To ask the mask police to please PLEASE stop

[PennyDreadfuI]

Another mask thread but I'm not going to apologise because I'm absolutely at the end of my tether with this sort of thing.

I can't wear a mask because I have trigeminal neuralgia and I've lost count of the stares, comments and filthy looks I've had (and yes, I do wear a lanyard, even though I'm not keen on advertising the fact that I have a hidden health condition). I've heard of people not being allowed on buses, being challenged by staff to explain their reason for exemption and being told they can't enter shops despite being exempt (none of which is legal). I've been told I should wear a visor (I can't, and they're next to useless anyway - Scotland have just banned them unless they're worn with a mask), that I should just stay at home (I can't and neither do government guidelines suggest I should), that I shouldn't use buses (I don't drive and can't walk long distances or cycle because I have inflammatory arthritis) and that I'm selfish (I'm not - if I could wear a mask, I would).

I understand this is a contentious issue but please, can people just think for a minute before they judge or comment? Exemptions are there for a reason - those who are sticklers for The Rules should surely accept and respect this one, too. It's awful that people are too scared to go out for fear of what's essentially discrimination.

The pandemic is bad enough by itself - let's not lose our sense of empathy and humanity, too.

And knowing that I am not the expert in pip forms and how to fill them in, I looked online, read the information where it advised you to go to the CAB for help to fill them in, and went to the CAB for help.

www.gov.uk/pip/how-to-claim

Why did you not do as the gov advise? They tell you to get help to fill in the form.

Thankfully you can Change that and go to cab for help now. Good luck.

You are actually so determined to be contrary now it’s clear for anyone to see.

It’s in you if you haven’t done the process in the way the govt tell you to.

That is called taking personal responsibility.

You made and make a choice not to claim pip. Every day you didn’t go to CAB you made a choice.

Absolutely it should be easier and absolutely you shouldn’t need t go to tribunal.

But you definitely won’t get it if you don’t apply. And you haven’t.

I haven’t interrogated you.

You have listed your medical conditions in various posts.

In the Equality Act a disability means a physical or a mental condition which has a substantial and long-term impact on your ability to do normal day to day activities.

You are now saying your conditions don’t impact your ability to do normal day to day activities and that is why you can’t get PIP.

Which is it?

I don’t care what your conditions are but of what you listed immune suppression and diabetes are the ones particularly relevant to COVID but neither seems to disable you based on what you have said. Arthritis might be disabling you but then you claim it doesn’t. You were given the right advice about PIP and ignored it. Report your worst typical day not an average day. That’s what they need to know. What you are dealing with on a bad day when the RA is flaring and the IBD is playing up and that impacts your blood sugars and you feel lousy. They don’t know if you don’t tell them.

Martyrdom is exhausting. Cut it out.

Also, I did not make out pip was easy to get . I did not comment on that at all. You have said I did something I did not do. That is unfair unwarranted and a lie. I never said it was easy or difficult. I merely pointed you to places who could assist you.

Shielding teachers aren't back at work yet and plenty of them.have been on here expressing their fear at what they are going to.be facing (and rightly so).**

Meanwhile, the rest of the public sector have been working since day one. Police officers, prison officers and obviously the NHS. What about shop workers and bus drivers?
The teachers trade unions put pressure on the government about opening schools to more year groups hence why the rest of the year groups didn’t go back.
People in supermarkets who have contact with hundreds of random people on a daily basis are more at risk than a teacher who atleast knows the children they teach and can control the children’s movements within reason.

When has flu wreaked this havoc in the UK in living memory? When have you witnessed whole hospitals turned over to.it, ITU beds increased many times over - because of flu? It isn't comparable. My drs have never told me to shield during flu season. That tells me all I need to know.

When has flu wreaked this havoc in the UK in living memory?
Flu killed 64 000 in Jan 2018. 64000. In one month.
That's more deaths in one month from flu than for all of the deaths from COVID. 'But that's with a lockdown!' you might say.
Nope - the timing of the peak of the deaths meant that it was unaffected by lockdown. The fatality rate followed a bell curve, just the same as it did everywhere, regardless of timing of lockdown, strictness of lockdown, and whether masks were mandated or not.

When have you witnessed whole hospitals turned over to.it, ITU beds increased many times over - because of flu?
Hospitals are often overwhelmed during a bad flu season.
It did happen in a few at the height of the COVID epidemic too, but not so that the 'whole hospital' was taken over. Nor were the Nightingale hospitals were needed. They were never used.
We haven't been at epidemic levels for COVID since mid May.

It isn't comparable.
It is.

My drs have never told me to shield during flu season. That tells me all I need to know.
Our government panicked. The whole world panicked. And now we're all paying the price. Every single one of us, but in very different ways.

The mask police are the general public. How exactly can you tell some busy body what to do?
People have been told to wear masks and nobody really wants to. I think the problem is people get angry seeing other people not wearing them, because they aren’t happy about the mask situation either.
I really don’t give a toss if someone where’s a mask or not.

I have helped many hundreds of patients access benefits they are entitled to receive - though it was in the days of DLA.

Yes it’s hard. I’m sure it suits the public purse if the weak and vulnerable don’t manage to claim.

Patient associations offer support to ensure you are properly assessed.

So you have a choice. Let Boris keep the cash that should be in your pocket - donate that cash to all of us by not claiming it - or give your head a wobble and draft a PIP form based on your worst day and not a usual day. You need to live through the worst days and on those days you might need to spend money on taxis. That’s what it’s for.

@Noneformethanks

You are actually so determined to be contrary now it’s clear for anyone to see.

It’s in you if you haven’t done the process in the way the govt tell you to.

That is called taking personal responsibility.

You made and make a choice not to claim pip. Every day you didn’t go to CAB you made a choice.

Absolutely it should be easier and absolutely you shouldn’t need t go to tribunal.

But you definitely won’t get it if you don’t apply. And you haven’t.

We don't even have a bloody CAB here. We did and it closed down about five years ago so will you quit with the "oh it's on you for not having done X, y and z" within a system that is so flawed and complicated that thousands of people don't claim or miss out on it. I looked into it, I did an on line eligibility check - it seemed like a waste of an advisors time to ask them to help me fill in forms for something I appeared to not be eligible for. I then contacted a charity who told me to fill it in based on my worst day - that didn't sit right with me. They didn't tell me to go to CAB. They told me how to register to get the application forms and then to complete them thinking about my worst day. They didn't say government advise is to go to CAB, more fool you if you don't.

But you know, carry on. Does it make you feel superior somehow to gloat over how useless and inept I am? I am not emotionally ready to accept that I am at this stage. I don't want to be here and I don't accept it so stop forcing your views and values into me.

You can access help to do it if you want to - it’ll be over the phone just now anyway.

You are not superior to me because I get pip and you don’t.

From the equality act guidance - relevant to conditions like RA where you have good and bad days. The charity was correct. Contact them again they will help with the PIP form if you don’t have a CAB nearby. I would recommend the charity anyway as they understand the likely impact of your specific illness. CAB would and should help but don’t always understand the diseases.

Recurring or fluctuating effects
C5. The Act states that, if an impairment has had a substantial adverse effect on a person’s ability to carry out normal day-to-day activities but that effect ceases, the substantial effect is treated as continuing
if it is likely to recur. (In deciding whether a person has had a disability in the past, the question is whether a substantial adverse effect has
in fact recurred.) Conditions with effects which recur only sporadically or for short periods can still qualify as impairments for the purposes of the Act, in respect of the meaning of ‘long-term’ (Sch1, Para 2(2), see also paragraphs C3 to C4 (meaning of likely).)
C6. For example, a person with rheumatoid arthritis may experience substantial adverse effects for a few weeks after the first occurrence and then have a period of remission. See also example at paragraph B11. If the substantial adverse effects are likely to recur, they are
to be treated as if they were continuing. If the effects are likely to recur beyond 12 months after the first occurrence, they are to be treated as long-term. Other impairments with effects which can
recur beyond 12 months, or where effects can be sporadic, include Menières Disease and epilepsy as well as mental health conditions such as schizophrenia, bipolar affective disorder, and certain types of depression, though this is not an exhaustive list. Some impairments with recurring or fluctuating effects may be less obvious in their impact on the individual concerned than is the case with other impairments where the effects are more constant.

YANBU but I suspect this thread is a waste of time because it won't reach the people you want.
The issue is people who can't be bothered wearing masks don't give a shit so actually you are wasting your time if you think having a go at them will help quite aside from the fact that you could be having a go at someone who has a valid reason not to wear a mask. So by being a dick and confronting someone who isn't wearing a mask you will only upset people who are genuinely unable to wear them cos the other people don't care!
In short

• People who can and don't wear masks are dickheads.
• People who confront people (especially those wearing lanyards etc) not wearing masks are also dickheads.

These people have always been dickheads, mask wearing just gives some people an outlet for their dickheadery!

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

It’s also not unusual if you aren’t ready to seek support.

But if you aren’t ready to seek support it’s time to recognise that’s your issue. So stop focusing on people who can’t wear masks. Your issues are nothing to do with them. You are directing your anger and frustration at the wrong target. Which is understandable but it’s not ok. Find a healthier way to manage your emotions.

[quote MMN123]**@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

It’s also not unusual if you aren’t ready to seek support.

But if you aren’t ready to seek support it’s time to recognise that’s your issue. So stop focusing on people who can’t wear masks. Your issues are nothing to do with them. You are directing your anger and frustration at the wrong target. Which is understandable but it’s not ok. Find a healthier way to manage your emotions.[/quote]
I agree with this.

Your life is hard @Hearhoovesthinkzebras. It’s challenging for you. No one would deny that.

But you are lashing out.

Take the help. Or don’t. But if you don’t don’t complain there’s no help.

@MMN123

I haven’t interrogated you.

You have listed your medical conditions in various posts.

In the Equality Act a disability means a physical or a mental condition which has a substantial and long-term impact on your ability to do normal day to day activities.

You are now saying your conditions don’t impact your ability to do normal day to day activities and that is why you can’t get PIP.

Which is it?

I don’t care what your conditions are but of what you listed immune suppression and diabetes are the ones particularly relevant to COVID but neither seems to disable you based on what you have said. Arthritis might be disabling you but then you claim it doesn’t. You were given the right advice about PIP and ignored it. Report your worst typical day not an average day. That’s what they need to know. What you are dealing with on a bad day when the RA is flaring and the IBD is playing up and that impacts your blood sugars and you feel lousy. They don’t know if you don’t tell them.

Martyrdom is exhausting. Cut it out.

What are you talking about?

The PIP criteria is very narrow - mobility, getting washed and dressed, getting food, cognitive ability - when you look at mobility for example zero points is scored if you can walk 200 metres even with an aid which includes a stick or frame. Zero points. Would you class someone walking with a frame as not disabled, yet they wouldn't get any points in a PIP assessment. It doesn't mention pain, frequent joint dislocations, fatigue, dizziness, fainting, breathlessness does it? Simply able to walk 200 metres with an aid if necessary. So I haven't said my conditions dont impact my daily life, they bloody govern and dictate my daily life. I go to work, come home and go to bed. Friday, Saturday and Sunday I'm in bed. I can't eat proper food, I'm scared to be away from a toilet, I can't have a bath without someone else being in the house, I can't get up to go to the toilet at night because my blood pressure is so low overnight that I faint, I have to be careful rolling over in bed because I dislocate my joints - why would I say it doesn't impact my day to day abilities? I said I wasn't eligible for PIP (under the online assessment).

And I don't have diabetes - where have you got that from? Something else you're going to insist I said when I didn't? Where did I say arthritis doesn't affect me? And I don't have RA - where did I say I do?

For someone proclaiming to know all about me and therefore be in a position to judge me you seem to have made many wrong assumptions.

I have conditions not described on here that contributed to me being shielding. I also have a spinal cord stimulator in situ to mask an injury that impacts my life that I haven't detailed on here. You know diddly squat about my illness and the true impact it has on my life but presume to be qualified to judge me - sounds quite like the mask police you claim to despise.

I got full whack PIP for my DS without an advisor.

There is at least one person here convinced he's out to kill them by not wearing a mask, though.

The PIP criteria is very narrow - mobility, getting washed and dressed, getting food, cognitive ability - when you look at mobility for example zero points is scored if you can walk 200 metres even with an aid which includes a stick or frame. Zero points. Would you class someone walking with a frame as not disabled, yet they wouldn't get any points in a PIP assessment. It doesn't mention pain, frequent joint dislocations, fatigue, dizziness, fainting, breathlessness does it? Simply able to walk 200 metres with an aid if necessary. So I haven't said my conditions dont impact my daily life, they bloody govern and dictate my daily life. I go to work, come home and go to bed. Friday, Saturday and Sunday I'm in bed. I can't eat proper food, I'm scared to be away from a toilet, I can't have a bath without someone else being in the house, I can't get up to go to the toilet at night because my blood pressure is so low overnight that I faint, I have to be careful rolling over in bed because I dislocate my joints - why would I say it doesn't impact my day to day abilities? I said I wasn't eligible for PIP (under the online assessment).

If you get assistance to fill in the form you may find you meet more descriptors than you realise. That’s why the govt tell you to go to cab.

[quote MMN123]@Hearhoovesthinkzebras

It’s also not unusual if you aren’t ready to seek support.

But if you aren’t ready to seek support it’s time to recognise that’s your issue. So stop focusing on people who can’t wear masks. Your issues are nothing to do with them. You are directing your anger and frustration at the wrong target. Which is understandable but it’s not ok. Find a healthier way to manage your emotions.[/quote]
I don't have an issue with people not wearing masks. I have an issue with people not wearing masks and ignoring SD, in relation to me.

He gets full mobility, too. It's not just about physically being able to walk. If you can't safely get out without another adult to support, there's up to 12 points for planning a journey and getting around.

@Hearhoovesthinkzebras
Your response confirms what I and others have said.

Yes you are struggling. You have a spinal cord stimulator to allow you to function ffs!

You absolutely should be getting PIP. You simply don’t know how to tackle the assessment. There are people who can help you do that.

But you just explain to them what the impact is when you dislocate a joint or your other conditions have a bad episode or you can’t catch a bus because of IBD even if that only happens every few months.

And stop attacking me you pillock. I’m not the enemy. Nor is anyone else. Recognise help. I know it feels like we are shining a light in your eyeballs and that feels like torture but we’re actually just trying to get you to see the light and find a way to improve your situation. Because it can bloody well be improved.

Must not just

@Noneformethanks

The PIP criteria is very narrow - mobility, getting washed and dressed, getting food, cognitive ability - when you look at mobility for example zero points is scored if you can walk 200 metres even with an aid which includes a stick or frame. Zero points. Would you class someone walking with a frame as not disabled, yet they wouldn't get any points in a PIP assessment. It doesn't mention pain, frequent joint dislocations, fatigue, dizziness, fainting, breathlessness does it? Simply able to walk 200 metres with an aid if necessary. So I haven't said my conditions dont impact my daily life, they bloody govern and dictate my daily life. I go to work, come home and go to bed. Friday, Saturday and Sunday I'm in bed. I can't eat proper food, I'm scared to be away from a toilet, I can't have a bath without someone else being in the house, I can't get up to go to the toilet at night because my blood pressure is so low overnight that I faint, I have to be careful rolling over in bed because I dislocate my joints - why would I say it doesn't impact my day to day abilities? I said I wasn't eligible for PIP (under the online assessment).

If you get assistance to fill in the form you may find you meet more descriptors than you realise. That’s why the govt tell you to go to cab.

And MMN123 advises a charity rather than CAB so which is it?

Mind you they are also sure I have diabetes, which I don't, and RA, which I don't but no doubt will tell me I'm wrong and I do because they are the expert on me.

Can you explain - if you complete these forms based on your worst day, not your typical day, what happens if someone reports you for say going to the gym, on a good day? I've been told to not use the stairs if I go for an assessment because if they see you using the stairs they will decline the application but I always use the stairs - it hurts like hell and I have to go up and down one at a time but I'm determined to carry on because I have stairs at home so.i have to be able to manage them. So, why would I lie to the assessor and pretend I can't use stairs?

Either is good - both are options. It isn’t binary. Use which ever one you feel most,comfortable with.

Gosh I’d forgotten what it was like dealing with people who can’t see the wood for the trees!

Seriously. You have significant medical issues. You absolutely quality for PIP. No it isn’t easy. But PIP gives you some space to make choices about how you live. And you need that. You are still young and you have chronic debilitating conditions. You won’t get a medal for battling on without claiming PIP.

@PickAChew

He gets full mobility, too. It's not just about physically being able to walk. If you can't safely get out without another adult to support, there's up to 12 points for planning a journey and getting around.

Yes but that's in the bit specifically about planning a journey.

Where within mobility dies it award points for pain, or dislocations for example? It's very black and white in terms of can you do this - yes or no - rather than well, I can do it,with a lot of pain and some assistance but if I do it then I can't get out of bed the next day - where is that kind of scenario considered?