To think if you can keep your kids off school beyond September, you should?

[user8558]

Firstly I want to make absolutely clear that by "can" I mean people in similar circumstances to myself. I've no job anymore due to coronavirus, my industry will be one of the last to find its feet so I'm likely unemployed for the forseeable. Fortunately my partner is able to cover bills etc with his income.

I'm a bit wary of schools going back in August. For me it feels too soon.

However, I also know it's not soon enough for many other families. That working parents are struggling and for many other reasons kids are really missing school.

Am I being unreasonable then in thinking perhaps that people like myself, with nothing better to do anyway (and have the mental resources) are doing everyone else a favour by keeping our kids home to make life easier for teachers and other kids trying to manage in cramped schools? To make social distancing in the classroom easier for those who need and want to be there.

LauraChant Fri 12-Jun-20 11:44:37
I don't agree. I think children need a lot from school that they cannot get from home including social interaction. They need to learn how to compromise, turn take, debate, work with others, carry out group enquiries, etc etc . A lot of this they would be learning in the playground. I know a lot of people home school, but their children would generally be interacting with others through activity groups etc. My children are still learning at home but they are visibly drooping through lack of social contact.

This ^

School is about more than the curriculum.
Proper home education would include planned peer and world interaction, which cannot be provided at the moment, and if you were to provide in September would make the health risk the same as school anyway.

I am concerned about the well being of children whose parents believe they need nothing more than being in their home with only immediate family for interaction for months and months.
Children need much more than this.

Nope. I dont need childcare - like you I'm a SAHM. But my Y6 was struggling with the lack of social interaction, and learning nothing because all school sent were SATs revision worksheets. He is now back at school, with half his class, in a different room, with a different teacher, and loving it.
My year 4 is loving not being at school, because he is a total introvert. He needs to go back for social immersion! He is also learning very little, as the maths has reverted to standard maths rather than his stretch maths, and and googling "fronted adverbial noun phrase " or similar to check his english work sheets just gets met with "if Mummy doesn't know, why do I need to learn it?". Its not great for either socially, and is a disaster for both academically being at home.

I think "if you can" is one of many factors to consider, too many to make a blanket 'should' statement. Just because someone can do something doesn't mean they should, as cool as dinosaurs could be.

I don't think home education, or any similar responsibility, should be done because someone has "nothing better to do" and I've never home educated to make school easier for others. I don't see how it would - if you keep the place, they still have a responsibility towards the child whether or not you do the work set, if you withdraw from the school and do it all on your own "properly", the place in many areas is just filled by someone else. I can see the benefits of keeping off for the autumn term - as already said it's likely going to be a bit chaotic if even available - but more for consistency for kids and health concerns for those at risk. I personally hate dividing out 'proper' home educators (that was an annoying debate even before all this), but there are also risks and benefits to consider there, even without all the additions brought on for times like this which kinda make doing it properly far harder to impossible.

I have no intent of keeping my kids off further if they wish to return. I have one kid who was in school part-time, one who was full-time, and two home educated kids before this (though one has a place at secondary for this September). I could keep them home, but I don't see a benefit for them, their school, or this household unless we were in a position where we had to self-isolate as a household.

I'm a SAHM ex-teacher and my DCs are struggling with home schooling because at 7 and 9 (the 9yo with SENs) they don't have the educational maturity to work effectively without peers. Collaborative learning is vital at all ages, and especially so with younger years.

If I had chosen home education, we would be part of home education groups and we would be more intutitve and child-focused on the learning, not following a content heavy curriculum with a lot of dubious content (especially the grammar).

When our opportunity to get back to school returns, my DCs will be in. They have already missed too much to their detriment.

Is there a law that says Government have to provide an education for kids.
I can quote section 7 of the education act, as got so used to it over the years. but have never seen anything saying what the government are required to do.

I 'could' keep my DC home. I'm well-educated and I could teach my DC at home with the right resources.
I won't be though.
They need school and respond to learning better in a school environment.

I don’t feel indefinite homeschooling is essential mitigation in terms of the risk presented to my family. We shall be returning to work and school.

For me a lot of British people I know are really poorly educated (I don't live in the UK) so I really wouldn't be suggesting you keep your children out of education for any longer than you have to.

@blahblahblahetcetc

For me a lot of British people I know are really poorly educated (I don't live in the UK) so I really wouldn't be suggesting you keep your children out of education for any longer than you have to.

Nice

This is an interesting thread. I am one in a similar position to the OP. My children are doing a full timetable and we are surviving (although perhaps not thriving).

A few years ago I worked at a government organisation where we would sometimes talk about being people being recklessly prudent - that is, relentlessly pursuing the main goal of the department without taking into account all the other things that needed to do done. I can see that it might have been reasonable to close schools for a few weeks to get corona more under control. However, I’d probably class keeping children out of school for over six months as “recklessly prudent”. Children need the opportunity to interact with their peers. There will be children who haven’t seen another child for three months - this isn’t healthy.

Having to “stay safe” long term will become unsafe.

For me a lot of British people I know are really poorly educated (I don't live in the UK) so I really wouldn't be suggesting you keep your children out of education for any longer than you have to

This comment indicates way more about you than it does about Brits lolol

Is there a law that says Government have to provide an education for kids.

I have no idea.

However if there isn’t and it becomes clear they aren’t going to, then taxpayers have every right to question why so much money is required for a sector that is delivering far below expected levels.

Is there a law that says Government have to provide an education for kids

Yes there is- we have a constitutional right to an education and this is law.

I have a year 6 child who is going back 4 days as that all school can offer. I am a key worker and But have not used the kw care yet. However, from next week I’m sending my year 2 child as a Kw child as I’m worried about him-he’s a very anxious child and he will build up going back into this huge thing by August and this has manifested as a tic in the past-it’s awful. He needs to go back.

"The right to education in the United Kingdom is provided for in Schedule 1, First Protocol, Article 2 of the Human Rights Act 1998, which provides as follows:

No person shall be denied the right to education. In the exercise of any functions which it assumes in relation to education and to teaching, the State shall respect the right of parents to ensure such education and teaching in conformity with their own religious and philosophical convictions.[1]

While the UK does not have a written constitution, it is often said that the UK has an unwritten constitution made up of important statutes, common law precedents, and unwritten conventions.[2] The Human Rights Act 1998, which incorporates most of the substantive provisions of the European Convention on Human Rights into the domestic law of the UK, provides an informal codification of many of the rights typically contained in written constitutions.[3]"

Then it goes on and on....

It’s definitely in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights - school for primary aged children, which should be free.

Technically, the government has to provide an education, not sure it translates as opening schools in the middle of a pandemic.

The fact that we disagree with the quality of said education is another matter.

I already strongly disagreed with the over-crowding and the education offered long before the pandemic...

not sure it translates as opening schools in the middle of a pandemic.

I wonder how the international courts would view ‘suspending the curriculum’?

Nope. Children are entitled to an education from the state. The state will have to sort out how that is provided in September.

Teachers should not be asked to provide online learning in addition to teaching at school. I won't be and I will be back teaching my year group before the Summer on a part time basis, I know a few other schools who have the capacity to bring some more year groups back, too. However, it's parents' choice to send them back in, if not they will have to seek other forms of online learning as it's their choice and no longer the school's responsibility.

I think if there is headroomto risk transmission if the virus by opening up, it would be fairer to give it to schooling than certain other activities. Even if that costs money.

WHat we are doing at the moment isnt home education - that would involve a lot more social interaction.

Being stuck at home isnt normal - DS met a friend yesterday at the park (he is 7 so not going back) and then because it rained we got picked up by his Dad and as he got in the car he said Dad I feel like a normal human being

What about those who are shielding though?

Not everyone is able to manage their own child's learning at home.

I agree, it's too much to expect teachers to do this on top of teaching, but perhaps the government could provide some kind of mass-scale program (based on Oak, perhaps) and give out/lend laptops.

I wonder how the international courts would view ‘suspending the curriculum’?

It will be interesting, but you do know the government would have been equally sued for not taking the pandemic seriously and endangering the kids.. Either way, any decision would have been equally criticised and attacked.

I don't specially agree with the way things have been done, especially when we were so behind we had more data than other countries, but the government was always going to be an easy target.

Teachers should not be asked to provide online learning in addition to teaching at school. I won't be

can you refuse to do the job you are given to do?

I am only used to private sector, where you get the boot if you are not happy.