I'm an experienced highly qualified Early Years Educator and at work today at a creche I spent approx 3 hours deep cleaning as per current regs - I think this is neither sustainable nor desirable AIBU

[Germolenequeen]

AS ABOVE

GP

If my company has to employ a full time cleaner, it would have to lose a couple of junior tech staff

Either you have the highest paid cleaners in the country or the worst paid technical staff.

Not to mention the rubbishing of commercial cleaners' skills as a job "anyone can do". But hey, its largely women's work so obviously can't be difficult.

And of course the OPs point was about the children, not cleaning per se.

@2Rebecca as the point has already been made the difference for Doctors is they aren’t expected to care for the patient and clean at exactly the same time! You clean between patients they are not in the room whilst you are doing it.
Try cleaning whilst watching a room full of two Year olds.

OP I’m lucky in our Early Years setting we’ve had a cleaner popping in 3 times a day. Other than that we sterilise the plastic toys at the end of the day, and give the bathroom a deep clean before we go home. Your setting needs to look at how much cleaning is really necessary.

and what would she do ? Watch ?

Watch the children? Ideally yes!

We should prioritise efficient allocation of resources

I have a degree, a higher professional qualification and 30 years experience in my professional field.

I'm expected to anti-viral spray and wipe the toilet/sink before and after use, sanitise all door handles at the end of the day, sanitise my entire work space daily ('phones/desk/cupboard handles/cabinet fronts etc). Not doing so is a reportable disciplinary offence and secretarial staff are acting like KGB informants where I work !
This adds additional ''non chargeable work'' time to my day which, as my contract states I have to charge 90% of my time to clients and the other 10% is already more than taken up with administration tasks, means that I have to do it in my own time. At least you're getting paid for the deep cleaning.

Not being able to meet clients face to face and other Covid-19 caused work arounds also take longer but as an organisation we're "committed to not passing these costs on to clients" apparently so yet again professional staff are having to do extra in their own time as there is no permitted flexing in amount of chargeable time which can be written off, "Covid-19 should not be seen as a valid reason for any drop in professional staff achieving their billable targets".

Sooo. Suck it up, you're not being (sneakily) expected to work extra hours for no extra pay like many of us.

Suck it up, you're not being (sneakily) expected to work extra hours for no extra pay like many of us

Oh come on. I also have higher degrees and 30 yrs experience in a professional field, I also have clients plus a ton of non chargeable work after the billable stuff is done.

That still doesn't entitle me to lecture women at the bottom end of the hourly paid payscale to suck it up and assume they are not doing unpaid cleaning because they are low paid.

Its also not ok that the children get less time and attention as a result (which was the OP's point, despite the many PPs choosing to reframe it as the OP getting above herself).

I'm a qualified Nursery worker, tall with clean driving licence, National Trust membership and 25 years experience. There's a lot of cleaning at my nursery but not as much as a creche would need. The issue at my place is that all hard to wash toys have been removed. We have always been rather short on toys as it was and now it feels embarrassing to only have basically 2 days worth of toys to rotate. Feel a bit sorry for the children.

@C8H10N402

As I said , the other 10% is already more than taken up with administration tasks

Basically you are saying ‘suck it up’ to 2 year olds, because they are really the ones this affects. Just to be clear. That is what the issue is, not that anyone is cleaning but in order to do so they are not spending time with the children. All ok with that?

@2020meh please read everything the OP has to say because you clearly haven’t. Her point is that the time spent cleaning is taking away from the time she should be spending with the children. She absolutely does say that .

“2020 doesn’t care about your CV” @BillBaileysBum* I snorted tea out of my nose. I might love you

And someone else said it was the best post of the year. God, you set the bar low if you think one woman telling another to "suck it up buttercup" is either smart or funny. It was entirely what is was meant to be: condescending.

OP- YANBU

Kids need germs though. It’s really really important for their developing immune systems.
If this kind of cleaning continues much longer we are going to damage their health.

I did read that " those 3 hours took me away from interacting with children which is what I'm employed to do."

I also read " we are operating......with the bare number of staff needed for ratios and cover for our (unpaid) lunch breaks"

I therefore deduced that although OP is not doing what she is employed to do, their employer is maintaining the number of staff needed for regulatory ratios.

I too don't get paid for my lunch break, no-one does where I work. Contracted hours are 8.30 to 5 Mon - Fri (which would be 42.5 hours) with one hour for lunch but the contracted payable hours are 37.5 per week so hence we're not being paid for our lunch hour. Do lots of employees get a paid lunch break ?

Please don't mis-understand me, we used a fantastic nursery for our dc and are still in contact with some of the long term staff there all these years later. I know that the regulatory ratios are the bottom line, not a fantastic ideal environment, but we are in unprecedented circumstances in 2020.

Humans did not evolve to be living in sterile environments.
We need interaction with microbes.

I’m the director of my own business and I spend a good portion of my week cleaning now ... because that’s just the way the world is right now, we all have to play our part.

Yep and this is what will happen in schools from September and eat into lesson time.

Ppl don't seem that bothered about it and kind of telling ppl to accept it shows they don't really care about the impact on the children's education while their educators clean for hours at a time. It was raised by teachers before but as usual, we were told to put up and shut up but this really is going to have a massive impact on children's education long term if people are spending more time cleaning than educating.

All those who were passionate about the schools being back should be pushing for change on this on the same level as they did for the reopening of schools. If they are not doing so, it really shows their value of education and what they really think about it.

While I, as a teacher, am not bothered about rolling up my sleeves and getting stuck in and often do when a poonami happens. Is this really an effective use of time?

What will happen to the education of these children if all staff are cleaning more than educating? Who will pick up the slack? Will parents have to do more homework with the kids during the evenings and weekend because they are missing out?

We have a lot of people out of work who could be employed to clean during this period. That might be a way forward if we had the funding.

and kind of telling ppl to accept it shows they don't really care about the impact on the children's education bollocks. It doesn’t show people don’t care about their children’s education it shows people understand that in hard times it’s harder. We have to work harder now. We have to wear masks, accept loneliness, change behaviour and put in more hours. If we do we may be able to maintain or even improve. I’m sorry if it’s difficult for you to accept. Life just got harder. Let’s try to get on with it.

We are working harder and will do but as I am saying all those who said they really cared about education to push for schools back, where are they now? Not pushing for extra cleaners to ensure a good education? Clearly didn't give a shit that much.

So you are happy to work harder and complete school work at home that your child didn't get to do in school because their teacher was cleaning.

As you say.....we have to work harder now!

My local authority has just announced they are hiring 80 more cleaners to work 9am to 3pm so clearly someone is listening!

My local authority has just announced they are hiring 80 more cleaners to work 9am to 3pm so clearly someone is listening!

This is good news, employing local people who are currently out of work and allowing children to get the education time they deserve.

but as I am saying all those who said they really cared about education to push for schools back, where are they now? they’re caring for their children through the summer while work gets more demanding and trying to keep them happy and positive about going back, plus adjusting to new rules and transport issues.
Not pushing for extra cleaners to ensure a good education? Clearly didn't give a shit that much. well no we’re trying to ensure there’s enough cash to get tech for our less wealthy pupils and that everyone is fed this summer.

So you are happy to work harder and complete school work at home that your child didn't get to do in school because their teacher was cleaning. we’ll do the best we can, as I expect you to.

As you say.....we have to work harder now! yes and have been for some time.

Not pushing for extra cleaners to ensure a good education? Clearly didn't give a shit that much. well no we’re trying to ensure there’s enough cash to get tech for our less wealthy pupils and that everyone is fed this summer.

Schools are pushing all the time, we push for SEN support, support for poor families etc this isn't about schools not caring, it is about the huge push from the public to open schools because they cared that much about education which seems to have fallen by the by when bums are on seats regardless if those kids are twiddling their thumbs in schools or sitting struggling but the teachers haven't time to help because they are cleaning.

I think we have lost our way if we think this is good enough for our kids.

Different job - but I had to go into the office this week and it was quite stressful having to clean all the keypads and common touch areas (printers, copies, kettles) and remember social distancing.