To ask what is wrong with this cow

[SHAR0N]

This dairy cow belongs to the farmer in the next village and it looks very ill. Should I report it to the RSPCA?

I know nothing about cows or farming and don’t want to cause trouble if it’s normal. But I don’t want to ignore it if the animal is suffering.

Yes @SHAR0N the cow does look under conditioned but as others have pointed out she is in a field of grass so not being starved as others have suggested. By the sounds of it these two cows have been separated by the farmer because they are unwell/under treatment etc. They may be further away from the farm because they are not being milked and therefore dont need to walk home.

It wouldnt be wrong to speak to DEFRA about this if you are concerned. I've been involved in checks on farms after calls to defra and it may be as simple as an inspection and double check. If there is a known reason for this animal to be underweight and it is being addressed there would be no lasting consequences for the farmer.

The skinny of fatness of cows is referred to as their body condition and can be scored as a score between 1 and 5. You can easily find info on how this is done by googling cow body condition chart. A good body condition for a cow in milk is 2.5. This can look 'skinny' to those that are not used to looking at cows. The optimal condition is help the cow stay healthy. Cows that are too fat are at risk of health problems eg. Ketosis, twisted stomach and difficult calvings. And yes skinny cows are a problem too.

Just a small point to address the comments re: dairy calves. As mentioned there have been instances where dairy bull calves have been shot at birth. This is due to their low value - a side effect of cheap meat. Despite this the vast majority of farmers I work with still raise their dairy bull calves even if that is for a loss. The vast majority of dairy by calves get raised on the dairy farm or sold to be raised for meat (not much veal farming where I am).

Dairy calves are removed from their mothers for a lot of health reasons. As mentioned above Johnes disease is a big health risk to cattle. Drinking milk from an infected cow can infect a calf for life. They are clinically well until at some point >2 years of age when they will stop absorbing protein and scour until they die. There is no treatment. Removing young calves is a way of dealing with this to prevent the next generation being infected.

As mentioned there have been instances where dairy bull calves have been shot at birth.

95,000 ‘instances’ per year, in fact.

@IrishStout

Thank you for your helpful post. On the cow body condition chart for dairy, they would score a one.

I know nothing about farming but I’ve lived in the country for 20 years and I’m used to looking at both beef and dairy animals. These look worse than any I have ever seen, which is why I assumed that they were sick and not neglected, as in my OP.

And here's SadSisters again trying to make us all think diary is BAD

What's the issue with removing the calves at birth? They're COWS, not people.

Omg please raise this concern with someone if you feel like you cannot approach the farmer call rspca.

@Bluesheep8

It may have been very ill and was inside s shed for treatment. Farmer may have recently let her out to convalesce.

If the op would just follow the advice of all the people who have taken the time and trouble to respond, and ring the RSPCA she may well be able to ascertain if this is the case

I posted about this at MIDNIGHT last night . I’m amazed that you expect it to be done and dusted, with a report back from the RSPCA within 12 hours .

I know it sounds horrid to shoot bull calves but I can’t see that it is any more horrid than being killed later. DD works in agriculture and had a boyfriend who was a heard manager. The owner of the farm hated the culling of bull calves so decided to send them to market. He then tracked them to see where they ended up. Within 24 hours they had been slaughtered for the pet food industry, so your dog’s meaty food could well contain baby calf. After that they went back to dispatching the bull calves on the farm.

Sexed semen does seem an excellent idea, but is more expensive and, I’m told, is not as efficient, and if it doesn’t take you have to wait for the cow to bull again before having another go.

There are good and bad farmers just like there are good and bad people. These cows have been separated out, so the farmer is obviously aware of them, but by the fact he is obnoxious to members of the public may mean he isn’t a paragon of animal welfare, on the other hand he may well be giving two old girls a few weeks rest before their ultimate end.

Also, most small holding farmers don't shoot their calves. They typically rear them for a few years and sell them on, or sell them at market where they're usually bought by someone who is going to bring them on. There's plenty of cows we own who are well into their teenage years, too.

Intensive farms are much more likely to focus entirely on productivity rather than morals or emotions. We need to start boycotting these set ups and try to promote smaller farmers again.

Honestly, there's a world of difference in the care of animals where a farmer knows near enough every cow and her personality, as opposed to a farm worker who milks thousands of cows a day.

Most farmers are happy to answer questions asked.

We remove calves at about 24 hours. Rightly or wrongly most maternal instincts have been bred out from Holsteins. The mothers rarely bellow or show distress, they are more interested in food.

Our calves are kept in a calf house, in individual pens, in full sight of each other. This allows us to monitor each calf's feeding, we know exactly what each calf is drinking and eating, spot illness sooner and treat it and as recent global events prove, isolation stops illness spreading. Once weaned they are placed into larger groups which they stay in. In an ideal world I would have this lely.com/gb/solutions/feeding/calm/ but we are a smaller scale farm and often only have 5 calves on milk so can't justify the cost.

Usually after 3 months but this varies, some cows need extra time. UK average calving interval stands at 410 days ( days between calvings).

I can only provide information on what we do on our farm. We have very few bull calves born due to sexed semen. Our cows are high yielders which mean that we can keep less cows whilst still producing the same amount of milk. Less cows allows us to spend more time with each cow and reduces the impact on the environment.

@SadSisters
Thank for providing those 2 links, I'm sure that you have read them carefully, I'll be quoting from them in future.

The Morrisons article seems to support what I was saying, things are changing.

I agree that the second link is from 2020, it is based on a report carried out by CHAWG (Cattle Health and Welfare Group) that was first published in March 2018. Again it appears to back me up. "Bull calves euthanised on farm reduced 84817 in 2006 to 64883 in 2013 a reduction of 23%". "Number of farmers using sexed semen in 2016 increased from 60% to 67% in 2017". "Percentage of bull calves retained at birth rose from 60% in 2006 to 81% in 2015". This report contains no information regarding bull calf cull rates since 2015.
As I said, things are improving and thank for helping to support that claim.

And here's SadSisters again trying to make us all think diary is BAD

What's the issue with removing the calves at birth? They're COWS, not people.

I think that’s potentially one of the most unpleasant things I’ve ever read on here. Do you generally condone other forms of animal mistreatment because they’re ‘not people’?

@SHAR0N I agree she looks undercondioned and a call to defra would ensure that you are happy you've covered all basis and that it is looked at. As I've said before there may be a farm welfare issue, there may just be a sick cow under treatment in a field recovering. If he isnt approachable then it's not the wrong option at all. I would say in my experience defra are better at dealing with farm welfare concerns than RSPCA.

@SadSisters I didnt disagree with you I've not double checked your figures but with dairy cow numbers at 2.69million that figure is 3% of calves born which tells us that the vast majority of farmers DONT shoot their dairy bull calves. I agree with you that is isn't acceptable as a practice but while people refuse to pay what it costs to rear meat it is a factor. The only time I've seen farmers shoot dairy bull calves is when they are under TB restrictions and unable to sell/move animals. This is a huge multifaceted issue that is being addressed by the industry.

For those that asked: legally calves have to be housed within sight and touch of other calves (this is different to US rules for anyone researching). Most farms house them in small groups of young calves.

@SHAR0N
I think that some of the negative comments you are receiving is due to the fact that nearly 13 hours later, you have let to confirm if you have reported your concerns. Even your last post you did not provide clarity.

I posted about this at MIDNIGHT last night . I’m amazed that you expect it to be done and dusted, with a report back from the RSPCA within 12 hours.

I expect that someone who is concerned enough to post pictures on the internet and take the time and trouble to seek advise might have made a phone call this morning....

advice

@StylishMummy wow. Just because an animal is not a person doesn’t mean it can’t suffer, feel pain and distress. It doesn’t mean we should treat them in any way we want.

@StylishMummy cows are incredibly sentiment animals. They also experience the same hormone rush women do after giving birth. So separating the calf from the cow is traumatic. There are countless stories of cows chasing trucks with their calf's inside. Just because an animal isn't a person it doesn't mean they don't feel and have emotions similar to ours. It's quite unnerving that you don't see animals as sentient beings. But I suppose ignorance is bliss.

If you haven't already done so, please report it as a precautionary measure. A good farmer will be able to prove they are doing every thing they can and a bad farmer needs talking to.

I'm not a heartless beast but cattle are bred for meat and dairy and have been for millennia - I don't have an issue with it or the practices.

You cannot apply human emotions to animals unless you're all going out and saving everything from a slug to a sloth. It's bonkers

[quote anjiat]@StylishMummy cows are incredibly sentiment animals. They also experience the same hormone rush women do after giving birth. So separating the calf from the cow is traumatic. There are countless stories of cows chasing trucks with their calf's inside. Just because an animal isn't a person it doesn't mean they don't feel and have emotions similar to ours. It's quite unnerving that you don't see animals as sentient beings. But I suppose ignorance is bliss.[/quote]
Ah, Jesus 😢

@StylishMummy

What's the issue with removing the calves at birth? They're COWS, not people.

I don’t believe that humans are the only animals capable of experiencing pain, distress and emotion. There is a wealth of scientific evidence to suggest that non-human animals do experience these things; academic.oup.com/bioscience/article/50/10/861/233998

Ultimately it’s your choice whether or not you care about the pain and suffering of animals. It’s not my business if you don’t. But I do, which is why I advocate for animals when given the opportunity.

You know, anjiat, I was vegetarian most of my adult life, until lapsing a couple of years ago.
Your post has put me firmly back on the wagon.

@StylishMummy just because something has been done for a long time doesn’t mean it’s right, or that we should continue doing it. We now have more of a choice than ever before - we don’t need to cause harm to other sentient animals to feed ourselves. So why do it?

Not to mention that farming is a massive contributor to global warming.

My comment was not rude or offensive. I'd like to know why it was removed. Telling the truth about the meat and dairy industry with no rude words or insults, nothing graphic at all. Why the censorship?

@Pellewsmate thank you for taking the time to write such a full response, I appreciate it.