Letter from neighbour

[christinarossetti19]

More of a wwyd - not sure whether to respond or not.

A letter was pushed through our letter box on Sunday from next door (terraced). It complained about the noise coming from our house and specifically our dd's bedroom. The noise identified was scraping of chairs and banging of doors, which the letter said was preventing next door from working or resting.

Next door has a number of adults living there, all 40s, in a 'rent a room' not a voluntary house share situation. At the moment, there seems to be a single woman who has lived there for a few years, a couple who are newer and a single man who knows the couple has just moved in. The letter came from the single woman (as she mentioned which room she has) but was signed as 'from all of your neighbours'. She has English as an additional language, which is probably may be why she wrote rather than knock on the door? We haven't seen her for months, so possibly shielding.

The problem (sort of) is that our house is very, very quiet. The complaints were all about the noise coming from dd's bedroom. She's 13, obvs not been at school, only ever plays music through headphones. She does open and close her door a few times a day, and moves her desk chair to her desk but you're allowed to do that in your own home! We have carpet upstairs btw, so no scraping. the loudest noise from her room is screeching with laughter when she's on Facetime with her friend, and we do ask her to tone it down.

The houses are solid 1920s so very little sound carry through. Dd rarely has her window open, as she hates flies etc.

We talked it through and decided to ask the children to be as quiet as they can, to be mindful of noise ourselves but decided against sending a letter back. We're not sure of the dynamics there, and didn't want to put through a letter that someone other than the occupant of the back room read.

The same letter - with a heading of letter 2 - was put through our door again this evening. The house has been super quiet today - dd has been downstairs most of the time.

So it looks like she is expecting a response. My instinct is to knock on the door and have a conversation, but I worry that that might be intrusive. So maybe a letter, but saying what? I don't feel inclined to agree that we've been noisy (as we honestly haven't) and I honestly can't promise that we'll try to be quieter - the only way to do that would be if we all stopped moving or went on holiday!

Suggestions as to what to do please, with a view to ensuring that neighbour feels heard, but not 'admitting' to making an unacceptable level of noise.

TIA.

[Ellmau]

The noise may actually be coming from one of the other rooms in the HMO.

[ticktackted]

I had a lodger like this once. She acted like we were party animals who live in squalor. We are busy professionals, often out, who never really listen to music or even watch TV, just talk to each other & laugh which she hated. We also have a cleaner & kept it pretty clean & tidy around that (she did no cleaning... just moaned). Anyway, it was down to a mixture of her poor mental health, being jealous we were a couple when she was lonely, getting obsessed about small things and wanting to blame her problems like lack of energy on our "noise". But, it also turned out to partly be from next door, as I learned when I got a ranty text while we were both out. I ended up evicting her, to her utter horror! What did she think I would do, stop living here?! Anyway, what I learned from this is you can't reason with this. Obsessive people want SILENCE. Don't force your poor daughter not to make the normal sounds of living in her own home on this woman's account! I would reply politely, say that you have been home more than usual, but that you will be making reasonable domestic noises during the day, and that that's the nature of terraced properties. Keep a copy, then keep repeated letters in case it escalates to harassment later.

[saltycat]

Oops just read that yours is a 20s house. Should be no issue at all there. I live in a pre war house myself, and touch wood!, cannot hear a thing from either side.

[DisobedientHamster]

Exactly, ticktacked. Been there, done that as well. I wouldn't reply to her at all, though. Tried that, it's just bait to them. They're just waiting to pounce. Nope. Just ignore, pretend they're not there and carry on as normal.

[ticktackted]

@DisobedientHamster you're probably right! If she complains, it's not like the council will do anything, you're allowed to make domestic noises in your own home.

Oh also, I can hear my neighbour's TV from 8am-10pm. But I'm not going to ask a deaf old lady who lives alone not to watch TV! It's quiet, it doesn't stop us doing anything. It's a terraced house, sensible people understand this. My parent's semi neighbour has an inordinate number of clocks that chime. It's just life!

[echodot]

@christinarossetti19

Thanks all. I did go round and knock just after I'd written this post - no one answered the door.

I'll try again tomorrow and, if no answer, will write a friendly casual note saying that I'm not sure what noise she means so would she like me to come round and listen from inside her house. And that we're all being as quiet as possible.

Dd's room has built in wardrobes without soft close doors. I wonder if the sound is carrying through if ndn has her bed next to this wall, although she can't have both her bed and desk there to be prevented from both working and resting! I've just put some blu tac on the frames, so they close as quietly as possible. Although dd only goes to her wardrobe once or twice a day, and often doesn't shut the door, so it may not be this.

I wondered mice - but do they bang and scrape? Maybe it can sound like that if you're depressed.

TennisButterfly we have carpet upstairs - definitely not laminate! My friend had a similar problem as you did with her upstairs neighbours, and I hate how laminate flooring makes sounds so loud.

Yes, I think probably mental health problems, lock down depression and possibly finding sharing a house with a couple and man that she doesn't know are the her main problems. I do feel sympathetic to that - it must be very difficult esp in your 40s .

Thanks once again.

Perhaps they couldnt hear you knocking. That would be ironic.

[MrsWarleggan]

@DisobedientHamster

You took the words right out of my mouth. OP do not be made to feel like you can't make a noise in your own home. I detest people like this. My neighbour is exactly the same..... The family the other side of her have parties, are loud, smoke weed (very pleasant people, not aggressive in any way shape or form) .... She never complains about them, but then they own their house... We only rent ours 🙄

[FabulouslyGlamourousFerret]

You're being very understanding. Please don't worry about making excess noise, live your lives as you see fit. As long as you're not having loud parties, playing loud music are shouting then she is being totally unreasonable

[tonercartridges]

As a PP said - a bit off piste but is next door an official HMO? You can't just let rooms to whomever you like as they did back in 50s....

I'm torn about what you should do. Half of me thinks just ignore her, but it's not going to go away, by the sounds of it. If you do go round and listen etc, then at least you can prove you've made all efforts to be reasonable, if anything should escalate.

But I used to live in a Victorian terrace - and I could hear a neighbour's TV when it was on the shared wall (I asked them to move it) and I sometimes heard arguments and loud sounds. The other side had a newborn and yes - you can hear that too. Par for the course! Nothing was ever so bad or so regular that I couldn't sleep - which is all anyone can expect.

Good luck!

[MashedPotatoBrainz]

We had a neighbour like this. As other posters have said it is utterly pointless trying to reason with her. She is complaining about normal household noise. She doesn't want you to make less noise. She wants no noise. Ever. It simply isn't possible to placate neighbours like this.

Our reported us to the council because my husband left for work at 6.00 am. They didn't want to hear his car starting before 7.00. What was he supposed to do, push it down the street?

[Amicompletelyinsane]

I hear noise through the bedroom wall from my neighbour. 30s semi. Its the only room we hear noise and took me ages to figure it out. It's banging and scraping. I finally figured they have wardrobes on the joining wall and the awful scraping it actually the noise of the hangers on the rail as they are moved. God knows why it sounds so horrible through the wall! Could that explain their scrape noise moan

[MatildaTheCat]

I once lived in a flat and my bedroom adjoined the next door flat. The occupant of that flat used to ‘constantly’ slam her plugs in and out of the electrical sockets. It became almost intolerable although it sounds pretty innocuous.

Is it at all possible your DD is doing something which seems quite innocent but could be driving the neighbour mad?

However I agree that most likely the neighbour has some MH issues. Try to speak to her again and try to seem reasonable ( you do seem very reasonable) as it might appease her.

[liann81]

Does she not know that children can be loud at times . If it was me I would not write a letter

[maddening]

Put a letter through advising that you do not believe that you are causing a statutory noise problem and that having monitored the noise in the house and you are content that any noise falls within the realms or normal living noise and therefore no further adjustments will be made and that you are content that environmental health would uphold your position.

[expat101]

Could noise be carrying across from other areas of your house/adjoining rooms?

Could there be other noise going on that the neighbour doesn't want to mention? I'm currently in conversation with a neighbour of ours over an issue, I haven't mentioned their close to death domestics they have, but it certainly adds additional stress/noise issues over our side of the fence...

[therealkittyfane]

I don’t think I would write a letter.
You could pop over tomorrow and if there is no answer, put a note through asking her to knock on your door and take it from there.

[SummerTimeSunshine]

I had extreme verbal abuse from my NDNs over my “noise”.

Hilarious given we don’t have a TV, music is always played through headphones, we occasionally watch Netflix (through headphones) and rarely have visitors.

I’m autistic and actually hate loud noises so the complaints genuinely baffled us.

Their behaviour turned very nasty one evening and we ended up getting the police involved.

The police interviewed them and our crimes were basically: opening/closing our front door to accept a food delivery, using our stairs (they could occasionally hear us as they are located against the shared wall that separates us) and using our downstairs bathroom (they could hear the noise of the door closing).

They explained to the police how they tip toed up and down their stairs and closed their front door and internal doors very slowly and gently to avoid any noise travelling.

The police explained to them that we were completely within our rights to use our doors and stairs as much as we wanted. They were also told they’d be charged if they bothered us again.

Some people just don’t understand the concept of “reasonable noise”.

[FlamingoQueen]

My NDN once sent me a sarcastic text about the noise from our house at 11pm. We’d all gone to bed at 10 as had a busy day the next day. It was actually the neighbours on the other side of us that she could hear. I replied back and said her text had actually woken us up! Perhaps your neighbour is hearing other noises and thinking it’s coming from you. But, even if it is from you - tough luck! She should live in a detached house!

[DopamineHits]

The type of people who believe they should get a detached house experience despite living in a flat/shared wall home are also the type of people who will make as much noise as they like without an ounce of self awareness.

[SummerTimeSunshine]

Oh - and they showed the police their “noise diary” which documented our noise crime over 12 months. They said they were submitting it to environmental health at our local council in order to get noise monitoring equipment installed. Their request was obviously rejected as the council have to notify you in writing that the equipment is being installed and we never got that letter! (Shock!)

[Floralnomad]

Just go and knock and tell her that any noise that comes from your house is at a perfectly reasonable level so what she’s hearing is not you / your family and then ignore anything further . I’d also be tempted to check if they are a legal HMO . I wouldn’t put anything in writing .

[saltycat]

Too many people living in UK all crowded together now. The beach invasion was an indicator.

There are nearly 60 million people living in this country and everyone is on top of one another. So naturally personal space is at a premium.

I moved abroad and am all the better for it now. Space to breathe at last. And don't have to worry about Brexit either. win win.

[RedToothBrush]

Ignore it.

Nothing they can do. Don't waste your time trying to resolve a problem that doesn't exist.

[JammyHands]

If this is an HMO (house in multiple occupation) it should be registered as such with the council. I would phone them and find out, and explain why you are asking.

[Justaboy]

Once again another example of the shite poor Acoustic isolation standards in British homes:(