To think shop workers shouldn't be asking people why they aren't wearing a mask?

[GlummyMcGlummerson]

My friend is epileptic. She can't wear a mask because it takes very little to trigger a fit, and wearing a mask creates too much of a risk. Over the last 2 days she's been asked in 3 different places (Greggs, Morrison's and the Co-Op) in an abrupt and snotty way "Where is your mask?" By staff. This is with lots of other customers around. She responded "I'm medically exempt" and has been asked why she's exempt in two of those places. She's also been told (online) that she should stay in to protect others and get someone else to do her shopping etc.

AIBU to think this is appalling ableist behaviour to put someone on the spot in front of others? She doesn't owe anyone her medical history. Yes there's sunflower lanyards she can pick up but she's apprehensive about wearing anything around her neck for obvious reasons. Why can't we just trust others that they're doing it in their best interests?

There will be a law going through soon about abuse on shop staff. I wish it hurried up so people can think there will be consequences for there actions

Well there's one right now saying people shouldn't be challenged when not wearing a mask but no one seems to want to pay attention to that either.

"If you can't wear a mask then the least you can do is be stringent about everything else."

Everyone should be stringent about everything else. No need to single out people without masks. Everyone should be washing their hands, not touching things they don't need to and keeping as much distance as possible from other people. Those without masks, many of whom will be clinically vulnerable don't want mask wearers who think they are no risk to other people, putting them at risk.

I was removed from a store for not wearing a mask despite producing medical evidence.

Really it's not shop staff who have to be scared it's single individuals with life changing conditions being further marginalised

From what I can see, most countries have exemptions, yes, even Italy. Same as here.

Well there's one right now saying people shouldn't be challenged when not wearing a mask but no one seems to want to pay attention to that either.

The only law I’ve seen says that they are not to request written proof which is not the same as asking for a verbal response. “I’m exempt” is a sufficient reply.

"Friends with kids who have autism, Down Syndrome or are deaf still manage to go to shops together. How? Through practice, patience and finding a face covering which can be tolerated. Visors, snoods etc"

The only way my son could keep a mask on was if he was heavily sedated so he wasn't able to move his hands to remove it. You clearly have no experience of severe disability.
Why are under 6s exempt? Many people with a learning disability are functioning at a much younger age than this but according to you, can all manage it.

People with disabilities or mental illnesses are not required to wear a mask in Italy either. I'd imagine most non-fascist countries have something similar in place.

@NoHunGosh

You can't just label countries where compulsory face coverings are efficiently policed as 'ableist'. People just get on with it here (Italy) as it's the law and that includes all kids over the age of 6, even those with SN. Friends with kids who have autism, Down Syndrome or are deaf still manage to go to shops together. How? Through practice, patience and finding a face covering which can be tolerated. Visors, snoods etc. I can't believe that there are so many people claiming to be exempt in the UK and makes me wonder what they would do if they were told by a medical professional not to leave home without a mask if they were seriously immunocompromised following chemo for example. Would they then find themselves able to tolerate wearing a mask after all?

exactly.

@onlinelinda

I will say to anyone with well controlled lung disease and asthma that wearing a mask is not a problem. It isn't for me, anyway. That is meant to be helpful and not critical.

My lung condition is not well controlled but I am fortunate to be able to tolerate a mask. We are all different.

@NoHunGosh

You can't just label countries where compulsory face coverings are efficiently policed as 'ableist'. People just get on with it here (Italy) as it's the law and that includes all kids over the age of 6, even those with SN. Friends with kids who have autism, Down Syndrome or are deaf still manage to go to shops together. How? Through practice, patience and finding a face covering which can be tolerated. Visors, snoods etc. I can't believe that there are so many people claiming to be exempt in the UK and makes me wonder what they would do if they were told by a medical professional not to leave home without a mask if they were seriously immunocompromised following chemo for example. Would they then find themselves able to tolerate wearing a mask after all?

@NoHunGosh

Please do enlighten us all on how to convince a person with profound and multiple learning disabilities with behaviour that challenges to wear a mask. Some people absolutely will tolerate it, some cannot. Some people are sadly incapable of learning, retaining info and understanding.

one minute we are talking about invisible disabilities. Traumatic event survivors and people with illnesses that wouldnt normally make them exempt and now mixing it in with severe disabilities.
Fact is, our rules on mask wearing are actually pretty lenient and people are still complaining about it.

Its not about you. Its about halting this bloody pandemic so we dont end up in another lockdown and schools can reopen.

You can't just label countries where compulsory face coverings are efficiently policed as 'ableist'. People just get on with it here (Italy) as it's the law and that includes all kids over the age of 6, even those with SN. Friends with kids who have autism, Down Syndrome or are deaf still manage to go to shops together. How? Through practice, patience and finding a face covering which can be tolerated. Visors, snoods etc. I can't believe that there are so many people claiming to be exempt in the UK and makes me wonder what they would do if they were told by a medical professional not to leave home without a mask if they were seriously immunocompromised following chemo for example. Would they then find themselves able to tolerate wearing a mask after all? @NoHunGosh*

Please do enlighten us all on how to convince a person with profound and multiple learning disabilities with behaviour that challenges to wear a mask. Some people absolutely will tolerate it, some cannot. Some people are sadly incapable of learning, retaining info and understanding.*

It's nonsense anyway. A simple Google search confirmed that Italy allows exemptions. It's yet more ableist garbage.

I am exempt. I was aggressively challenged at the weekend and I am going to complain to the head office of the company concerned.
I was wearing a sunflower lanyard and a badge on the lanyard.

@Drumple so sorry, that shouldn't have happened. Hopefully that person will be appropriately disciplined.

Thank you flesh. I ended up bursting into tears. I honestly don’t know what more to do. I am allowed to go out, but it feels like people want those of us who can’t wear masks shut in for the foreseeable future.

It’s really hard to be disabled as it is and then to have it made worse even though I had a lanyard has upset me. I wonder why I even bothered to wear the lanyard and get the card at all.

I can't wear a mask with my asthma. I have difficult to control asthma and one of my triggers is warm air. So it's worse right now in this heat. I haven't been able to tolerate a covering for more than 7 minutes. Every time I try wearing a mask at home for a few minutes to try and build up tolerance my asthma worsens - my chest tightens and I get shortness of breath. My asthma then is flared up for several days.

I have to actively avoid certain triggers generally. For example my DH has to empty the hoover and do all dusting. I can't visit my parents house as one of them took up smoking in later life and cigarette smoke is my major trigger. I have to avoid smoker colleagues after a cigarette break at work as it sets my asthma off if they some too close. If someone in front of me waiting at a traffic light decides to start smoking I have to move away.

Thankfully I have an excellent employer and I am WFH during the pandemic. I haven't been in a shop since before lockdown - we have had food and medicine delivered. I also have DH if desperate although he is also keen to stay home in case he brings Covid back to me.

I am not going to clothes shops etc. as I'm anxious about Covid - pretty much every cold I get turns into a 6 week cough or a chest infection. I know someone with mild well controlled asthma who spent several weeks on oxygen in ICU with Covid. Everyone else I know with Covid didn't have asthma and none needed hospital treatment.

I am also anxious about being challenged about not having a mask. I have social anxiety and am not sure how well I would cope with someone challenging me so am staying at home.

We are practicing stringent social distancing when going for a walk - we live in a high population density area so are walking early or late. If we see someone else coming we cross the road to avoid them, or we turn down a different road to let them pass us. We are still quarantining parcels for several days and wiping all shopping down, washing our hands regularly etc.

I daresay some other mask exempt people are also vulnerable to Covid and are also keen to avoid others as much as possible too.

@Drumple that's horrific. I would have been the same, it's really worrying me and I haven't left the house in 6 weeks. If I do go at all, I will be taking my partner who can speak up for me if something happens. I was going to get the lanyard thing but it clearly doesn't help anything.

Show workers are there working and we cannot always maintain social distancing.

Why not - it is the law isn't it? Why can't they wait 30 seconds? One in Dunelm chose to walk up an aisle about 6' long, and sidle behind my back about 1" behind me. He could easily have walked up the parallel aisle! I only go in a Tesco Express, or Coop the size of a corner shop for a food occasionally - I am in and out, because I don't want to pick up and pass the corona virus to DH and DD1.

As I said, why is it shop assistants have not observed social distancing whenever I have been in small shops - but then they complain how other people, not wearing masks are putting their lives at risk. Its hypocrisy!

Yes of course there are exemptions in Italy - but in most of these cases a visor/snood is worn instead with the accompanying caregiver assisting to keep it in place in indoor situations where social distancing is almost impossible (eg waiting area at our local children's hospital where we unfortunately have been spending a lot of time recently).

@Miniminiminimini

You realise most people have “a medical condition” of some sort right? Retail staff actually don’t give a fuck about customers’ medical history but unfortunately it is the law right now to wear one in a shop.

Masks don’t trigger epileptic fits. From an epileptic who doesn’t even have their license. She is not exempt, however much you both feign shock at not being able to do as you please.

Your friend’s being a dick we’re in the middle of a pandemic and unfortunately people that are used to looking solely out for themselves have to look out for everyone else.

Masks don't trigger your seizures, I think is want you meant. Not all epileptics have the same triggers but you knew that anyway you were just being an arse.

Tell her to wear the sunflower symbol as a sticker on her clothing. The shop staff have the right to ask customers to protect them and other customers

The shop staff have the right to ask customers to protect them and other customers

No, they don't. RTFT. And the government guidance that specifically states staff SHOULDN'T challenge customers

@DarkMintChocolate I agree, in Asda yesterday one assistant (no mask) got so close to me I though she wanted a piggy back ride.

Most countries probably allow exemptions. I expect it's probably easier to get your GP in most European countries to provide you with some sort of proof of exemption, in the same way as it's generally much easier to get a GP appointment in those countries, as they probably have their usual charges.

The difference is that in most other countries the law regarding mask-wearing is enforced by police and there are fines, so it isn't put upon shop workers to try to enforce. Lack of enforcement means you're much more likely to get people here who simply can't be bothered as well as those who are genuinely exempt.

@puzzledpiece another one who hasn't read the guidelines then? Also sunflower symbol, guess you haven't read the thread either.