To think the idea that schools won’t be back full time by September is an absolute disgrace?

[LovingLivingInLockdown]

The government and teaching unions need to pull their fingers out. There should be no excuses.

The effects of 6 months out of school is going to be damaging enough, both educationally and mentally for hundreds of thousands of children. Not to mention the unnoticed abuse and neglect.

Teachers should be wearing PPE with spit screens if they are vulnerable and this should be being organised now. Temporary classrooms should be being built in playgrounds and school fields. Random testing routines in all schools should be being devised as well as guidelines regarding children’s contact with others outside of school and home. Whatever it takes, it must be done.

Our society expects parents to work while their DC are at school and if they want to get the economy moving again, schools being back by September should be non negotiable surely?

We need childcare. That's the crunch. Kids will by and large survive with a few missed months out of a lifetime of education. Not all families would survive the loss of an income that might happen due to lack of childcare.

We need sport clubs, forest schools, leisure centres etc to be able to provide some limited form of childcare.

Muffey

So very true. Where were these people when:

• Schools cut music because they couldn't afford the instrument hire.

-Schools cut DT because they couldn't afford the materials. -Schools missed out part of the curriculum because they couldn't afford to teach it such as elements of computing. -Schools cut swimming lessons because they couldn't afford the coach down there. -Schools cut schools trips because they couldn't afford to part fund them. -Schools cut to a 4 day working week because they couldn't afford the staffing or to heat the place. -Schools were cutting the amount of food each child got to save costs on school dinners. -Schools had to cut TAs which gave support for the most needy. -Schools had to cut cleaners because they couldn't afford it. -Schools had to turn the heating off/teach without lights on because they couldn't afford it. -Schools were crowd funding for resources like pencils and books. -Schools were working with broken and dangerous furniture because they couldn't afford to replace it. -Schools cut pastoral and mental health care because they couldn't afford it.

They weren't supporting us then, they ignored the damage to their children's education because they didn't care enough to fight for it. They didn't care that their children were getting a sub standard education.

We have R/1/6 back in school, together with keyworkers so making up about 80 children out of a school of 250. all of our staff, bar two who are seriously vulnerable are back in school, we are using every space pssible to ensure we have every child in that we can. We are following the rules set by the government and local authority to the letter, distancing where possible, bubbles where not, constant handwashing, online and home school learning for those not in, one way systems, 2 m distancing, individual spaces and resources, everything in the 19 page risk assessment we have to follow to demonstrate we are keeping the children safe. The stress is horrendous, we have had passer-bys shouting at staff on the playground that we are not keeping the children apart and parents phoning in to complain that their year 4 child isn't in school and what are we going to do about it. Yet the children are walking out of the school door at 2m intervals to parents standing having a smoke and a chat together, are having sleep-overs at friends houses, going to the public playground together and having picnics and barbecues in each others gardens. It is not schools stopping children coming back full time, it is the government and those keeping the R rate above 1 that are doing so.

If teachers still don't want to come back, then their jobs should be given to another professional

Now, what other professionals might be interested in becoming teachers? Architects, lawyers, doctors, accountants, engineers perhaps?

I suspect that they wouldn't want to take a pay cut, and for many it would mean an increase in hours if they were to do a teaching job properly.

Nurses might be prepared to do it. A lot of them are already working long hours for shit money, and they're used to putting themselves at risk of catching Covid, (although they at least get PPE while doing so).

Now, who can we get to take over the nurses' jobs?

@Galesthismorning
I agree with you. This is the more compelling reason for schools to fully reopen, but still it isn’t viable.

Now, what other professionals might be interested in becoming teachers? Architects, lawyers, doctors, accountants, engineers perhaps?

Well:

1. New graduates who can’t get jobs
2. Any graduate who has lost their job

🤷🏻‍♀️🙄

@Nowimlivinginexeter well good for you.

My husband was admitted to hospital, his brother suffered 40% cardiac failure as a result of the virus so is now disabled at 58, my brothers business partner was in ICU for 8 weeks and will never be the same again and my friends mum died of it in a care home.

Opening all schools to all pupils at this point in time is not a risk to the kids but to the wider community

Until there's a vaccine, the risk will be there. How long can we wait?

Like i said, nearly half the deaths in people aged 85+. Do I think prolonging the life of very elderly people by perhaps a few months, is worth the destruction caused by lockdown? No.

Graduate =/= professional. HTH.

feelingfragile

I'm sorry you were so ill and doubtless many others have also had similar experiences which is horrid.

But that experience is not the majority one. That is provably the case.

You don’t need to meet some random online definition of what a ‘professional’ is to be a teacher. You need to be a graduate HTH

"Do you think one life is worth more than the education of every single child?"
I think my childs life is worth more than their education. Do you not with yours? Keeping my child safe does not affect the education of every single child. Are you mad?! Why would you think that,! They have missed 3 months, that's all. If I chose to keep my child off that in no way affects the education of every child? How silly is that. You do not know me, or my child. You do not know my family or any health risks. So you cant sit there and spout off how safe they will be, or how my choices affect every other childs education. You do not know where I live or how many cases there are in my area. I do, and I will make choices suitable for my child and my family.

What some posters seem to be forgetting is that schools cannot just decide to "get on with it". We have no government guidelines for re-opening in September, we cannot plan or write the timetable as we don't know how many children we will be allowed to have on site (secondary) . Schools are doing everything they can - we are putting up screens, ordering ppe, creating potential timetables for blended learning scenarios, ordering laptops for students who don't have them.... But until we get some real guidance from the government we are guessing!! You cannot organise hundreds of students and staff on guesswork!! And the likelihood is that this government will make some half-arsed announcements and then leave it all to schools to rush to sort out in August.

That’s totally fine tabbymumz but if you I assume are intending to homeschool longer term why is your opinion about when schools open for the rest of the children important?

I’m not sure why they don’t currently have much more centralised planning given we are supposed to have a national curriculum. Not to the extent of set lessons, obviously adjustments have to be made for the particular children in a class, but online school, moving school etc would be an awful lot easier if we could just decide every child does Romans in year 2, every child reads book x in year 3 etc. One set of maths resources, one nationally specified set of reading scheme books (online, free on e readers, by all means varied in type and style within that scheme). I agree

@LovingLivingInLockdown are you working from home?

[quote RickOShay]@Galesthismorning
I agree with you. This is the more compelling reason for schools to fully reopen, but still it isn’t viable.[/quote]
Not yet. But maybe separating the education from childcare issue would help. We can't magic up more teachers, and rather than draft in any and all recent graduates to become teachers we could acknowledge that we need both education and childcare, but that they dont necessarily need to be the same provider right now

I think my childs life is worth more than their education. Do you not with yours?

Bliley it's like pulling teeth.

Yes, of course everyone thinks their own dcs life is worth it.

If I had a straight choice between my dc dying or keeping them off school, I'd choose the latter...No one would disagree.

However, just stepping out of your front door is a risk. How far does your risk aversion go?

I have no idea of your family situation. I was basing my argument on the premise that your dc is an average healthy child. In which case, the risk is negligible to them personally.

In all honesty and with respect...I think you have no idea what I mean when I discuss risk from a theoretical point of view. You keep banging on about the importance of lives...Maybe discuss this on Facebook with the huns, they'll all agree with you.

@derxa I also agree. There are organisations like the Open University who have built up years of experience running online courses. How difficult would it be to extend that experience down into the school curriculum- not very given that it's a national curriculum.

"Teateaandmoretea

That’s totally finetabbymumzbut if you I assume are intending to homeschool longer term why is your opinion about when schools open for the rest of the children important?"
I havent homeschooled. They are teens. My opinion for my child does not affect when schools open. I have not advocated that schools should stay shut, just that I wont send my child until I'm ready.

I will never ever support another school closure again, it is impossible to reopen them!

The only sector that will still remain largely closed will be schools come July. Everything else will be open, it is an absolute travesty. By September if some can't even manage to open after six months of planning time there will be legal action and schools permanently closed for sure.

@GalesThisMorning
Yes. But the logistics of that?

"formerbabe

I think my childs life is worth more than their education. Do you not with yours?

Bliley it's like pulling teeth.

Yes, of course everyone thinks their own dcs life is worth it.

If I had a straight choice between my dc dying or keeping them off school, I'd choose the latter...No one would disagree."

Well you seem to. For me that's the bottom line.

Well please everyone write to your MP (super easy, you can just email) and ask them to stop the nonsense regarding bubbles and social distancing to get the children back.

I for one am happy if teachers want to wear PPE. The staff in some of the local shops wear it, I disagree children will be frightened.

I also intend to write to the school to offer my part time services (I work) if required. I will pay for my DBS if I need to. I can at least listen to children read and be a TA type support person. Not everyone can do this but I bet some people can.

Okay @formerbabe, maybe half of all deaths are in an age group that would probably not have much longer anyway, but what about the others? What about the ones who haven't died but have become very ill?

We didn't lockdown to save the lives of a few 85+, as you well know. We were trying to flatten the curve. We are now in a process (or should be) of very carefully lifting lockdown. If we also had robust track and trace mechanisms it would be much better.

What we can't do is fling the doors wide open and say go for it. It's not an old vs young issue. It's what do we all do to ensure the virus does not overwhelm communities. Hopefully by doing that now September can be more of a normal educational experience