To think school parents won’t get themselves or their kids tested

[Sistery]

...and will probably send in kids who should be isolating?

I did a Covid test last week (negative). It wasn’t terrible but was a faff and uncomfortable.

I just think that if so many people won’t even wear a bit of fabric over their face to protect others then they definitely won’t miss work or stick a swab in their nose/throat. Especially bearing in mind that they’ll have to do it every single time anyone in their family has a cough or temperature or can’t smell anything (all winter... ) They just won’t. People send sick kids to school a lot anyway - it’s how sick bugs and viruses fly round so easily so they’re already inclined to do this, and given the government is pushing hard at the narrative that Covid is some magical virus that children conveniently don’t spread, parents will be even more likely to send them. Especially if it’s someone else in the household that’s got symptoms

We just don’t seem to live in a country with a strong sense of social responsibility but equally we don’t enforce any so no temperature checks or mandatory PPE or anything at school.

YABU = People will isolate for 10 days if they get any Covid symptoms and their household will isolate for 14, until a throat and nasal swab shows a negative result, and they’ll repeat this every time anyone in the household gets any symptoms all winter.
YANBU: No they won’t.

@Sistery

So 16-18 year olds in school magically don't contribute to infections but 19 year olds do?

Convenient!

Mmm.

It can be caught from babies onwards and I highly doubt the virus thinks to itself it will stop here as the person is between 0-18 and not transfer again.

We know enough to know that children aren't an issue, unlike with other infections.

Right. You know more than Public Health England, do you?

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/older-pupils-spread-virus-like-adults-5ts6jr2pp

I know that there's new guidance that's due out today but they need to close the loophole of not having to prove a negative test so it's not used by UsForThem types as a reason to keep sick kids at school.

Schools historically have rewarded 100% attendance. A direct reward for children either being lucky enough to not be ill, or who have been sent into school despite being ill.
We had letters sent at the start of term saying children were encouraged to attend with minor illnesses.
As I’ve said, I had a threatening letter when my (non compulsory school age) child had time off for 2 very contagious illnesses.
If people have historically sent children in ill, the school system has to take some responsibility for that.

My son had symptoms. He was under 1, and we couldn’t get him tested with admitting him into our local hospital.

Our GP advised us that as a family we needed to self isolate, as due to the fact my son wasn’t particularly ill, just showing symptoms - he wouldn't refer us.

It wasn’t too bad for me, I am a teacher and was working mainly from home. My husband lost out on over £1,000 of our monthly salary however and we’re still making cut backs to deal with that.

If we weren’t well off, if we were desperate as many families are - we simply wouldn’t have been in a position for my husband not to work.

There are dozens of families who won’t get the test, simply because they cannot afford not to work if they have to isolate with their child. Not about being arseholes, but the fact is we have millions of people living in deprivation in this country and a missing pay check can literally result in unpaid bills, no food and a family at breaking point.

The government absolutely needs to put some sort of means assessed emergency fund in place to allow families to access money for this - otherwise people won’t get tested. They will hide their temperatures, they will stifle their coughs and they won’t get their children tested.

We know enough to know that children aren't an issue, unlike with other infections.

There are high schools have shut in the US one week after reopening. Are you saying that staff (who are often smaller than their pupils ) are the only ones transmitting? These states voted for Trump so it's not a political conspiracy btw

And in fact often on here you see teachers saying they drag themselves into work ill (in normal times) as they’re penalised for phoning in sick. Not blaming them for that, just saying it happens. It’s not just children. So a massive culture change is required to ensure that both children and teachers aren’t in school when they have symptoms of illness.

I agree with you - I think there will be ‘some’ parents who dose their kids up on calpol and will send them in anyway. It happened in my DD’s school in May in the keyworker group. One of the mums, who is a care assistant in hospital (and had been working on Covid wards) posted on facebook on a sunday about how poorly she felt. Her DD was in school on monday. Some people are selfish and nothing will change that.

@Sistery
@Appuskidu

There was a new extensive piece of global research published yesterday, which was featured on the BBC. Our top virologists, infectious disease specialists have been involved in it, it's a European collaboration and it's fundings have been validated. Equivalent infection rates aren't important, because we allowed it to rip through care homes and wasn't treating people. It's human to human transmission routes that we should focus on.

@netflixismysidehustle, the schools were shut but so were other businesses again. The transmissions came from factories and other routes. I don't think that some of the US research is looking into DNA strands and just looking at infection rates. From what I've read.

So a massive culture change is required to ensure that both children and teachers aren’t in school when they have symptoms of illness.

Yes and in offices too.

The problem as I’ve said with a contagious illness is that it only needs a small percentage of people to send sick kids in to make other people suffer consequences like family illness, school closures etc.

@Sistery

The problem as I’ve said with a contagious illness is that it only needs a small percentage of people to send sick kids in to make other people suffer consequences like family illness, school closures etc.

Yes. That has always been an issue, not just post Covid. Scarlet fever ripped through my children’s school last winter, 16 children were off from one class. That’s why schools need to stop rewarding 100% attendance.

I always thought that 100% attendance rewards were unfair on disabled children, anyway.

It's not as if they were being too lazy to get out of bed if they were hooked up to an infusion, in A&E (again) or undergoing surgery/physio/outpatients appointments, after all.

Aren’t 30% of all negatives a false negative test anyway?

@MitziK

I always thought that 100% attendance rewards were unfair on disabled children, anyway.

It's not as if they were being too lazy to get out of bed if they were hooked up to an infusion, in A&E (again) or undergoing surgery/physio/outpatients appointments, after all.

Definitely. It’s basically a way of saying to children ‘well done for being lucky enough not to be be disabled/have any long term conditions/have been ill enough to need a day off’, or ‘well done to your parents for sending you in when you are ill’.

Some of the dc's friends parents are applied at secondary kids in masks. We are well and truly screwed.

But if it was up to me they'd all be in masks and be tested weekly. So what do I know 🤷‍♀️.

And we've done a test. 30 seconds of awful ,my teen cried, but it's worth it.

appalled

And yanbu.

Yanbu @Sistery. I couldn't have put it better. In fact, I don't think I have ever agreed so completely with an OP.

People have voted for over a decade to cut and reduce the welfare safety net. Now a pandemic and people moan about the levels. Ssp has barely changed in 15 years. If I had to choose between self isolation and feeding my kids, which one do you think I will choose?

If the government can do a furlough scheme in 2 weeks, then surely they can address this, they have had months and know full well corona is not just going to disappear.

Good Ssp for all in employment , increasing testing and getting rid of the stupid attendance rules in schools (which should never have been in place anyway) will help immeasurably.

But people keep voting for a smaller welfare state and cuts have been happening for over a decade, what do they expect?

The welfare cuts and austerity have in fact led to higher taxes and were purely ideological costing more than if money had just been spent on these things. Government knows this but stick to their ideology, much like Brexit that has already lost the UK more than they paid in in over the last 40 plus years but ideological desirable by current and last government.

So again, if it's a choice between self isolation and no food and eviction, what one do you think most would choose? And tests whilst good if people do them are still not as easy to get as they should be. You can be sat on a plane where someone later tests positive and still be denied a test because you have no symptoms as per the current government guidelines.

If the DC is coughing or displaying other symptoms in school, it'll either be test to return (if negative) or 10 days off (positive assumed, unless tested otherwise)

Excactky.

this would mean an excessive amount of time off for parents. How do you think anyone with a job can do this? Can you afford not to work? Sounds like it but some people actually don't have the luxury to make this choice. Just come off your high horse, OP!

@Fletchings

If the DC is coughing or displaying other symptoms in school, it'll either be test to return (if negative) or 10 days off (positive assumed, unless tested otherwise)

Excactky.

this would mean an excessive amount of time off for parents. How do you think anyone with a job can do this? Can you afford not to work? Sounds like it but some people actually don't have the luxury to make this choice. Just come off your high horse, OP!

Or the third option. Pretend you’ve taken them for a test and it was negative, then send them back to school.

Because the guidance specifically says schools can’t ask for proof of a negative test from September, this will be a nice little get out.

this would mean an excessive amount of time off for parents. How do you think anyone with a job can do this? Can you afford not to work? Sounds like it but some people actually don't have the luxury to make this choice. Just come off your high horse, OP!

People will have to take time off for each test anyway. If you’re lucky to drive and live near a test centre then it could be just 2 days. If not then probably 4 - 5 for a home test to be dispatched, arrive, register and take, post back at the right time, arrive and then be processed.

I would LOVE to be able to afford not to work! I’m very lucky to have a flexible employer but fully recognise that needing to work will be a big part of why unwell children will end up in school.

It will be a nightmare!!

I’m a nurse and my DH is a teacher so I can’t see either of our bosses being understanding if we keep having to isolate every few weeks.

turns around anybody who is coughing before they've entered the premises

How long before the kids turns up coughing deliberately so they can be sent home for a few days off school?!

I’d rather test and get us all back to work/school ASAP. That way we only need to isolate if we get someone with a positive result. Yes it is going to be a pain but better than having to take time off or wondering if we are going to harm friends and family if we have it.