Anyone else worried about school staff?

[Sibsmum]

I am sorting uniforms and other school things for September start and I am just thinking that I have heard a lot about children's safety but very little if anything about the safety of school staff.
It looks like they have no ppe and in secondary will be teaching lots of kids from lots of bubbles. Then there are the catering staff, exposed to everyone, TA's and other admin and support staff, cleaners and site staff. How are they being kept safe? Or are they just expendable because were desperate to get our Dc back ?
I feel a bit guilty that I hadn't considered that at all.

There is evidence to show that masks are ineffective and can increase the likelyhood of catching covid

www.instagram.com/tv/CDJmDyQHFQ8/?igshid=1ac3wssp0knts

I still do not understand why the population has to shut down when it is the vulnerable that need to shield.

back in May, when schools were closed to the majority of students and staff, 65 teachers died

To be fair, it was 'people who work in education', not just teachers, who made up that 65 figure. However, it was by 20th April, not May - there may have been more since, but I expect few, because although schools were open, they were operating in a much safer manner than is proposed from September, with tiny numbers, distancing and lots of time spent handwashing etc.

"It shows at least 65 education staff have died with coronavirus, of which 43 were women and 22 were men, as of April 20.

That includes 17 secondary school teachers, seven primary and nursery teachers, two SEND teachers, ten teaching assistants, six school lunchtime supervisors and school crossing patrols and two school secretaries.

However some of the occupation groups are generic (ie senior professionals of education establishments), so it’s unclear which education sector some of these staff worked in (see full table below).

The figures also include 10 higher education and 10 further education staff who have died with COVID-19."

From
schoolsweek.co.uk/ons-figures-reveal-65-covid-related-deaths-in-education/

@Ladywinesalot who counts as vulnerable? Not just talking deaths here, many reasonably young and fit people seem to have been hit by long term health impacts after contracting the virus.

@Ladywinesalot

I still do not understand why the population has to shut down when it is the vulnerable that need to shield.

Conversely, I don't understand how 'normal life for everyone else' is going to run if, as some insist, the 'vulnerable' are removed from circulation.

The year group I teach in has 7 staff in total. All but 1 is 50+, so vulnerable on the grounds of age. 1 is extremely clinically vulnerable, at least 2 are clinically vulnerable.

So if you 'shield the vulnerable', then you have a single member of staff for the year group, meaning that the vast majority of families with families in that year group can't 'go back to normal' because their children will have no staff in school.

The 'vulnerable' are not economically inactive little old lades / gentlemen. They are your doctor, your pharmacist, your manager, your supermarket worker, your child's teacher or Brownie leader or childminder. If they all shield, then nobody's life returns to 'normal'.

Letseat sad but probably very true. Plus swim England sorted out the swim return guidance. Brewery's mostly did pubs etc. Obviously agreed by monsters but they didn't do the leg work.
Shows something quite stark and scary that when it's government public sector things that need organising the6 don't even know where to start

@SengaStrawberry

Not really, they are adults and can worry about themselves.

I know only too well that teacher-bashing is a sport for some Mumsnetters, but this is about the most callous comment I can imagine under current circumstances. It'll stay with me, so thanks for that.

@DelilahfromDevon

I haven't read the whole thread, apologies. However, I have read that only 1 teacher has died from CV-19 and didn't catch it from a child at school.

The point is, children need to get back to school. I don't care if they're all in masks or bloody hazmat suits. But the economy needs to fully reopen and that includes children going back to school.

By the time schools has completely shut there were 65 deaths of school staff. Schools don't only consist of teachers.

And also they have no idea where anyone caught it from. Test and trace didn't exist.

They've created a narrative to match their plans and they can't be challenged because no one can prove it isn't the case anymore than they can prove it is.

SengaStrawberry
I hope your dc's teachers have more empathy and compassion for others than you do. That was as Salty said callous.

Unless @DelilahfromDevon is referring to this news article from Arizona

www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/07/14/890716897/teacher-recovering-from-covid-19-says-school-reopening-is-tough-decision?t=1597157361978

ladywinesalot
This is another post of his. He just sounds so calm and rational doesn’t he? /s

His post:

This was the RESULT from 19 studies published in The International Journal of Nursing Studies. Yet, some smarty pants people who look at the study’s conclusion which states, “community mask use by well people COULD BE beneficial, particularly for COVID-19, where transmission MAY BE pre-symptomatic.” And they’re like, “See! The study says masks could be beneficial!”
*
Silly goose, the researchers found that the masks were NOT EFFECTIVE, but to be politically correct when so many people have psychotic mask fetishes they’re saying, but MAY BE masks COULD BE helpful for something else. 😂
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The crazy part is that these smarty pants people choose to completely ignore the fact that the masks were found to be ineffective as if the result doesn’t exist. I feel bad for them. I guess it’s hard to be objective when you’ve started wearing underwear on your face and believe you are doing something logical.
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Anywho, the underwear people believe in studies where people put on a mask, cough 5 times into a Petri dish, and then determine how miraculous their face undies are from that. That’s not how stuff works in the real world.
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The #1 defense against a pathogenic virus is a healthy immune system. All studies at the link in my bio 🧡

🤦‍♀️

I’m a particular fan of the “psychotic mask fetishes” and “wearing underwear on your face”.

have been repeatedly told by my midwife that I should not be working in the conditions I am being asked to as I’m putting my baby at risk.
A person's opinion ion carries no more weight just because she is a midwiife! Hardly an expert on stats or epidemiology. Maybe you think the Gvt should just ask random midwives what their uninformed opinion is and save a fortune on experts.

I also still can’t figure out how he thinks the words “could” and “may” mean “definitely not”.

MASKS are a HOAX and WORDS are MeANingLeSs!!

@cantkeepawayforever

You worry about the vulnerable being shielded but have no issue for the rest of the population!!

This is ridiculous

@lifeafter50
Maybe you think the Gvt should just ask random midwives what their uninformed opinion is and save a fortune on experts.

This Government has actively ignored the expert advice time and time again. In fact, it's been so blatant that the advisors have gone on the record saying as much. The misrepresentation of the as yet unpublished PHE study is just the latest example but already has sources at Public Health England saying that the findings don't mean what the Government ministers are saying they mean.

That their decisions were "following the science" has been a lie from the very beginning, which is why it quickly changed to become "the scientists are aware" instead.

[quote Ladywinesalot]@cantkeepawayforever

You worry about the vulnerable being shielded but have no issue for the rest of the population!!

This is ridiculous[/quote]
I am not sure that I understand your point?

Your earlier point, as I understood it, was that it was wrong that the 'rest of the population' couldn't get back to normal, because only 'the vulnerable' needed to protect themselves?

My point was that this ideas is founded on a misconception, namely that the vulnerable protecting themselves has no impact on the ability of the rest of the population to carry on as normal. In fact, if the vulnerable protect themselves as you have suggested, the rest of the population cannot carry on as normal, because the 'missing vulnerable' have a significant impact on 'everyone else's' daily life.

Or is your point that the vulnerable shouldn't be allowed to protect themselves, because it is ridiculous that anyone else is impacted? Again, that is a misconception, because the subsequent illness or death of the vulnerable will again impact on the roles they play in society and thus the ability for 'everyone else' to get on with their lives.

@canigooutyet I honestly don't expect the soap, sanitiser and paper towels to last! I'm thinking it was a sticking plaster. Sadly.
They managed when we had 4 classes of 15 but won't be able to keep up with 6 classes of 30!!!!
Oh and 60 children using 2 or 3 toilets + a urinal and only one allowed at a time. It's an absolute joke. Except it isn't funny. (Obviously I can only comment on my experience within my school).
I mean we didn't even have enough white board pens or glue sticks to have one each before this virus!
I just wish that parents are told the reality and not what the government/schools tell them will happen.

Like I said, we're being thrown under the bus

Steam roller or tank would be more appropriate if you ask me.

I've just posted on another thread, the first school fire drill and the bubble explodes. Schools have to get these done asap especially as a refresher for the pupils.

Then what "save" space in school in terms of one way systems, staggered anything, using entries/exits for certain year groups, grouping years group together in their bubbles etc?

Although they won't be allowed assemblies, the pesky little h&s things didn't bugger off when we got hit with CV and fire drills will still be mandatory.

Oh and of course, there's also the wonderful moans about yet another letter from school about the contributions that will no doubt have to increase.

And Chemistry, come on people, what is the fun in watching someone else do it on the screen. See that all the time on tv. The fun is the practical bit and poor sods are to be denied this. THe one room that is usually kitted out with PPE, and things should be cleaned up afterwards, and teachers usually encourage the students to do this as part of their learning!! The one room they are even bloody encouraged to wash their hands regularly!!

The point is, children need to get back to school. I don't care if they're all in masks or bloody hazmat suits. But the economy needs to fully reopen and that includes children going back to school.

Snort at 'the point is...' Of course we know what the fucking point is. The difficulty is making that happen in a way that won't mean most schools are shut again by October half term.

I apologise for the sweeping statement but I'm guessing that most people who are adamant that schools are just back full time with very little/no protection and 'you'll probably be fine' attitude, are the people that don't work in schools and either aren't vulnerable themselves or don't know colleagues and friends that are vulnerable without any safety measures.

But hey, we're not as important as getting the country back on its feet financially. We're worth losing.
Lovely.

@DelilahfromDevon

I haven't read the whole thread, apologies. However, I have read that only 1 teacher has died from CV-19 and didn't catch it from a child at school.

The point is, children need to get back to school. I don't care if they're all in masks or bloody hazmat suits. But the economy needs to fully reopen and that includes children going back to school.

Well, what a shame the government haven’t been willing to put in place any measures that will allow schools to open and remain open, then.

Considering they are such a priority and all that...

@lifeafter50

have been repeatedly told by my midwife that I should not be working in the conditions I am being asked to as I’m putting my baby at risk. A person's opinion ion carries no more weight just because she is a midwiife! Hardly an expert on stats or epidemiology. Maybe you think the Gvt should just ask random midwives what their uninformed opinion is and save a fortune on experts.

Hmm and this from the poster who told people - ironically on the "Why are people so horrible on MN thread," this morning to scroll on past goady threads.

@lifeafter50

have been repeatedly told by my midwife that I should not be working in the conditions I am being asked to as I’m putting my baby at risk. A person's opinion ion carries no more weight just because she is a midwiife! Hardly an expert on stats or epidemiology. Maybe you think the Gvt should just ask random midwives what their uninformed opinion is and save a fortune on experts.

That's cold. Even for you. Midwives have a wealth of experience and expertise. Who do you suggest pregnant women should listen to?

I work in Early Years. I am very worried about the return in September. Partly because we cannot social distance from the children, but also because almost every child at our nursery has older siblings at one of over 15 different primary schools in the town, so effectively, out "bubble" of 52 crosses thousands of other children over the entire town. Couple this with a large number of parents who are very high fliers and consistently send their children in to us sick. With every sick bug that goes round, we get at least 3 children sent in with "oh yes, they're fine, a bit tired as they didn't sleep too well, but they're not ill", only for the child to throw up an hour later and then tell us that they were sick in the night. Or children coming in with the same line from the parents or nanny, only to develop a high temperature a few hours later and when we call for someone to collect, Grandma or the Au pairs say "oh yes, we weren't sure how long they'd last, the had a fever yesterday/last night/this morning, but perked up after their Calpol".

We will have children sent into work with COVID, we had one child, the first week that we only opened to keyworker children, who came in and went downhill within half an hour and lo and behold, doctor mum had tested positive. Three members of staff dropped like flies and we then had to shut completely.

And don't get me started on the number of families who were spotted or seen on Facebook blatantly flouting rules during the height of lockdown.

I will go to work, my work children need me, but so do my own children and I'm terrified that our work children's parents will cause my children to lose theirs, as I'm severely asthmatic.

Yes, I'm very worried.

For those saying school staff are worrying unnecessarily, I think this data from Australia should show you why we are worried. More cases of COVID in Australian schools than from hospital and health care. But apparently we dont need any PPE just like the residential homes that also suffered much worse.

7news.com.au/lifestyle/health-wellbeing/victorian-health-authorities-reveal-the-workplaces-hit-the-hardest-by-covid-cases--c-1223895