Covid and Flying as a family- votes please

[AuntieMeemz]

For: Airlines say its safe, people will be wearing masks, we have FFPP3 masks ( will probably get it sooner or later anyway though)
Against- can we beleive airlines when they say the air is safe? I'm blood group A,and aged nearly 60,(apparently higher risk of having Covid severely factors).travelling with 2 teenagers. If we don'tgo now, we will have to have a holiday next year in a place and a time that we really don't want. This will be our last holiday for some time, as like many, my husband has lost his job and at nearly 60, is notoptimistic about getting another one!
I have to say, we flew during Feb when I think the infection rate was probably much higher than anyone realised, and we were fine.

Its not the covid infection that puts me off it's the knock on effects :
Flights being cancelled at the last minute or time change / route change
Someone on your flight with a high temp could mean sitting on the runway for hours , not taking off
Having to quarantine if someone on your flight has covid
Quarantining at the hotel for the same reason
Airline going bust while you are away
Hotel closing
Travel insurance
Holiday not being what you are used to / as much fun as pre covid
I'm the most laid back person ever regarding the Corona virus and hysteria but the above puts me off

ScotsinOz I wouldn't sound QUITE so smug as you do..here are some other stats for you as you clearly love them! Australia has had 81 recorded new cases in past 24 hours. The US has had 1,132 and as we know, has the largest total deaths/cases in world.

Here's the thing though- the population of Australia is less than 1/13th of the US, so your new cases rate are pretty much on par with the US cases/population. Feel so preachy to the rest of us now??

yes ScotsinOz & a lot of Melbourne is now re-entering lock-down as the rate is climbing...honestly its not a competition!!!
No need to sound so smug.

I'm hoping we'll still be going on our holiday in August, either flying or driving (both options are currently booked). We're all low risk though. It's only France, so the flight is only 1.5hrs long, I can't imagine the plane will be full judging by other responses! Staying in self-catered accommodation, and doing outdoorsy stuff while away. I'll take necessary precautions - we'll wear masks, wash hands lots and carry hand gel, but at some point life has to start getting back to normal - things are re-opening, and numbers are looking good at the moment.

Lots of people will say it's fine, but personally there's no way I would chance it.

What if the area you visit goes into local lockdown and you're stuck and can't get home?
What if one you becomes unwell and needs hospital treatment while you're there (doesn't necessarily have to be a COVID related illness)?
Are you going to be comfortable staying in a hotel with hundreds of strangers, sharing a buffet table, a swimming pool, a lift, sun loungers etc? What if there's an infection in your hotel and you're all stuck in your hotel room for 14 days or longer?

I just can't see holiday-ing abroad being much fun at the moment, unless you can drive and stay in your own holiday home somewhere private.

I consider flying at the moment to be utterly idiotic.

Cinemas, restaurants, and so on have to have their customers seated far apart. But airlines bleated waa waa we can't afford that boo hoo and so they're allowed to stuff us in like sardines.

(To clarify. Flying for a holiday is utterly idiotic. I understand some people will have good reasons to fly that justify the risk.)

I'm flying with dc next week. A one hour flight to another part of uk that can't be reached by car/ train etc. Were both healthy with no underlying conditions. I think airport will be very quiet as flights are still limited and we'll take as much precautions as we can.

Where are you going? Some countries make non essential travellers from the UK quarantine for 2 weeks when they arrive. The countries desperate enough to accept UK tourists without restrictions are probably going to have covid hotspots in tourist areas, and you could get locked down in your hotel - hope you're not sharing a room with your teens, because that may not be fun if you can't leave the room!

Iknewyouwerewaitingforme there is no way the US has only had 1,132 cases in the past 24 hours. I’m pretty sure it’s getting over 40,000 cases a day at the moment.

Really doesn't matter, I doubt we can believe any countries true numbers so what is the point of quoting them in the 1st place. The point I am making is its all so dependant on population size/ how large the country is. Australia cases are suddenly on the up, and increasing quite alarmingly. There no need for her to sound quite so smug.
We are all just on the start of this anyway, so much longer to go so these constant comparisons and "we're doing so much better than you- so there!" attitudes just not helpful.

I wouldn’t trust strangers on Mumsnet! The amount of misinformation is dangerous, misrepresentations of death rates ( @ScotsinOz - you need to keep in mind that the numbers and types of people tested will impact that calculation, it’s NOT the case that 14% of people who have had COVID in the UK have died) inaccurate information about filtering systems on airlines and the risk of flying (@Emmie12345 - no it’s not the case that ‘of course’ you’ll get it if someone else has it on your flight - that is NOT what the evidence suggests and does NOT take into account the fact that there is a filtering system on aircraft - @whatswithtodaytoday you have misunderstood the filtering system too) and general scaremongering.

OP if you are keen to go, I would encourage you do to some research and get some reliable information.

For example you might find these links useful:

theconversation.com/should-you-fly-yet-an-epidemiologist-and-an-exposure-scientist-walk-you-through-the-decision-process-138782

“When the ventilation system on planes is operating, planes have a very high ratio of outside fresh air to recirculated air – about 10 times higher than most commercial buildings. Plus, most planes’ ventilation systems have HEPA filters. These are at least 99.9% effective at removing particles that are 0.3 microns in diameter and more efficient at removing both smaller and larger particles”

www.bbc.com/news/business-52822913

A 2018 study by researchers from Emory University in Atlanta attempted to model how passengers and crew moved about an aircraft, and how that might affect the transmission of infectious diseases.

"A droplet-mediated respiratory infectious disease is unlikely to be directly transmitted beyond one metre from the infectious passenger. Thus, transmission is limited to one row in front of or in back of an infectious passenger," the researchers concluded”

I’m not saying, go ahead, fly, there’s no risk - but I am saying don’t trust some of the random thoughts on here that aren’t backed up by any real evidence.

Flying for a holiday now is very much the same as the people who rushed out of London to Cornwall at the beginning isn't it... Except now you're more likely to get stuck whereever you go if there's a local spike in cases and they lock down...

According to some airlines, cabin air is as safe as an operating theatre. However, in the past, I have picked up bugs when flying, so treat it as a possible "added bonus".
To honest, if you want to fly (I would) it is no better or worse than staying at home and going shopping. What would be more interesting would be passenger testing or the requirement to prove good health or that you have antibodies, but I don't think that is realistic, is it?

I probably wouldn't, but then I've picked up loads of colds on planes and would be worried about

1. insurance cover if any of the family got coronavirus
2. insurance cover for accommodation/flights if you had to do a quarantine period out there, as I read that's not covered.

It is not just about flying and risk of catching it, for me the greatest risk is being caught up in some kind of lockdown or quarantine abroad. This is not a situation you want to be in, just have a think back to those stuck on cruise ships and in hotels in Tenerife pre lockdown. Remember that lockdown in other countries is strictly enforced unlike here. So no thank you that is not a risk I am going to take.

We are driving, booked a cabin both way on the ferry, added bonus no need to rent a car and can bring wine back!

@Iknewyouwerewaitingforme and @sundowners.

I’m not being smug (the Victorian’s felt breaking the social distancing rules was fine - like a lot of people on Mumsnet - and look where’s it’s got them now). The stats were to show that even though we have had significantly less cases (even given the lower population), our borders are still CLOSED. That’s a sensible approach - unlike what the UK are doing. But as usual, anyone who dares points out what’s sensible is smug.

However, I’m grateful to be in Australia right now rather than the UK - the UK’s handling of it has been awful.

@ScotsinOz

Latest estimates are a .6% death rate. Remember we weren't testing people who weren't hospitalised until May in any quantity.

We have a holiday to Portugal booked for later this year. Booked pre-Covid. At the moment we are waiting to see what happens really, DH and I are late 50's, no underlying health issues (although no idea what blood group I am), holiday booked with adult DC and partner. We would be absolutely fine when we arrived, hire car and large apartment, the resort fairly quiet too. I am apprehensive about the flight though, I don't enjoy flying anyway but thinking of possible germs circulating in the air, a face mask for however many hours it will take to get through the airport , and no wine to calm me down .... it will depend a lot on advice regarding travel to Portugal over the coming weeks .

It was booked last Dec. Not desperate to go at all but if we don't we can only go somewhere in March school hols, which would use all our meagre budget and get us a warmish holiday, and probably no beach or pool swimming at all, which is all we go for.

My friends dsis was stuck in Mexico for two months and my mates housemate got stuck in Greece. Plus health risks, no way.

Should add our booked holiday itself is really safe. One of 2 apartments, large pool and virtually nobody on the 'beaches' that is the beauty of Croatia. Its just the flying that is the risk. if we don't go, our only choice is somewhere else in March school hols next year.

I can't see how flying in recycled air is possibly safe. If someone on your flight has it, you will get it.

False, there's no "will get it" about this at all..

For info and "recycled air": only a percentage of air going around the cabin at any one time is been recycled ( and that air has passed through a HEPA filter).. fresh conditioned air is continually being introduced all the time.

ive already got a holiday booked for november will see how it goes but if its not cancelled i stand to lose 500 pounds on it if i cant get it rebooked