the county she was in. As such, she made the decision to move 300 miles away from all her family to the other side of England where property was more affordable and she could get a small house in a nice, safe village. This was 2.5 years ago now and she came back for a visit last month, I think COVID has hit her hard in terms of she was isolated, alone in her house for months whereas she used to come back here for visits and to see her family every 6 weeks or so.

I’ll cut to the chase, I really miss her, her children really miss her but none of us are in a position to offer her a home with us at the moment. Now this isn’t 1st world problems, she’s got a house and is safe, roof over her head etc I know. My issue is...

I have often thought ‘I wonder if she could apply for a HA house around here.’ There are some really nice ones in nice villages all around us. I thought no, she really doesn’t have a lot of money but ultimately she’s probably got about £100k in her house so she DOES have a house and an asset so wouldn’t be eligible.

I have a horse and years ago used to keep it at a yard with another lady who had a very expensive horse, a nice lorry, a good job etc yet she had a HA house?

Yesterday I was on FB and saw a post on a local village community page from ANOTHER lady I used to keep horses with asking if anyone wanted to swap houses? It was clear from the post that she meant HA houses. This lady has 2 horses, a new trailer and 4x4, multiple foreign holidays a year and her husband runs his own successful business.

Now I’m sat here thinking, hang on, what is the criteria for HA housing then and would my relative be entitled? Don’t get me wrong, I like both of the above mentioned women, but It just seems wrong that they lead relatively affluent lifestyles and can get a HA around here in nice villages, close to their family and friends yet someone like my aunt has had to move 300 miles away to the other side of the country away from everyone she knows in her older age in order to be in an area that she feels safe? (This isn’t anyone else’s problem I know and like i said above, it’s not a 1st world problem at all but I am now starting to think I’ve had this all wrong and you don’t have to be on the bare bones or your arse to get a HA house?)

@lyralalala Even an incentive for the singletons to swap to the 2 bed houses might make a difference. But building more properties for single people/older couples would solve some of the issues. I know of a couple with 3 DCs who had to move from their 2 bed HA to a 3 bed private rent as they were so desperate for space - whilst one of their parents was living in a large 3 bed HA around the corner with her partner.

Her children should be ashamed of themselves.
Not in a position to house her, when they’re living in houses they’ve only got because of her money.

In my area the council/HA only take your circumstances at the time of applying and moving in into account.

I got my house years ago, and I am working hard to change my financial circumstances, I will absolutely not be leaving my house though.

Cheap rent, good area, my dc are settled, and I went through hell to get this place

What I choose to spend my money on out with my rent is totally my own business.

Why do people always think they are entitled to comment negatively on council and HA tenants?

As pp have stated it really depends on your area op, here she wouldnt even get on the list because she has property.

@Barton10 I thought that was because of the Localism Act

www.insidehousing.co.uk/insight/insight/the-rise-and-fall-of-council-housing-56139

Slum clearance in the 1930s combined with the impact of the Great Depression brought a poorer working class into council housing for the first time, and with it some of the perceived problems and demonising stereotypes applied to council tenants more generally in recent years

The policy shift reflected a political division between Conservative politicians who believed council housing should properly be reserved for the neediest (the market would provide for the rest) and those on the left who saw it as serving ‘general needs

All that made for, in one word, residualisation: the increasing confinement of council housing (and by this time social housing) to the poorest of our citizens and, disproportionately, those classified as ‘vulnerable’ in some way. (That estates continued, in fact, to house a cross-section, albeit a narrower one, of our community goes without saying.)

In the 1980s, residualisation may have been a partly unintended consequence of housing policies pursued with varying ideological intent

Since 2010, and more so since the return of single-party Conservative government in 2015, we’ve seen something further: welfarisation – ‘a conception of social housing as a very small, highly residualised sector catering only for the very poorest, and those with additional social “vulnerabilities”, on a short-term “ambulance” basis

There are too many who genuinely need them because they just cannot afford to be housed elsewhere, yet they are stuck in temporary accommodation because families much better off than them won't release the property

No Its because social housing is being demolished and replaced with luxury homes. John Boughton also covers this in his book.

My friend had a morgage on a house part own part buy ,but couldn’t afford the repairs
So she got a housing association house twice the size.
However the rent is really high ,and only slightly less than to rent from a landlord..

She can put her name on the list, anyone can, although it would prob take a very long time. Or get one of the retirement scheme properties. They are cheaper.

Is it unlikely anyone here has actually applied for one? I have, you have to prove you can pay the rent and earn a decent income. The rent is not cheap. I pay £900pm for a 3 bed house.

A mortgage on the same house would likely be a lot less and I would have an asset. Instead I pay all that rent and never own anything. Also the tenancies for HA are not for life anymore they are 5 year contracts

If I get promoted at work I should leave my house?

She clearly couldn't afford to give the money to her children, so it's pretty sad they took it off her. They need to help her now.

So what happens when you retire and still need to pay the £900 a month ,yet your not working,
where a morgage will be ended

@Pringlemonster

In an ideal world I would have saved enough to get a mortgage but how can you save up 15% or whatever it is with children to pay for, one income and high rent? I perhaps might meet a partner to buy a house with, but I might not. I will have to work till I’m 68 anyway, and I have a good work pension, so I need to prepare for that time by getting savings to last me.

If none of these things pan out I will have to keep downsizing property under the HA if I am allowed to, and then when I am too old and retired and if I have no money I will have to claim housing benefit. You would need to downsize though as the bedroom tax would clobber you if you stayed in 3 bedroom

@zingally

With a good asset (a house) and some savings, she's be SOOO far down the waiting list, that she'd probably be long-dead before she got to the top.

Sorry.

That may well be bollocks given that you dont know the areas and the relative is eligible for sheltered housing schemes because of her age.

OP - well worth phoning some schemes for older people locally. Plenty will have availability for someone in her position.

For the record dm is in a HA flat for retired people. She pays full rent which covers an on-site warden, launderette etc. She sold her house years ago and is using the proceeds to top up her pension.

She gets plenty of offers from other schemes with vacancies.

Our HA is systematically raising the rents to 80% of 'local achievable rents.' They say it will be happening everywhere and the idea is to move lower earners out of areas where the HA's could be making more money from their properties. It's a generally very well off area with some social housing properties

Im guessing this HA has a hearing problem. They obviously misheard clap for key workers as crap on key workers.

The purpose of introducing "affordable " rents at 80% of the local market rent is to raise income to build more houses. There is no intention to force anyone out but if you want more houses, the money has to come from somewhere.

In real life, many of those who successfully bid on these more expensive properties are a mix of people on full benefits who are not affected by cost, and couples with lower banded housing needs who are glad of the 20% cheaper rent and who would never have got to the top of a list for a social rent property.

My cousin emigrated to Australia about 15 years ago. He kept on his council flat and sublets it. This is all kind of wrong. He said, very defensively, that if it didn’t work out in Australia, they would need somewhere to come back to. Another cousin of mine has a lovely council flat in a very desirable area of London. She also has a holiday home on the south coast, which she has bought since having the flat.

So has he residency in aus or aus nationality now? He just can’t justify it can he?

I know someone who did that (he didn’t move to aus!) but rented out their council flat in London and moved out. He was such a ‘I’m a right on socialist, me’ too.

I never understand why councils are so weak on this issue. Look at Grenfell Tower - apart from the obvious tragedy it was a disgrace that the council had turned a blind eye to the fact that masses of the occupants weren’t the legal tenants. Some of the disgusting f-ers even claimed to have been in there when they were living somewhere else on their subletting profits. I wonder if the council has changed at all?

I knew a girl at work (admittedly this was the 90s) who had a really nice council flat in Clapham - in a Victorian conversion, not a high rise. She sublet it and lived with her mum. She said all her friends got council flats because you got your mother to write to the council and say their dd was in danger of being abused by stepfather/ mother’s partner.

Friend of mine sublet a nice Peabody flat; the true tenant collected the rent in cash every week from his “friend” as she was instructed to call herself should the council check.

Poor lady. I think its shameful that her kids took money off her when she cant afford a house in a safe area near her family.
She shouldn't be entitled to a HA house because she has a house, but I dont agree that people should get to keep their HA house when they no longer need it. They should be for people who truly need them, we have far too many homeless people.

Could she downsize to a flat near you? I cant imagine allowing my mum to live so far away even now but especially not when she's 70.

Helana Dove
Im guessing this HA has a hearing problem. They obviously misheard clap for key workers as crap on key workers.

Spot on! I'll be pinching that for the next meeting if you do't mind.

@Yoloyohol Our HA is systematically raising the rents to 80% of 'local achievable rents.' They say it will be happening everywhere and the idea is to move lower earners out of areas where the HA's could be making more money from their properties. It's a generally very well off area with some social housing properties

Oh really? The HA actually told you that, did they? Or is it that you've assumed that scenario is generally occuring (like it is in many areas)? There are many other factors that contribute to this but it will more than likely be private landlords and market rents that are causing this scenario. The cap on "affordable" rent prices is usually set by the government or LA. Some affordable rent is capped at 80%, yes the rent prices may have been under this previously and increased up to the 80% (as happens in line with annual rent increases/decreases depending on the HA's financial state). It may also be for the HA to survive and regenerate housing stock when they are losing it, they do have to have an income to do this as although there would be some financial assistance, the government does not fully fund new housing. So if private landlords are all charging roughly £1500 for a property (say a 2 bedroom flat) the HA can charge 80% of that as per guidelines.

The problem is with the private rented sector, it's not regulated enough when it comes to both UK based and foreign investors buying up large areas and either renting them out at extortionate prices or hanging onto them, completely empty as assets and making a profit in years to come. We face a housing crisis and that is vastly adding to it.

RTB eligibility is also dependent on type of tenancy and year which they started renting, amongst other factors. It won't be the HA that set the criteria for this when the RTB scheme came in for HA tenants, it was trialled first and further criteria set as a result.

Please do your research first and if someone who works in a HA actually told you that this is what the plan is by the HA, they do not understand the business model of the organisation they work for.

Oh really? The HA actually told you that, did they? Or is it that you've assumed that scenario is generally occuring (like it is in many areas)?

No assumptions. We were informed directly by our tenancy manager. We were told that while many have assured tenancies we will still need to make financial plans for our futures because of this, and there have been attempts to discuss what those may be with us individually.
The reason given for having a right to know what our financial situations were projected at, was that those with assured tenancies can make applications to be rehoused in cheaper areas.

I know of someone who had their own home but felt they weren't managing as well as they used to. They moved to a LA flat in another county to be nearer to relatives. All quite quickly.

Thing is, that larger private house is freed up for someone with a bigger family to buy. They might move from a LA or HA place to buy it. Does it really matter?

Our HA is systematically raising the rents to 80% of 'local achievable rents.' They say it will be happening everywhere and the idea is to move lower earners out of areas where the HA's could be making more money from their properties. It's a generally very well off area with some social housing properties

My HA rent has gone down over the last 3 years as the LA introduced the cap which meant that many properties were over priced. Incidentally mine is one of only 4 HA properties on an estate of 30 3/4 bedroom homes, so pushing us out is obviously not on their agenda.