Countries that have successfully controlled the virus

[Cam77]

... so far. I’m thinking countries which had high numbers relative to their population but, in contrast to the vast majority of other countries, actually managed to get and stay on top of things. Which countries would meet that criteria? Well, from brief look at stats I think certainly China and South Korea. Possibly Malaysia. And that’s about it.

China, for example, had cases in the low thousands for quite a while but has basically not gone above double figures since the beginning of March. The spike in Beijing a month or two ago was no more than an isolated puddle in the end.

At the beginning of July, 10 million students in China safely sat their university entrance exams (their A-levels) and the country has been virtually mask free for a good two months. People are shopping and eating in restaurants, going to domestic leisure spots etc mask free across the vast majority of the country and have been doing so for a couple of months now.

(As an aside, it’s interesting how the Western media has gone pretty silent on China in this regard, only occasionally showing a picture of people wearing masks in Beijing - could it be because that is the only city among China’s 200 cities where masks are still commonplace?Surely not!)

Anyway, I’d be interested to hear from anyone, particularly those who are/were recently living in China and S.Korea recently, what in your opinion allowed their government/society to succeed in controlling it. What did they get right that every other country seems to have failed to do?

@Kayakinggirl

I don't think Korea being mountainous has a lot to do with it. Koreans are flocking to Jeju and Gangwondo every weekend and holiday. You can get from one end of the country to the other in less than four hours.

I also don't think most people work where they live, at least not in the Seoul Gyeonggi area. No one I know has a commute of less than an hour, unless they are young and live in a one room near their work. One of the things I worried about was people spreading it around on public transport.

I don't know how it is near you but where I am the bars and restaurants have been full since April or May at least. I don't think people stopped going out at all really or been particularly careful. The Itaewon gay club thing...for the vast majority of people, they likely thought it was such an extreme case (since he went to 6 or 7 clubs in one weekend) PLUS he's gay so that kind of explains away how he caught it. The mentality for many is "I'M not going to clubs and I'M not gay and I don't hang out in foreigner areas so I'm not going to get it." Gangnam clubs are all packed and have been for months.

The desire to fit in is good sometimes and bad at others eg if your friends decide it's now safe to go out, you will get a ton of pressure to do the same. If your boss says don't bother with masks, the masks will come off even if you think it's a bad idea. I think this is why churches have been such hotspots, because they exert so much pressure on people to come.

The last thing that I disagree with: people don't take more than they need. Have you never seen the Costco restaurant tomato ketchup and hotdog onion soup people? Or heard of the Ikea pencil fiasco? As long as something is provided, people WILL take as much as they can. I guarantee there are grannies out there siphoning off years worth of hand sanitiser daily haha.

Also one of the main factors imo is that Korea has amazing healthcare and Koreans go to hospital for the slightest thing.

But generally I agree with you. Track and trace has worked well and people do generally follow the rules though I see that slipping now a little.

I suspect herd immunity plus they had a lot more people who had Sars, another Coronavirus, so some cross immunity

And the free testing whenever you want has ended now. If you just randomly want a test, you have to pay (70,000 or so). If you want it free, a doctor has to sign off on it first.

@IAintentDead Fewer than 10,000 people were ever diagnosed with SARS worldwide, so that seems unlikely.

OP - you seem to have overlooked New Zealand?? And Australian which someone described above?

(Apparently Mongolia has done well too.)

I think that NZ and Australian shows that a totalitarian regime certainly isn't needed to be effective (not that I think thats what you're saying)

Singapore - it was well controlled at the start, then the numbers started to go up into the 30s, Singapore went into lockdown, migrant worker numbers exploded, 40,000+, all were quarantined. They have almost all been tested now. The number of locally transmitted cases today is zero. I am sure it's not completely eliminated in the community but I think it is well controlled. The government have done a good job in terms of encouraging compliance and making disposable and making reusable masks freely available.

Sweden was able to go with the herd immunity idea, as its a well organised country with a very good healthcare system. But there is still plenty of criticism of how it was handled and that’s fair enough. Britain did the worst of all worlds, namely go for herd immunity and then full lockdown. So high caseloads from not having any restrictions and then severe crash of the economy for having to lock down for longer to get it back under control. There were not enough beds to support the herd immunity approach and not enough support for those suffering at home. Not introducing masks earlier was a mistake too and Cummings was just bad news all round.

It’s still early days for this stupid virus and the nature of exponential growth is that it can start very small. I mean even Auckland is back in lockdown now. Not many countries will do well out of this and honestly, more people will die from secondary effects from lockdown than will from covid. I’m not saying give up, but more that it’s necessary to act decisively and get as much data as possible to keep a lid on it.

People can’t move freely in their own country? Whatever happened to multiculturalism? Has the influx of immigration into the UK “diluted” the culture? Sounds pretty much like racism to me.

Now that is some seriously impressive shilling!

The Chinese government has for many years promoted Han migration to Xinjiang while more recently forcing Uighur labourers to relocate elsewhere. This is in tandem with destroying Uighur neighbourhoods, mosques and graveyards, and placing up to 1 million people in 're-education' camps without trial, based on their ethnic/religious identity.

That is not multiculturalism. It is an explicit attempt to erase one culture, using population transfers and concentration camps.

Sweden is an example of what herd immunity looks like without lockdowns or masks.

Based on serology testing, ~20% of Stockholm was infected by April.

Deaths peaked in Sweden in April.

Today, the pandemic is over in Sweden with zero deaths per day & subsiding new infections
Latest stats but MSM And govt don’t want you to know

pbs.twimg.com/media/EfDhjYtWoAAxO1q?format=jpg&name=large

ER Doc from Sweden on C19: 70% who died >80yo; nonsensical to compare to 1918 flu & draconian lockdowns absurd for infection fatality ratio = 0.12%, comparable to seasonal flu; has disappeared bec Sweden has herd immunity (esp. Tcell-mediated

drmalcolmkendrick.org/2020/08/07/how-bad-is-covid-really-a-swedish-doctors-perspective/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

Herd immunity deniers can’t bear Sweden’s truth

ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2020/august/11/herd-immunity-deniers-cant-bear-swedens-truth/

Also our test and trace isn't compulsory by law. Again, we live in a democracy, and are relying on people doing the right thing. You are asked for your contacts, but you are not obligated by law, or by a policeman or the military waving a gun at you, or to possibly get arrested, to give them those details.

A pretty high percentage of infected people have declined to give contacts. This is perhaps something we should look at, a fine at least, but what you really want is a carrot not a stick.

"So now we know: Sweden got it largely right, and the British establishment catastrophically wrong. Anders Tegnell, Stockholm’s epidemiologist-king, has pulled off a remarkable triple whammy: [...]", writes @AllisterHeath Tweeted by Steve Baker MP (con)

Stgill trying to compare different countries is as pointless as it was in the early days.

To compare Sweden for example to the UK with our population density, international hub for transport etc etc is not a static metric to say x did better than y.

Same as pretending that China are being truthful about their numbers whilst ignoring the fact of them welding shut doors of apartment complexes to try and contain the issue.

It will take a couple of years at least to wash out through the economy to even try and play some point scoring excersise, anyone trying to do so now is just following headlines and twitter likes.

@HopelessSemantics

Jeju has had 4 in Island cases all the rest people have got else where and brought to the island (most caught at the airport). The fact people need to fly (Or use public transport) to get the length of the country means it is more likely to be caught. Ok maybe the mountainous thing may not have much to do with it. More public transport is good so it is used.
There is no Cosco or IKEA in Jeju where I live so have never been to either. I personally see Korea as a very safe country. Where people do just take what they need, the number of honesty boxes for buying fruit, the way the garlic is left drying in the street, that no one locks their cars or bikes up makes me think this. I honestly do think the fact there are clean public toilets with soap and antibacterial gel everywhere, does make a difference. I would not got to public toilets to wash my hands in the UK and antibacterial who’s got stolen from hospitals in the UK.
Everyone I know walks or cycles to work. But that could be to do with the rural nature of the area. As said just going in my own experience and being on an island not the mainland may mean I don’t see the full picture.
Jeju is quite for this time of year. All the local bars and restaurants have been quite since everything started, but I do hangout a lot with expats so we know if we get ill we will get publicly shamed. And most of my friends refuse to go to tourist ones as there are people from Seoul/mainland there.

It seems to me op that all you’re doing here is peddling Chinese propaganda. They are a repulsive regime so I’m amazed that you’re cheerleading for them and minimising the genocide they’re carrying out.

@HopelessSemantics

Yes Korea has done a wonderful job keeping Covid under control (hopefully it stays like that and the Busan cases are a blip). That mainly comes down to track and trace as well as having amazing health care. As well as being quick off the mark to get everything in place.

@Kayakinggirl I think a lot of that is very Jeju specific.

"Also our test and trace isn't compulsory by law. Again, we live in a democracy, and are relying on people doing the right thing. You are asked for your contacts, but you are not obligated by law, or by a policeman or the military waving a gun at you, or to possibly get arrested, to give them those details."

Korea is a democracy. Not all democracies look exactly the same but please don't imply the UK is somehow more democratic because you don't enforce tracking of cases. There are things that happen in the UK that would never be allowed in Korea.

No-one has mentioned Thailand. They have done well & I haven't seen much about what they did right (although I know their tourist industry has taken a terrible blow).

@HopelessSemantics

"Also our test and trace isn't compulsory by law. Again, we live in a democracy, and are relying on people doing the right thing. You are asked for your contacts, but you are not obligated by law, or by a policeman or the military waving a gun at you, or to possibly get arrested, to give them those details."

Korea is a democracy. Not all democracies look exactly the same but please don't imply the UK is somehow more democratic because you don't enforce tracking of cases. There are things that happen in the UK that would never be allowed in Korea.

Well said.

China admitted everyone testing positive to their field hospitals well or ill. That meant they were monitored and given oxygen at the first sign of it falling. The U.K. only took you on when you were dying. When the outbreak kicked off the U.K. told everyone if they thought they had covid not to let them know or their GP.
Even know, if you have a suspected case and have seen your family whilst infectious, they won’t test your family until you come back positive and are telling your family to go to work.

Other countries stood on tv and said “this is shit, were struggling, people are dying”. Our politicians stood on tv like a party political broadcast always saying “look how well we’re doing, world leading (in death rates)”.

@Girlyracer

China tells lies sometimes.

Sometimes ?

HopelessSemantics
OP was talking about China, and I was responding to that.

Thailand has done everything right.

I listened to a very interesting interview with the British ambassador to Thailand a few weeks ago. He chose his words carefully, but in summary he was extremely glad he and his family are in Bangkok.
The only reason Thailand has been taken off the list of safe countries (by the EEC) is because of a petty diplomatic squabble between a EU diplomat and the Thai public health service over quarantine.

I live in Sri Lanka. The population is nearly 21 and a half million. Covid cases in total: 2,888. Deaths: 11. Current Covid cases: 211.
The country went in to curfew (total lock down) in second week of March and lifted it in June from what I remember. Food trucks came door to door to sell. Airports are still closed although they brought back some Sri Lankans living abroad who were held in quarantine. It was amongst them that cases of covid was mostly found and in some navy and army People who looked after them. Schools reopened a week or 2 ago but only for certain year groups with exams and for others it’s about once a week. Masks are compulsory for everyone and there’s a lot of emphasis on washing hands and taking temperature wherever you go(before you enter shops restaurants hotels etc)
I think people here are more scared which helped to keep them indoors. People who did venture out without curfew passes were arrested.