Disappointed secondary schools are reopening

[wovengrass]

I'm hoping for a sensible exchange of ideas on this.
I understand the importance of children missing out on learning, but I can't help but feel that a full reopening of all secondary schools in the UK at the same time is madness.
I strongly feel that it would have been better to spend time/money on making home learning a realistic and standardised solution, as well as putting plans in place for the children that need further support. That way if any future outbreaks happen we aren't just hoping for the best and blindly following this idea that "schools must be the last place to close no matter what."

I also can't get my head around the logistics, locally. The local secondary that my nephew attends (there are several large ones near to me) has over 1000 students, many rely on public transport to get there. With reduced space on transport due to social distancing, I wonder how children will actually all make it to school on time? Many schools are also not allowing children who are late to enter, to avoid the crossing of year group bubbles.

Throw also into the mix that many adult will be relying on the same transport to return to work. I'm genuinely wondering how on earth it is realistic?

I think primary and nursery schools are a different thing entirely, and obviously childcare is a factor then also. But putting 1000 teenagers/young adults + teacher staff into a building with no masks and no country-wide home learning plan if things go wrong, seems absolutely nuts to me.

Just wondering what others think about this?

Beauty salons, ice rinks? But not schools. Right. Strong argument.

So schools will be open as normal in 2 weeks, yet when I go to buy school uniform, I have to wear a mask, strictly two people in the shop at once, huge plastic screens, hand sanitiser on entry, anything being returned goes in a big crate where it can’t be touched.

School children, staff and children mixing in huge numbers with no masks or social distancing is going to be carnage. I await school closures with dread.

Delatron
Seriously did you hear the announcement today? They are opening up more and more. Toddlers can go and roll around in a germy ball pit. Ice rinks are open. Beauty salons.

Soft play, Parents social distance + masks and could limit numbers
Ice rinks. Social distancing, masks, limited numbers + sterilisation of skates.
Beauty salons, visors + masks, limited numbers, sterilisation of equipment.

Secondary Schools 600 - 2000 pupils + adults, no social distancing, no masks, little sanitation never mind sterilisation of equipment.All people being able to spread the virus at adult levels.

I am all for schools going back but if you can't see what a massive fuck up it is then there is no hope for you.

Well me along with millions of others. Or maybe we actually care about the mental health and education of our children.

I actually don’t know anybody in real life who thinks schools should stay shut.

Maybe there’s no hope for any of us!!
Or maybe we have some idea of risk assessment and don’t t want to live our lives shut away in fear. I know who I’d rather be!

Feel free to stay inside for the next year though.

My son and I did some volunteer work at a school earlier this week. All SD When he goes back there in a few weeks, no SD. How does that work?

Delatron
Well me along with millions of others. Or maybe we actually care about the mental health and education of our children.

If you actually cared about the "mental health and education" you would want schools to open up in a sustainable fashion.

I actually don’t know anybody in real life who thinks schools should stay shut.

Neither do I

Maybe there’s no hope for any of us!!

Suit yourself

Or maybe we have some idea of risk assessment

I doubt that you know much about risk assessment.

and don’t t want to live our lives shut away in fear. I know who I’d rather be!
Feel free to stay inside for the next year though.

This just makes you condescending.

Delatron
Well me along with millions of others. Or maybe we actually care about the mental health and education of our children.

If you actually cared about the "mental health and education" you would want schools to open up in a sustainable fashion.

I actually don’t know anybody in real life who thinks schools should stay shut.

Neither do I

Maybe there’s no hope for any of us!!

Suit yourself

Or maybe we have some idea of risk assessment

I doubt that you know much about risk assessment.

and don’t t want to live our lives shut away in fear. I know who I’d rather be!
Feel free to stay inside for the next year though.

This just makes you condescending,

Or maybe we actually care about the mental health and education of our children

I think everyone in this thread does.

Which is why it's in no-one's interest to gloss over the remaining hazards, and who contingency planning is extremely important

You do have choice though? Deregister and home school? I don’t understand the argument.

Send your kids in if you’re happy with the risk. Don’t if you’re not. The schools will be reopening though..

We were sent a transport Ssurvey shortly before the end of term. They are encouraging kids to walk, bike etc rather than get the bus. I don't drive and both my son and I travel on public transport with a staff bus pass as my OH is a bus driver.
The route we take is a busy one and with the social distancing measures in place, buses are running at reduced capacity. By the time the bus reaches our stop, it may already be full, meaning we can't get on. We wait for the next one, chances are it'll be okay by then but what if that one is full too? He's potentially going to be quite late for school as when he gets off he has a hill to walk too! Similarly, not sure how it will work for those kids who get the designated school bus as once at school, they need to be in the year group bubbles. A lot to get your head around with all the changes.

Haven’t 2 schools already closed in Scotland due to COVID

That's better than all of them being closed though. It isn't going to be the case that schools are open whatever, there will continue to be closures locally or where there have been cases, but that's much more sustainable than everything being closed. We have plans if they are to close for a few weeks here, but the epic catch up is already a mammoth task, adding to it will be disastrous. Appreciate the worth though.

@Delatron

You do have choice though? Deregister and home school? I don’t understand the argument.

Send your kids in if you’re happy with the risk. Don’t if you’re not. The schools will be reopening though..

This could be difficult as I am the teacher.

I want the schools to go back, but I want them to go back as safe as they possibly can, and stay open.

This really isn’t a thread about opening or closing schools.

It’s about how to open them safely to reduce the risk of future closures. The governments current plan is extremely optimistic

But what the OP is asking for is something sustainable while schools do have to close not that schools don’t open at all. So with those 2 schools closed in Scotland are they still providing the same work as the ones that are open?

Because that is what the OP is talking about. What happens if some Y11 classes are closing on a regular basis what happens to them? They should be at no more disadvantage than Y11s in areas where the rate is low so their year ‘bubble’ never bursts. They are all taking the same GCSEs in the summer. What is the Government doing to ensure there is a level playing field for all state schools?

Ah I see @FrippEnos

There is no ‘safe’ though is there?

No the kids won’t social distance and yes mine will be getting on a school bus with other kids from different bubbles..

I don't think we can make it completely ‘safe’ but that doesn’t mean children should stay at home any longer.

LaurieMarlow if you're content with the education that you've provided your child since March, then I honestly don't see what your problem is.

You know that your son will be fine, but you're still wanting to micro-manage in hindsight his school? For what end, what purpose does that serve?

As you say, your dc needs much more from a school environment than online lessons or whatever you feel has been missing. I know few people who would disagree with you; of course children need to be in school and obviously would have been if there hadn't been a global pandemic that closed schools across the world.

Schools which continued trying to teach as much of the curriculum as possible, bearing in mind that some subjects like PE, dance, music, drama, science, art, DT aren't possible to replicate at home, and EYFS esp just can't be taught online, still have the issue of children who haven't engaged with home learning for whatever reason.

The only people I know of who don't want the schools to go back are a tiny minority of teachers who've just had a payrise for sitting at home watching Netflix for five months and don't want that to change.

Utter rubbish. My sons school and teachers provided an excellent online education throughout lockdown whilst taking turns of supervising and entertaining children of key workers and vulnerable children. Most of them are happy to be back.

I would have preferred the school to open more slowly with part time school/home learning, until at least October but preferably Christmas, and operating some social distancing. The stream of different aged children and mingling parents yesterday at home time made me very uncomfortable.

Our school has a Plan B and Plan C which were devised before we knew they would be opening full time in August. So they have something to fall back on.

OP I couldn't agree more. Working in a school myself and starting teacher training in September (and pregnant) I'm extremely nervous. I am completely flummoxed by what the government have been doing (or not doing) for the past however many months. The main advice to schools is, distance if you can but don't worry if you can't. That's it. It's totally accepted that playgrounds will be impossible to police, school and public buses ditto. Most classes have far too many kids in to be able to distance so it very much feels like business as usual. To make matters worse, rather than appreciating teachers after homeschooling for months, there still seems to be a strong current among the public of 'bloody unions'. As far as I'm concerned, unions aren't doing enough! Why isn't it being reported on? Even among private teaching groups the attitude from admins is 'stay positive'. Teachers now have to provide lessons as normal with no ppe, also plan home learning for students who are isolating etc, and throroughly clean between classes (ie also be cleaners). IMHO the gov have not been inventive enough at all with options and I completely agree that money and resources should have been put in to ensure a good standard of home learning. So frustrated.

@Delatron

Ah I see *@FrippEnos*

There is no ‘safe’ though is there?

No the kids won’t social distance and yes mine will be getting on a school bus with other kids from different bubbles..

I don't think we can make it completely ‘safe’ but that doesn’t mean children should stay at home any longer.

You are correct that there is no "completely safe" but there is as safe as is possible.

If my school shuts that will be just under 1400 parents that cannot work.

If a year shuts that is approximately 280 parents that cannot work.

I know and you have said that SD in school won't work, but masks would, washing hands would (if there enough sinks).

Pupils having there own equipment.

Wiping down Keyboards, mice and tables would go someway to reducing risk.

There are measures that could be put in place.

@CallmeAngelina

Yep, itsgettingweird, and guess who'll get the blame for that?

Teachers obviously.

Aren't they to blame for everything?

@Delatron

Well soft play centres are open now.

I don’t think anybody can argue that kids lose any more of their education whilst everything else is open.

So the hundred threads a day claiming schools shouldn’t open will finally stop!

It really is a case of deregistering and home schooling if you don’t like it. There’s no argument to be had anymore.

That's not the argument.

The discussion is about what happens if and when cases rise.

If and when some schools in some areas shut?

If and when there's a national lockdown.

How will we ensure parity of education for all with no disadvantage and without widening the gap between rich and poor.

All the year 11's will be taking the same exams.

With no national plan B they won't all be getting the same teaching and learning.

When we go back in September our first week will be planning in case we have to close. So looking at our lessons to make them more home learning friendly by adding audio to PPTs for example.
Staff to have laptops as I had to use my own one which irritated me as now all I get when I switch it on is the log in for Microsoft teams!!
There are probably other things going on behind the scenes I am unaware of. We had a Risk assessmne done at the end of term and will have another done in the last week of the holidays and we could have changes.

@FrippEnos

Delatron Well me along with millions of others. Or maybe we actually care about the mental health and education of our children.

If you actually cared about the "mental health and education" you would want schools to open up in a sustainable fashion.

I actually don’t know anybody in real life who thinks schools should stay shut.

Neither do I

Maybe there’s no hope for any of us!!

Suit yourself

Or maybe we have some idea of risk assessment

I doubt that you know much about risk assessment.

and don’t t want to live our lives shut away in fear. I know who I’d rather be!
Feel free to stay inside for the next year though.

This just makes you condescending,

Spot on

So delatron based on your comments and arguments you'd be happy for schools to open 7/9 and be shut 2 weeks later until after Christmas - because quite frankly they need to open. It's the right thing to do and is for our children's MH.

But all the teachers who agree they need to be open - want measures and a back up national plan, funding for hygiene measures, funding for IT equipment should they need to remote teach etc - do not cafe for our students at all?

Some people are so blinded by the government propaganda "it's our moral duty to open schools" they literally cannot see past 9am on that first day.

I'm continually shocked and depressed that there hasn't been more pressure put on the govt to provide this funding, for cleaning, hygiene measures, IT equipment etc

Lock down has exposed just what a shoestring schools have been running on for years, yet so many parents seem happy to accept this and put blame on individual schools and teachers, rather than addressing the actual architects of this chaos.