To suggest we storm the parks (armed with hand gel and cleaning wipes)

[TotorosFurryBehind]

Maybe light-hearted, maybe not. In the past week I'm increasing frustrated that children and their well-being are being left behind, as golf courses, garden centres etc open. But no timeline in sight for playparks, zoos etc.

I walk past the park most days on our walk and am increasingly tempted to snip the plastic ties holding the gate shut and take my daughter to play on the swings. I think the only thing stopping me is that is socially taboo and that someone will call the police.

I'm such a law abiding person normally. But I think the anxiety and depression of lockdown is really getting to me. I don't understand the logic of the way things are reopening.

Does anyone else feel like this?

It must be said, it doesn't look as though touch is a big transmitter, especially outside - I don't see evidence of our local shop workers all being off sick, I have not washed anything coming into my house from the outside this whole time, and no sign of anyone falling ill in our household. Research in Korea found that people didn't appear to get ill from touching the lift button when a worker on a high floor was infectious.

If kids wash/sanitise their hands just before going in and again when they come out it seems like it would be fairly safe, but obviously I am not a scientist!

WeAllHaveWings

THANKYOU!

The hardest part is definitely trying to follow the rules when everyone around isn't.

Last week DS1 was scooting in the park because it's a nice smooth surface in comparison to all the over grown trees in the way on the roads near us and was saying he was sad about not being able to use the playground when other people had. lol and behold, I looked over and there was a grown man using the monkey bars as exercise equipment.

How are we meant to explain that children can't use the playground when adults are?? We've seen a few people just lift their kids over the fencing around the playground and wander off leaving their kids playing, they obviously needed some peace and I don't necessarily blame them for it but it's so hard explaining to my four year old that I won't let them use the playground when others are.

It makes me sad that DS2 has never been in a swing, it sounds so silly but by this point on mat leave with DS1 we were in the park every day playing on the swings and being held down slides.

The council have taken away the basketball rings in our local park. Because the odd kid or two shooting hoops (I have never in 12 years seen it used for an actual game) is clearly a massive risk compared to opening a garden centre up. Or more likely, the outbreak has been the perfect excuse for municipal childhaters to make hay. See also: maternity services and misogynists in hospital administration who think consideration of the wellbeing of women giving birth is an unwarranted luxury.

Agreed @Nihiloxica
The risk was always low
This isn't an especially dangerous virus.
Children are almost entirely unaffected.
They don't seem to spread it effectively.
It does not appear to be possible to pick up enough virus from surfaces to get infected.
We didn't know all of this in March, but we have known it for weeks.

@Porcupineinwaiting
Talk about picking and choosing research. You must have searched hard to find that when most is definitely not and there is plenty to see that suggests lockdown was a waste of time and infection had already peaked (in what is now believed by many to have been the second wave).

I agree! Trust parents to look after their kids. Take hand gel. If it’s too busy go another day. Council can put up signs saying 2 metres apart, Max 3 kids or whatever.

I assume part of the issue is children touching surfaces and then putting hand to face before being able to wash their hands.

@Nihiloxica Totally agree.

@Nihiloxica

In one American state where they lifted lockdown exactly two weeks later they had an increase in cases and their health system is under strain again so it’s a bit presumptuous to think you have all the answers . I would think play equipment where the virus can stay active for longer would be high risk , not for the children so much but for bringing it home so the hygiene aspect would have to be scrupulous.

I think zoos and animal parks if you can maintain social distancing would be less risky , I expect it tackling the toilet facilities that would be more problematic.

deaths and cases are down BECAUSE of the limitations that have been imposed during lockdown.

I don't believe that.

The decline in deaths began earlier than could have been expected if it was caused by lockdown.

We have achieved what lockdown was meant to do (although I don't think it was necessary) and created additional NHS capacity and learnt more about the virus.

So now our society must restart before more needless harm us done and that includes giving children back their play parks.

We don't need to sterilise the equipment though. Just wash or hand gel our hands afterwards.

We can reduce the risk of human to human contact by distancing.
We can reduce the risk of droplet spread by distancing.
We can reduce the risk of infection from contaminated objects by a) cleaning the objects or b) washing our hands and not touching our eyes/mouth/nose until we have washed them and c) not eating our dinner off a contaminated surface.

It would be a challenge with small children, but most parents of young children, would be willing to helicopter over their children with wipes and handgel if it meant they could use swings again.

For Scotland I hope that play parks will be open once we move to Phase 2 on 18th June. It does seem bizarre that we can browse our way through a garden centre ( I've been stocking up on half price Hotel Chocolat easter eggs) but DCs are not allowed on play equipment.

I've just started to allow my teen to play football with his mates. Against the rules but weighing up the tiny risk based on current numbers, the fact that we think we had it in March and DS now getting chubby and pale, then logically it's the right thing to do.

Was it Italy or Spain that the DCs struggled to walk after being in lockdown for so long ? I know it's never been as hard a lockdown here, but play parks don't exist solely to give parents a break, they're also great for exercise and developing coordination.

What they need is mobile hand washing stations in parks.

The poor kids have been so good, they deserve their parks back at least.

Right behind you OP. Children don't spend money in parks though do they? What bizarre logic to suggest parents might get too close together in an outside park. I've previoulsy taken my childen to plenty of parks that are empty. & are parents likely to get closer together in an outdoor park than somewhere like Aldi?? Use some common sense please, sanitize hands on entry; santiize hands on exit and get them open. As for what's wrong with opening businesses that pay tax, the point is that if that are saying that taxation considerations trump health and safety concerns you cannot then demand that childrens parks remain shut for the same health and safety reasons you are happy to ignore for monetary reasons, otherwise that would make you a hypocrite.

@MrsRogerLima

That also could be something to do with

If you don’t get tax and national insurance starting up again there will be nothing to pay for the NHS

Also you are not likely to hug or kiss or share utensils or anything else with your local car salesman

If the sales of cars drop you will have huge job losses in all the peripheral jobs that go with this industry and many others .

OF COURSE there has to be a correlation between economics and saving lives . That was made clear from the start.

No jobs , no roof over your head .
No allowing the NHS to cope then more likely you will die from covid or other services that have suffered .

It’s a juggling balancing act that is being played out in Many countries at the moment . I think we are extremely lucky to have the furlough system and extremely lucky to have the part time furlough that is being offered . The banks ( about time) in my experience are also being helpful .

To be honest personally I am sick to death of this “ we know now we did not need to lock down”: well yes in restrospect we all can suddenly become experts it’s so simple in hindsight isn’t it ?

We are one of the most densely and highly populated countries in Europe and the situation could have been a lot worse .

And I will say again in my humble opinion the government’s main error was overestimating the intelligence of a small portion of the population who either have no common sense or just think they know better .

[quote Porcupineinwaiting]@AnnPerkins the really frustrating thing is if we all collectively worked to lower viral transmission for a few more weeks so much more stuff could safely reopen for the summer.[/quote]
I hope you're right. That's why I'm sticking to the guidelines.

I'm so with you, OP. We have been well and truly screwed and brainwashed by Project Fear. We can't keep succumbing to this extremely expensive state cotton wool until a vaccine is found, which may be never. Sooner or later, we will have to take the risk, and get on with living, instead of merely existing in fear.

I am really angry for the children and teenagers: they have been forced to make the biggest sacrifices in all this, and not just playgrounds: their right to an education, seeing their friends, while they are the ones least affected by the virus. It really is not fair on them for this still to be going on.

I'm sure HM government is waiting for us to break the rules as much as we can; they're keeping the playgrounds taped up as a token gesture so they can say later "well, we tried to stop you". They're waiting for the public to abandon social distancing before they officially say it's no longer needed. This top-down approach of micromanaging everybody's lives is no longer sensible: the

And even though Mumsnet doesn't seem to agree, and taking the view "you're a murderer if you think lockdown is harmful": national lockdown still being in place is killing people: it's making people anxious, depressed, lonely, suicidal, poor, fat through lack of exercise (the allowed "exercise" is no substitute for those who normally play sport), and this will leave a huge legacy in a year's time. The time for lockdown being for the greater good is long gone.

Totally! My kids are past park age but it's the saddest thing ever seeing kids in a park looking longingly at the taped off swings. If everyone cleans hands before/after the risk must surely be minimal?

I'm all for opening them. The parish council here was discussing having one entrance and one exit and installing handwashing facilities at both to minimise risk and let kids play.

My teenager and her mates liberate the basketball court on a regular basis. This lockdown is all about throwing young people under a bus and they're fucked off with it, quite rightly.

Why can a child sit in a bench outside a park made of the same material as the swing inside the park?. Another child could sit next to them on the bench and they wouldn't be social distancing and an adult would have to stop them, the same adult who would be there inside the park. The risk is exactly the same. There is no benefit physically of mentally for them to sit on the bench tho

Leisure stuff that old people like to do is available: golf, garden centres, car show rooms. Funny that

Not really as they will help kick start the economy in a low risk manner. Everyone is going on about how lockdown was an economic disaster for us and our kids and we gave fucked up kids economic futures but still bitch about lucky old people getting back to normal. As if.

How about we storm the parks this weekend and then all turn up and leave our DC at school on Monday. I’m not joking. The current set up has been thought through only by men who are mostly locking themselves in rooms all day leaving women to homeschool while holding down jobs. We went into lockdown mostly to protect old and vulnerable people, many of whom have life limiting conditions anyway. Our children’s future is now saddled with debt (I suggested to my mum that her tax contribution should be increased and she was horrified), to save a bunch of people who mostly wont be around by the time primary school age kids are university age. And weVe taken away their education as well. If we thought the current generation of young adults were disillusioned, they were just the appetizer for what’s to come.

@Khione the thing is, you can just look at countries where there is no lockdown or only a very short one to see what happens. Take a peek at Brazil. Or Mexico. Does that look good to you?

I'd remind you that we have a right- wing government. These people are not the touchy feely kind who care deeply about the sick and vulnerable. The very fact they were prepared to lock down should tell you that the virus unchecked was serious.

470k dead so your kid can play on the swings ffs!

Just be aware that if your area is anything like mine the play equipment will not currently be being safety checked, and the area will not be currently be being cleaned.