New neighbours

[Plannergirl9]

Sorry this is a long one. TLDR: Essentially we were gifted land from ex-neighbour when they died. New neighbours who bought her house has told us we must sell it to them.

A bit more backstorey. Our elderly neighbour lived next to us until they died in late December. She had a side bit of garden like an allotment that we used to help her with (hatched area on diagram). Unbeknownst to us she gifted us that area of land in her will. The rest of the house and land was to be sold and the money given to charity.

After the will reading we have had the land registry changed to confirm we now own the land. The house was put up for sale late January. In mid February we received a letter from a solicitor asking that we sell the land to the potential buyer of the house. We emailed back saying no we won't sell. We then heard nothing more from any solicitors. House was then sold during lockdown.

The new neighbours moved in on Monday. Yesterday they came to our door asking for the name of our solicitor so the land purchase can take place. We told them we were not planning on selling the land and that we told their solicitor that. The new neighbours didn't take it well. Apparently they only bought the house on the provision that they could buy the land and this was agreed with us via their solicitors.

The new neighbours got quite loud and angry about us apparently misleading them and left to speak to their solicitor. They seem to think we legally need to sell them the land as there was a written (email) contract between them and their solicitor who confirmed to them by email prior to the sale of the house that we would sell the land.

Aibu to a) not sell the land even though we technically didn't buy it and b) that the fact their solicitor has mislead them is not our problem?

Neighbours land is in red.
Our land is in black and the hatched area is the land they expect to buy.

Please ring her dad, just to give us some entertainment in another groundhog lockdown day.

@prettybird

Which bit of "Probate does not have to been granted for the house to be sold" do some people not understand?

Indeed, probate (or rather, "confirmation" in Scotland) can't be granted until the house's value has been confirmed - and in many cases the easiest way to do that involves selling the house (assuming, in this case, that the charity didn't want it ).

In Scotland there is the added complication that offspring have a legal right to one half of the "moveable" estate (ie everything except land and property), split equally amongst the siblings (or the descendants of those siblings). The rest (the fixed estate land and property and the other half of the moveable estate can be distributed according to the deceased's wishes. (Proportions are different if there is a surviving spouse).

I'm a solicitor and I understand none of it, because it's bullshit.

After a landowner has died no one will be able to sell the property without probate being granted. It is literally the legal document that gives the executor the right to sell it.

I wouldn’t be able to stop myself calling the dad just to see what on earth was going on

Google the Dad’s mobile number and name, just to see if it throws up any Building work. I bet he’s the builder.

I'm sure the NDN will be along regardless of whether OP phones. The right thing to advise OP to do is shut her blinds and ignore. However...

Just to add, my parents viewed an empty house in Scotland just before the festive period a few years ago and moved in just under a month later. So it is very possible for house sales to move pretty fast in Scotland. I, on the other hand, am 6 months in to trying to buy an empty house and there is no movement at all.

Still shocked at neighbours day after read post

Really dense of them to try it on...I don't believe for one minute they are victims in this.

@Bluegrasstrail ive never understood why it is so difficult and lengthy to purchase a house in the UK.

[quote OrangeCinnamon]@Bluegrasstrail ive never understood why it is so difficult and lengthy to purchase a house in the UK.[/quote]
I have bought and or sold three properties in England none of them took longer than three months, probably because the longest chain involved was 4 properties.

Orange - it's not in Scotland

Dad is probably a builder, and wants to explain to you how they need that land to build some houses they have already sold.

Or they are planning to live in one house with daddy next door....

I'm starting to wonder if the old lady who gave you the land had her head screwed on and was trying to protect you from extra housing being built by gifting you the land. She may well have been approached previously about selling part of her plot.

If they are early 20's and have mentioned Dad, every reason to to suspect this was going to be a development opportunity with the young couple getting a property from it.

The anger at your door is preposterous.

I would put up a camera and be very suspicious of them.

They have tried to swindle you and are clearly seriously dishonest people.

I appreciate it is amusing for some people to read but I would never dismiss someone who is capable of trying on something so dishonest.

They are not decent people.

Treat them as such and protect yourself.

How much is the land worth Op???

Even if Dad is a builder it would be extraordinarily short sighted to 'prospectively' build houses on land that doesn't go with the house and has no planning permission on it. ANYTHING could happen, from planning consent not being given to, well, the neighbours refusing to sell the land.

They should have thrashed all this out before buying the house! (Unless Daddy has council officials in his pocket and absolutely knows for certain that he could shove planning through and put up a whole estate of very tiny cardboard houses that he'd sell for millions).

Hold firm, OP. Hopefully it will all die down. Even more hopefully, the cheeky chancy fuckers will sell the house again and move on (and they needn't think they're coming here - my garden is MINE!)

C.f. indeed

How about this.
If Daddy contacts you.
Oh hello Daddy,
I have been thinking about the land issue.
I have emails and would be willing to swear in court at no point have I ever agreed to sell my land at any price .
What do you need me to do so you can sue the solicitor for telling you all a pack of lies.

I agree with Billy1966 there.
Proceed with caution. This will go either of two ways:

1. They will discuss with their solicitor, realise they have been misled or have misunderstood the situation regarding your land and don’t have a leg to stand on. They will go away. It’s all good.

1. They’re at it, the dad is involved, they want that land and they’re prepared to deceive and intimidate in order to get it. They might try to make your life difficult.

Absolutely do not engage with them on this any more.

I'm sorry but I don't see how the idea that they're planning on developing the plot stacks up. If they were really doing this on the basis of making money, they would have had the purchase of the land tied up with the house, including a price (development only works if your revenues exceed your costs, and if they don't know the cost of the land how would they know what they could expect to make??) Plus they would have planning permission put in place first. I know I would, if I was buying a plot of land with the express intention of developing it.

It seems far more likely to me that they want the plot to keep as an allotment as it currently is (perhaps they want chickens as well or something).

Just caught up and I thought that email either had typos by the OP or was just a complete joke by the OP and the whole thread was fake. I had no idea those phrases were actually used in the legal community

God they sound horrendous. Good luck op!

I would just send them a letter politely reminding them that you have never said you will sell, and that their issue with their solicitor isn’t any of your business and no you will not be calling their dad because as you’ve stated, you’re not selling and none of this is anything to do with you.

I agree with others re: security cameras to cover the patch of your land they feel entitled to.

If they're having you on, rather than being the victims of a dodgy solicitor, then I wouldn't put it past them to try and 'claim' the land. They probably won't, but if I were in your position I would feel more comfortable in the knowledge that there were cameras to record anything untoward, should it occur.

@sallylovescheese they aren't phrases used in the legal community! I'm a partner in a law firm and have never used them and indeed never even heard of half of them! They certainly aren't taught in law school! Latin is used only when there's a particular legal concept that is difficult to describe in English.
As no lawyer would ever, ever use the nonsense cod Latin in that email we 'deductio' that the writer is a fucking fraud or a lunatic.

O lord help you, you'll have to live with these cfs for years to come. Let the solicitors argue about it, that's what they're for. Don't enter into any personal discussions with them, road to nowhere but irritation.