How to live with hoarder husband

[kavalkada]

Posting here for traffic. First, I apologize for all mistakes I'm going to make because English is not my first language, sorry. And feel free to correct me. I won't mind, actually I would like that.

So, back to the problem. My husband is a hoarder, he comes from a family of hoarders and I knew that when we met because first time I visited him, his apartment was a hoarder's paradise. I, on the other hand, am super organized and if I could have a dream job that would be organizing other people homes (unfortunately, not possible in my country). We talked about this before we married and we agreed on some rules that will make our life better - for him and for me.

He has a room just for him where he can hoard as much as he likes and two large wardrobes just for him and his things. He keeps his hoarding to allocated places and it works for us. I'm allowed to bin his rubbish from time to time - real rubbish - packages of food, shoes and clothes with holes and things like that. I just have to do that slowly so he doesn't notice that. So, as far as hoarding goes, we're at good place.

But, we have two problems, one that we have now, and the other that we will have in few years.

1. Toys - my MIL is lovely woman, but she likes to bring toys - lot of them to my children. We live in a three bedroom apartment and with four of us there is not much place for them. I created a system with one huge chest, ikea trofast, chest of drawers and few others places for toys. But there is too much of stuff. And considering the fact that my children are small we're talking about big toys. I can get rid of smaller items without anybody noticing, but with bigger items it's a problem. And my husband doesn't want to get rid of anything. So, what to do and how to do it?

1. Two kids in three bedroom apartment - I have a soon to be 6-year old boy and one year old girl. My little boy sleeps in his room and my little girl is with us in her bed in our bedroom. And she'll stay there till her third birthday. As I said before, my husband has a room for himself but in two-three years we will need that room for our little girl. But that means that he will have to lose his room, and the moment he loses his room, his junk will occupy the rest of of our flat. And when that happens, I know that we will fight all the time because I can't live in clutter. My brain can't handle that and I know I will became a horrible wife and horrible mother after that. Please don't judge me.

What to do? It would be ideal to find bigger place, but I don't think that will be possible in next 7 or 8 years. Was there anybody with similar problem. how did you solve it?

I'm not convinced reading this that your husband is a hoarder. I suspect he likes to have a lot of things he likes and also ones he finds useful and you feel is a lot of filthy unuseable tat? Eg he will have a box of cables or mint condition toys and you think thats not necessary in your nice small home?

It feels like a fundamental disagreement where you cant accommodate the things he finds valuable into your life. He's had to shut his life into one room and you get to keep all the others exactly as you need to feel happy and content.

Just reading a lot of people here saying he needs therapy but he doesnt feel like he's unhappy with his space - its you. You are unwilling to let his posessions spill out into your living areas.

You really only have a few options

1. Get really clever with storage and accept your flats style and clean lines etc will change. Your husband has to let some items go.
2. Let your daughter and son share until you are able to move, ideally before your son turns 10
3. Move now

I just dont think an option is asking your husband to get rid of everything he values just because you think its rubbish.

Your MIL is a red herring! Dont compound the two problems into one to prove your husband is being unreasonable.

MIL isn’t the main issue but isn’t a ‘red herring’ if family hoarding and issues have contributed to OP’s H’s issues.

Either he has a hoarding MH issue, or he’s selfish. Or both!

@AntiSocialDistancer

I'm not convinced reading this that your husband is a hoarder. I suspect he likes to have a lot of things he likes and also ones he finds useful and you feel is a lot of filthy unuseable tat? Eg he will have a box of cables or mint condition toys and you think thats not necessary in your nice small home?

It feels like a fundamental disagreement where you cant accommodate the things he finds valuable into your life. He's had to shut his life into one room and you get to keep all the others exactly as you need to feel happy and content.

Just reading a lot of people here saying he needs therapy but he doesnt feel like he's unhappy with his space - its you. You are unwilling to let his posessions spill out into your living areas.

You really only have a few options

1. Get really clever with storage and accept your flats style and clean lines etc will change. Your husband has to let some items go.
2. Let your daughter and son share until you are able to move, ideally before your son turns 10
3. Move now

I just dont think an option is asking your husband to get rid of everything he values just because you think its rubbish.

Your MIL is a red herring! Dont compound the two problems into one to prove your husband is being unreasonable.

He needs an entire room and two wardrobes? Sounds like a hoarder

It is important to me for my little girl to have a room of her own. I shared with my brother and hated every second of that.

Writing all this it seems to me like we'll have to swap our bedroom for living room couch in due time. Time to find a comfortable couch.

And I'll talk with my MIL and ask her if she could store some of the bigger toys that are cluttering the room. She has enough space in her other house and I think she would do that. I haven't thought about that before.

As far of the pp who said that I do not have a room of my own, in a way it is true, but when you come to our flat you see it was decorated with me in the mind. The only place that feels his is that room and two wardrobes.

I can’t believe that you’re seriously entertaining the idea of sleeping on a couch instead of in a perfectly good bedroom; solely to accommodate your DH’s hoarding tendencies. Can you actually hear yourself? This is madness

My friend called me a hoarder. I'm not. I asked her what she meant and she talked about my bookshelves that were full, my vinyl records and all my bathroom products (I probably do have too many but they are stowed on shelving). She just meant that I have stuff on show. Her house is like a hotel suite.
Is it really hoarding or is collections of things? Can you get in his room and move around freely? Or is it wall to wall with piles of stuff that is packed perilously together?

What does your husband suggest when you ask where your daughter is going to sleep?

At the minute we’ve got a third bedroom full of junk but there was no doubt in mine or my husband’s minds that it will be going in the attic or to the charity shop when the new baby arrives, because the baby deserves their own room more than ‘stuff’ does.

I know it’s difficult because my dad wouldn’t categorise himself as a hoarder but their house is full of books and magazines, the attic is full (and I’m not convinced it can bear the weight), the garage is full, books stacked floor to ceiling and the living room has walls covered in book shelves. He also often finds that he’s bought the same book twice, but he feels that he wants all these books and they’re useful, whereas to anyone else having 7,000 or 8,000 books in a residential house would be completely ridiculous. There’s just no getting through to him and he laughs off the suggestion of therapy.

God no. Dont sleep on the couch so your husband can keep his room of junk!
Can he keep his hoard at his parents house?
Or get a storage unit/shed if not at yours then at the house his parents have for their hoard.
As far as toys go, when one comes in, one goes out, tell your in laws this too, do the know for everything that they bring your kids will have to give something up. Donate it to charity for all the little boys and girls who didn't get any presents. Will be a good lesson for them. Maybe allow 1 or 2 extras to stay if you're worried about being mean.

He cant expect to have a whole room dedicated to junk when that means someone else doesn't get a bedroom.

Idea, shove a bed in his junk room, he can sleep in his paradise and you and your daughter can share the big room.

You said he wants "a little piece of your home to be himself" . He has a massive piece of your home. In fact, you have a bedroom you share with two others as your space. He has an entire bedroom for his crap. Figure out what percentage of floor space that is. He is not entitled to this space. He's being a dick. He needs help from mental health professionals to sort out this illness.

I can't believe people are suggesting sleeping on the sofa when he has a room full of junk!!!
Is your room quite big?
If so you have a couple of options:

1. His wardrobes are moved in to your room and he gets a corner /side of it as "his" bit. This is the most logical, but it will require some culling from him. But he has a couple of years to prepare for it.
2. Your daughter continues to share your room (could you split it into 2 or use a room divider?) and he sleeps in his room.

What would happen if you said that you wanted a space or a room to put your things, for something like a hobby or a collection ??
There are 2 things here - he is being very selfish by taking that space for his things with no care for anybody else needing that space. Also he has mental health issues that you both need help with so you need to contact gp .
Maybe google for local support groups to speak with people in the same position as yourselves nearby ?

So he 'needs' his own room but your ds and dd don't? That's illogical and selfish. While other's dc share rooms when they don't have the rooms, that is not your situation. You do have a room for each child - but he's claimed it.

Moving your bed to the living room is just accommodating him again. It not a compromise, it's an accommodation! The idea that you camp out in the living room when you have the bedrooms is ridiculous. (Where do you go you want an early night and he doesn't? Where o the dc go if they get up early and you're still asleep?)

You no long have the 'luxury' of a spare room for his junk. Your situation has changed since you and he agreed to this set up. He needs to find a way of dealing with his hoarding that doesn't compromise his family. You need to stop trying to work around it. And it is you doing all the work!
He needs therapy - and that could take years, so he needs to start now. Your compromise here is to insist on him starting therapy now and allowing him.time to make slow progress.

Hoarding is infamous for escalating as people age! It gets worse, it rarely stays at the same level.

And what happens if the dc go into 'his' room - mouldy food lying around they might eat; things they might break (how will he cope with that); they might hurt themselves by pulling things down, etc etc etc.

And stop being so accommodating to his parents too! " No that does not fit in the apartment, you'll have to take it home with you". On repeat!

His wardrobes are built in and in the halls so impossible to move. An there is no place from them in our room.

And he is a hoarder - I'm writing this from his room of doom and it is full of broken computers, tv, broken fridge, empty boxes of diapers, packages of eaten food, empty bottles of coke, shoes with holes in it, floor full of clothes he will never wear again, papers on every surface, things like. He is terribly unorganized and it takes him half a day if he has to find a document or something like that so I take care for family papers and he just for his own things.

Thank you for all your lovely aswers. You gave me a lot to think about. I have to go now so I'll not be able to answer any questions.

@kavalkada

It is important to me for my little girl to have a room of her own. I shared with my brother and hated every second of that.

Writing all this it seems to me like we'll have to swap our bedroom for living room couch in due time. Time to find a comfortable couch.

And I'll talk with my MIL and ask her if she could store some of the bigger toys that are cluttering the room. She has enough space in her other house and I think she would do that. I haven't thought about that before.

As far of the pp who said that I do not have a room of my own, in a way it is true, but when you come to our flat you see it was decorated with me in the mind. The only place that feels his is that room and two wardrobes.

Then redecorate to better reflect his tastes too, and reclaim the room of shit for your daughter. That would be a fair compromise.

I would absolutely tell him it is unacceptable in a house with children to have empty coke bottles and food wrappers anywhere because it’s incredibly unhygienic.

Then I would tell him that he needs to earn more money to buy a bigger home if he wants to have a room of his own because there’s no way that two children should have to share when there’s a completely fine spare room that one of them can sleep in.

Jeez.

@kavalkada

His wardrobes are built in and in the halls so impossible to move. An there is no place from them in our room.

And he is a hoarder - I'm writing this from his room of doom and it is full of broken computers, tv, broken fridge, empty boxes of diapers, packages of eaten food, empty bottles of coke, shoes with holes in it, floor full of clothes he will never wear again, papers on every surface, things like. He is terribly unorganized and it takes him half a day if he has to find a document or something like that so I take care for family papers and he just for his own things.

This would make me cry.

He needs to think about the behaviour he is role modelling to the kids.

Have you talked to him about these two concerns? What does he see happening when your DCs need their own room? Does he have a suggestion? I know what this is like. My Mother in laws second husband was the same and she was very tough with him. He hoarded in one room which was full to the gills and the walls were yellow with pipe smoke but the rest of the house was immaculate. Doesnt help you though. He needs to come up with a solution. Its not just your problem.

My DMum (now 83) is a hoarder and untidy with it .
When I was growing up I just thought she was untidy . No interest in housework. She'd empty a drawer or cupboard , rake through things thn leave it there .

Now she's very imobile , I can see she is overwhelmed by stuff and sometimes even getting out of her bed is too much effort . So she goes to the bathroom and back to bed .

DMum came from a post war era , things were never thrown out . She speaks fondly of things my GM made for her .
My DMum always had sewing machines and knitting machines which took up loads of space but she rarely finished things .
She "rescued" things people were throwing out . Really random tat .
She had collections - books , plants,teapots ,cruets, clocks ...all over the house .

One thing I know from experience :

You cannot just ride roughshod over a hoarders belongings .

Each time I visit , we go through her bedroom.
we have a Recycle/Bin/Donate piles
Some things she wants to donate are just rubbish, but if I say "Oh that needs to go in the bin" she'll want to keep it .
So I have to sneak it out

And - if a space occurs , she will fill it with more rubbish .

She had a huge cardboard box full of clothes in front of her wardrobe - that she couldn't get into because of the huge box

Anything she stores tat in - boxes , those plastic tubs for laundry capsuals , ice cream tubs - once they're empty have to go in the recycle . Otherwise she fills them.

And she's sneaky too . I left a load of material that she said was going to be a coat . On condition if it wasn't sewn up, she had to recycle the material.
Of course she didn't ....and she hid it !

Last time I visited (before Covid) I brought a load of stuff to my house to dump.
I couldn't let my Dad take it on the bus and she wouldn't let it out the house .

I think if you get the room or wardrobes empty - lock them. Don't let the pull of Nature Abhors A Vacuum enable him to fill it .

Things like proper rubbish you can be justified in binning .

Things that have been given are more difficult , they feel that the giver will be offended . I say to my Mum "Is Betty going to come round your house and ask where the case is ? No"

It is difficult I know .
But I tell you this for real. Being the child in a Hoarders House is bloody hard . I spent my entire childhood in emaressment of the house .
And if we tried to tidy up, we were told what we couldn't throw out .
We were told off for only tidying because we wanted friends round .
And we couldn't have friends round because the house was untidy !

Every birthday/Mothers Day she said she wanted A Tidy House . Which meant us tidying . But as above , it never worked .

That was long ............but SO theraputic .

He's very firmly putting himself above his child. She needs her own space, but he'd rather keep piles of crap. He needs therapy.

My granddad had a shed (actually a ramshackle barn because he bought a smallholding and turned it into a magnificent garden) and ti the day he died it was crammed with old lawnmowers, bicycles, creosote, rat-traps, his tin hat and gasmask.

Wonderful for a child to play in but I now see it as hoarding. I worry that I take after him (but I have no barn.)

His (younger) wife kept the house spotless and tidy with almost no junk, but some old family things.

it is full of broken computers, tv, broken fridge, empty boxes of diapers, packages of eaten food, empty bottles of coke, shoes with holes in it

I can understand wanting to keep thing's that may have use in the future - for example a working fridge... but what is his reasoning for keeping a broken one? Is he a fridge repair man or capable of fixing it?

What purpose does he think the empty boxes or bottles will serve?