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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Very strange fence issue - is my mother being unreasonable?

74 replies

Ric2013 · 11/06/2020 21:15

My mother retired a few years ago and rents out her old house in England.

While she still lived in her house, she asked her old neighbour whether he owned the fence on his side and he said he owned it. Since my mother didn't own it, she left it alone.

New neighbour has decided he thinks the fence may be dangerous for his kids and says we aren't sure who owns it. Since legal boundaries do shift, my mother and I discuss the likelihood of the old neighbour being mistaken. All the evidence on the ground suggests that the fence was very probably the neighbour's and there is nothing written down, but my mother is not the one making a fuss, even though she thinks the neighbour owns the fence. My mother's tenants have expressed no opinion on the fence.

Neighbour says he needs a high close fence as he wants 100% privacy over his entire garden "so his children can play naked if they want to" (despite the fact that he has a further section of garden behind a massive hedge that is private).

The new neighbour has suggested they pay halves for a new fence and obtained a quote that is completely out of my mother's budget. Mum has said she cannot afford it, and she doesn't need a high fence anyway. I suggested they could go halves on a shared hedge on the boundary (they could each maintain their own half that way). New neighbour wasn't interested and again suggested going halves on a new fence of a design he thinks is suitable. Mum doesn't care what he does, provided he pays for it and doesn't encroach on her land.

The way I see it is that they cannot possibly compromise. My mother's neighbour has no interest in her clematis and can't be expected to contribute towards it, so why should she contribute towards building a fence she doesn't want?

I'm obviously biased as it's my mother we're talking about, so would appreciate any thoughts others may have.

OP posts:
BabyDancer · 11/06/2020 22:49

@velveteenbunni It's not basic maintenance though is it.

£1,800 for a fence!? That's ridiculous. If they are so keen on having a fancy fence then they should foot the bill. If your mum wants to try to maintain the peace then I would suggest that she contributes £200 towards the costs as a goodwill gesture.

moreofthegreenstuff · 11/06/2020 22:53

@VelveteenBunni

Your mother shouldn't be a LL if she cannot afford basic maintence.
The previous neighbour on that side said it was their fence, not hers. That's why she never maintained it.

Paying halves to have a basic fence put up is one thing. Paying halves for some poncy expensive fence that the new neighbour has chosen is something else entirely.

EveryDayIsADuvetDay · 11/06/2020 22:59

check the deeds - and if it is yours, replace it with whatever you want.
If ND wants something fancy he can pay

& tell the tenants it none of their business - unless they are planning to pay. They don't have any right to be saying what your mother should pay.

Floralnomad · 11/06/2020 22:59

Your mother and her tenants are happy with the crappy fence that is in place , if the neighbour wants a fence then he needs to pay for it . Don’t discuss it any further just tell the neighbours that you will not be contributing at all .

suzy2b · 11/06/2020 23:00

If the one the other side is hers then the other would be the neighbors usually if you face your house the fence on the left is yours

EveryDayIsADuvetDay · 11/06/2020 23:00

how much does a barbed wire fence cost?

SnackSizeRaisin · 11/06/2020 23:02

Your mother shouldn't be a LL if she cannot afford basic maintence.

Reading comprehension not your strong point @VelveteenBunni ?

frumpety · 11/06/2020 23:11

Tell them £900 is unaffordable, see what they come back with.

Sweettea1 · 11/06/2020 23:13

If the fence is on the boundary line She should pay towards it alto I would be telling him am willing to pay towards a basic fence an if he wants something higher or nicer then he pays the extra

BrummyMum1 · 11/06/2020 23:17

Just get your mother to say "I've decided to contribute but I dont have the money right now, I'll let you know when I do". And then just never say anything else. Chances are the neighbour will get fed up of asking and just pay for it themselves.

opentheblinds · 11/06/2020 23:29

I am fairly sure that in the event ownership isn’t mentioned on the deeds that you own/are responsible for the fence to the left of your property.

And as to front or back, I’m less sure but a farmer once told me that you are responsible for the boundary downhill of your land.

Wouldn’t a telephone conversation to a conveyancing solicitor give your mother some clarification and for much less than £900...

Chloemol · 11/06/2020 23:37

If the posts are the neighbours side it indicates to me it’s his fence. So he can do what he wants and your mother does not have to pay

monkeymonkey2010 · 11/06/2020 23:46

It would be cheaper to put potted bamboo along the length of her side of the fence, it grows tall quick and would provide her tenant with privacy - and shield them from possible malicious allegations if neighbor sends his kids out naked.

Neighbour can pay for the fence though....i'd only go 50/50 on it if the replacement was like for like - and if it was on my boundary.
Your mum will share a boundary on one side with a neighbor though so i think it's worth clarifying.

Cherrysoup · 12/06/2020 00:08

The neighbour can crack on putting up a fence. Your mum doesn’t need to be involved, even if it’s her boundary.

Blondebakingmumma · 12/06/2020 00:17

I think I live on a different country. Here both neighbours have to pay half, BUT only half of the cheapest quote. So I suggest your mum gets a cheaper quote for the fence and offer to pay half. IF the neighbour wants a more expensive fence the. He pays the difference

tensmum1964 · 12/06/2020 00:31

The house next door to us is rented. The fence is on their boundary and is basically a pile of rotting wood and half of it had fallen down. I looked in to the law (UK) as was going to approach the landlord who lives abroad. According to what I read, you can choose not to put a fence on your boundary if you don't want to. The law doesn't compel you to. On that basis we replaced it ourselves as wanted our garden to look nice. Tel your Mum to ignore the request or say a flat out no and let them get on with it.

ittakes2 · 12/06/2020 00:33

If you are in the uk the person who has the fence posts on their garden owns the fence.

Sceptre86 · 12/06/2020 09:06

Your mum can't afford it so shouldn't contribute anything. If the neighbour has a problem he needs to fork out the money. You have tried to be reasonable by suggesting a hedge if that doesn't suit then they need to pay themselves.

Ric2013 · 12/06/2020 09:20

@Blondebakingmumma

I think I live on a different country. Here both neighbours have to pay half, BUT only half of the cheapest quote. So I suggest your mum gets a cheaper quote for the fence and offer to pay half. IF the neighbour wants a more expensive fence the. He pays the difference
I've lived in rural Italy. I tried to explain this situation to some friends over there and the reaction was 'Why would you have a tall fence around your garden? Do you have a lot of problems with deer coming in and eating plants? Won't it block the sun? How do the neighbours get through your garden if there's a fence in the way?'

Legally, in the UK she's only responsible for the fence she owns, and only has to have one at all if there are local regulations (such as on new estates). In her case, legally she doesn't have to have a fence at all, but sometimes being reasonable is as important as the law, and what is considered reasonable varies from place to place, which is why I wanted opinions from other people. I've probably spent too much time abroad to be out of touch with what 'normal' people think.

Someone mentioned maximum heights. As far as planning is concerned, 2m is the maximum without permission, and my mother 's comment was 'subject to meeting planning rules, he can do what he likes in his own back garden: it's not my business really'.

OP posts:
makingmammaries · 12/06/2020 11:59

VelveteenBunny:
Your mother shouldn't be a LL if she cannot afford basic maintence.

So if she didn’t have tenants the fence situation would be different? Or are you just someone who likes to bash anyone who rents their house out?

LakieLady · 12/06/2020 12:09

When I was with my ex, he replaced the ancient chestnut paling on our side with chain link that was left over from a job he'd had at work.

Twenty years on, my neighbour asked if I'd mind if she replaced it with close-boarded timber fencing at her own expense. I nearly bit her hand off, it's a lovely fence, we have loads more privacy and it cost me bugger all! The guys who did it were really nice and considerate, too.

I think if her neighbour wants a particular type of fence, he should be paying for it.

TreestumpsAndTrampolines · 12/06/2020 12:14

£1,800 for a fence!? That's ridiculous

Depends how long the fence is - I paid that for an 18m run down the side of my garden, including doing a fair amount of fence-hole digging, and putting in a double gate - but it was a substantial fence! I did maintain both sides at that house, due to an agreement the previous owner had where he'd used what was technically the neighbours fence to run electricity down to the garage, but then all it ever needed was the odd new fence panel - concrete posts and slide-in panels make that the easiest/cheapest thing to maintain ever.

OP's mum has taken responsibility for the fence she believes is hers and maintained it, it's very normal for you to only take on one side in the UK, plus the context clues and the previous owner are that it isn't her fence. The new neighbour is just trying to save themselves money by charging her.

mumwon · 12/06/2020 12:29

very general rule of thumb -usually you own the fence to your left standing at the back of the house but on deeds (or if you look at solicitors letters & q when you purchased the house they usually ask this q) it is marked by a T next to the fence inside the garden. walk along the road & see end fence/garden & follow.
I would say neighbour is trying it on
The deeds usually state that tenant is responsible for their fence

Cherrybakewellard · 12/06/2020 12:34

On the deeds they will be two // on the boundary lines which indicate if it's your fence. Happy to take a look if you would like advice.

cosmo30 · 12/06/2020 12:36

I had to pay for the conveyance deeds from the land registry to show the fence ownership. It was about £7. The title deeds didn't show anything

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