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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

School not re opening

313 replies

Onone · 27/05/2020 15:06

Just that really,just had an email from my daughter’s school to say that they won’t be opening on 1st June, don’t know when it will either,Thanks to the mayor of our town,I’m quite upset for my daughter,Hardly any cases in my town

OP posts:
theluckiest · 27/05/2020 19:44

Believe me, the schools are attempting to use the DfE 'guidance' to open schools further.

Trouble is, the guidance changes every 5 mins (41 different changes so far) and was a pile of tosh to start with.

So, at my school, we have tried to squeeze in Reception, Y1 and Y6. The other issue we have is that our classrooms are tiny and can only safely accommodate 8 children going by the 'guidance.' We have roughly half the children coming back in each year group plus the keyworker children.

Because of this, every room in the school (including a library with roped-off books) is now in use and every staff member including the Head is allocated to a bubble.

We only have 2 staff members shielding who will have to do all the online provision and safeguarding phone calls.

There is absolutely no wriggle room. I have no idea whatsoever how we're going to accommodate any other years - and if Boris wants them to have a month before Summer, they need to be back in the week beg 22nd June. That ain't happening.

If you think that sounds shit, wait until staff start getting sick. Sad

NeverTwerkNaked · 27/05/2020 19:48

I am sure I would have a marvellous time if I only had to work every other week like you @MrsTtobe Smile

If you wanted to chip away at sympathy for teachers you are certainly making a success of it.

IncrediblySadToo · 27/05/2020 19:55

@GabsAlot

Quoting is only for us special people

Just tap on the three dots if you're on mobile. On the blue line if on larger devices.

REMEMBER. apropos is nothing in particular... 🤪. Remember anyone can SAY they're a teacher...doesn't make it true AND lots of people troll websites trying to cause trouble...

happyandsingle · 27/05/2020 19:56

I think it's to soon for schools to open full stop.

walker1891 · 27/05/2020 19:56

Each school needs 2 staff per bubble.
Each bubble has 15 children max.
6 bubbles + key worker children = 7 bubbles.
7 bubbles = 14 members of staff minimum.

My school = 3 classrooms
9 members of staff including 2 vulnerable.
Classrooms fit 3 or 4 children in.
35 children needed.
10 classrooms needed = 20 staff needed.

We need an army of volunteers just like the NHS had to be that 2nd person in each bubble. We need extra space - church hall, gyms etc rented out to provide spaces.
We need real investment of time, money and people to make it work, it can work if people all come together to make it work.

IkaBaar · 27/05/2020 20:00

Why aren’t teachers who are in the vulnerable group going back? Surely individual risk assessments would be an, answer not a blanket no. Vulnerable NHS staff have been working throughout, just not on COVID wards. Same if your spouse is shielded you are expected to work, just distance at home or take up the offer of free accommodation elsewhere.

Technically I’m vulnerable as are both my dc, but I still have to go to work, as I work for the NHS.

VerbenaGirl · 27/05/2020 20:06

Schools are really struggling to find a way of doing this - firstly those staff who need to shield (or possibly has a child that does) can’t go in, then the social distancing spacing required means that, depending on the school’s classroom sizes, only a percentage of students can be accommodated at any time. Leaders desperately want to keep their staff and pupils safe, as well as support parents. I would say the number of shielders from the staff at our school is proportionally much the same as the wider group we know. Staffing in schools can be pretty tight, so it doesn’t take much to start making it untenable.

IndecentFeminist · 27/05/2020 20:07

Our school is opening for R on the 8th. 12 per bubble, keyworker kids separate.
Following week Yr 1 will join them on the Monday, and yr 6 on the Wed.

No school on Fridays for anyone bar keyworker kids. No wraparound care.

StaffAssociationRepresentative · 27/05/2020 20:09

As I said we have government guidance, dfe guidance, health guidance, council guidance and union guidance. In fact there is so much guidance that it conflicts. The problem is that there is no money for the solutions.

Schools have been open and plenty of teachers have done a sterling job on teams and google classroom. We have followed school policy. Education provision has been run on a shoestring budget for years and now the underfunding has exposed that there is no excess capacity.

We are in a situation with some kids potentially in and some kids still at home so we will still have to do the online provision.

The economy can start to get going again. Not all workers need childcare provision or schools in order to return. Yes it will be desperate for those who lose their jobs and potentially we slip back to the 80s when 1 in 10 were unemployed.

Schools are doing their best. They want children back in. Teachers want to be physically back in front of children. They have been trying to plan against guidance which conflicts and changes with each briefing.

Sniping at each other and goading one another does not help.

StaffAssociationRepresentative · 27/05/2020 20:14

We need an army of volunteers just like the NHS had to be that 2nd person in each bubble.

We need people who have a proper up-to-date DBS check. This is not something to be rushed as that is when safeguarding problems can arise. It will only take one thing to go wrong and all hell will break lose. Not everyone passes DBS

Lancrelady80 · 27/05/2020 20:16

In defence of MrsTtobe...

Teachers working from home (like anyone working from home who does not do so usually) have suddenly regained all their commute time. So easily one hour extra each day, maybe a bit more or less depending on distance to workplace. Plus all the usual before and after school work, photocopying, laminating, putting up displays, hunting out and preparing physical resources etc is also no longer necessary or even able to be done. There's another hour minimum each day, right then. I regularly arrive at school at quarter to 8 and stay at school until 6pm...that's another 3 3/4 hours each day. What online marking can be done, I do in the evenings after my children are asleep. So I have gained very nearly 5 hours extra each day by working flexibly and whilst doing no less than before as far as actual planning and teaching goes (remote teaching, obv). Even with the additional online courses our head has asked us to do (approx 1 1/2 hours each day but can be done in evenings instead) that still leaves time to take a decent walk and do a bit of painting or baking with the children. And we are allowed to enjoy that!

I do however agree that her post does not come across well and was bound to whip up anger against teachers because once again it's the old "they finish at 3:15" thing. Non-school based parents do not realise how much time is spent by teachers outside of physically being in front of the children- a lot of stuff we usually do before and after school cannot be done or does not need doing at the moment, so we have regained that time.

Perhaps parents now working from home could try to see how much time they've gained by losing the commute? That could help them prioritize children (whether helping with home educating or just enjoying time together) for that amount of time each day relatively guilt-free?

GabsAlot · 27/05/2020 20:19

[quote IncrediblySadToo]@GabsAlot

Quoting is only for us special people

Just tap on the three dots if you're on mobile. On the blue line if on larger devices.

REMEMBER. apropos is nothing in particular... 🤪. Remember anyone can SAY they're a teacher...doesn't make it true AND lots of people troll websites trying to cause trouble...[/quote]
how odd just popped up cheers

Starlightstarbright1 · 27/05/2020 20:23

Just to add my Ds’s secondary school announces it was closing earlier than government due to staff shortages.

I have no idea The issues behind that but they weren’t coping.

Tonight on the news it mentioned that the government were asking the scientists about removing the 2m rules - I suspect that is how they plan to get everyone back in school.

CandyflossKing · 27/05/2020 20:26

My DC's school are making a big show and dance (after considerably lengthy letters stating nothing at all!) of the fact that they are opening to Key Worker's children and vulnerable children. They are already doing this! Hope they didn't waste too much time, effort and money deciding to do absolutely nothing new! The way they word it though is as if this is some new momentous achievement!

spanieleyes · 27/05/2020 20:32

The number of keyworker and vulnerable children who have asked to come in has shot up, we have gone from 2-10 on an average day to nearly 40. It makes taking in other year groups almost impossible.

oblada · 27/05/2020 20:37

Only shielding teachers should really stay at home.
There are a lot of vaguely vulnerable categories but that doesn't make the individuals unable to work in a front facing role (pregnancy, asthma, diabetes etc) it's just about putting measures/risk assessments in place.

My school is going to re-open. At least that's the plan. But my nursery isn't and they're not even open for key workers. Which annoys me as we are struggling and my DH is a keyworker although we have managed to muddle through without childcare up to now.. not much I can do though. I'll send my middle child back to school (yr1) but I'll still have 2 children at home...

user1000000000000000001 · 27/05/2020 20:39

@CandyflossKing you may find they have allowed more in under those categories. Originally DDs school had to prioritise key worker/vulnerable kids and begged for families to manage with them at home if possible. Now all eligible under both are being asked to attend. Gone from 40 to 160 and rules out any others returning

WombatChocolate · 27/05/2020 20:40

The lack of what we consider normal hours in school isn't because of Mrs TTobe but because of a pandemic which requires social distancing and means it's just not possible to give normal schooling to the vast numbers of children. It is as simple as that.

People hear schools are returning and picture some kind of normal. But it can't be. Government doesn't tell parents that but let's schools work out the practicalities and leaves it to schools to disappoint families and look like they as an individual school are someone slacking or not trying hard enough.

Lots of people have described how many rooms and adults they have on staff and how many they need to accommodate just 1 or 2 year groups whilst being socially distanced. But people want to probe whether lots of teachers are staying off and saying they are vulnerable, suggesting they ar skippering the plan to return by being delicate and overly cautious.

There just aren't enough rooms and adults. If all the teachers were in, in many schools there wouldn't be. Add in some absences (and they will be more once the track and trace starts tomorrow as people are forced to isolate for 14 days just becaue they have had some time in the staffroomm with someone who then turned out to have Covid) and you can actually manage a tiny number of children.

On some threads, school are accused of being kamikaze and risking children's lives and here there's not enough returning.

It isn't normal school. It won't be normal school for those who do go in. It won't be normal school in Septmeber. The pandemic means it can't happen however much people want it. Government cannot say this clearly and loudly without morale going through the floor, but when you think sensibly about it , you can see that even those limited year groups can't be accommodated in lots of the school buildings by the no of teachers those schools have......plus all the kids innthebyears at home also be taught too!

I just think some people are desperate for their kids to go back - I get it - and have had this 1 June as some kind of lifeline that was thrown out a couple of weeks ago, without any sense of what it couldn't be, and ar now disappointed for themselves and their kids.

Kids education is being impacted. Theres no getting away from it. It will be further through this term and next term too. And parents want more but don't seem to realise that school cannot be fully replicated at home, even by very good teachers with all the resources. It just isn't the same. We have to accept it. We have to accept it and I think we have to take more responsibility on ourselves as parents even if it's hard. With little ones we need to spend more time on reading and numbers and writing even when they don't want to. With older ones we need to get them into working habbits even if they want to lie in bed.

After this is over eventually, we will be able to point the finger at government or at schools or at MrsTtobe (because people love to target someone as an example of the bad teachers they just know are in their school, because it can't be possible to have a good time with your own kids AND deliver a good education to other children too) or other teachers and blame them for our kids being behind. But the government has never said schools can replicate school - they haven't pretended that is possible. Pointing the finger won't help our children who could be months behind, but taking more responsibility if what's provided doesn't feel good enough can. It's hard when working and when not being a teacher and when the kids miss friend so and when they aren't motivated, but the blame game doesn't really help progress happen. Waiting for schools to sort out something they can't really sort out as we'd like won't deliver satisfaction, but our own actions can help take back a little bit of control in this scenario which is just so so different to normal, that every normal needs forgetting and new plans need making. And we as parents care most about our children and so have to deliver more of it, even if we think it's usually the schools job.

Things are more different than we think amd still further from normal than we think and adapting our mindset to that I think is pretty important because otherwise there will be a long string of these disappointments as the months pass and schools are not delivering what we consider normal service.

lockdownstress · 27/05/2020 20:43

ahem. Asthmatic GP here. Working the whole way through. It is absolutely not the case that teachers with asthma or who are pregnant can't work. Everyone who isn't shielding is meant to be going back to work if they have a job to go to.

MargeryB · 27/05/2020 20:47

@MrsTtobe never has a post made me so cross before, how flipping insensitive can you get. @Lancrelady80 doesn't make it much better. Can you really not imagine how overloaded some other people are with essential work? Saving a commute does not compensate 😠😠😠 Let alone those worried about losing their job, home, loved ones. The pair of you need to cop on or refrain from posting.

whenwillthemadnessend · 27/05/2020 20:47

Agree. I'm fuming. We have zero cases last two days in my entire county

walker1891 · 27/05/2020 20:51

IkaBaar - we are, I am vulnerable and have a risk assessment, it just says stay 2m away and wash my hands. Not worth the paper its written on.

I think we should open schools 7 days a week and then we would have more time to spread groups out. I'd be happy to work Sat and Sun for 2 days off midweek so long as they were 2 days off and I didn't have emails and calls from those in school. While I know this wouldn't suit everyone and there are other logistics like meals etc during weekends but with planning it could work for some schools.

WombatChocolate · 27/05/2020 21:01

But it's not a race to see who has the most miserable life is it? Teachers can be doing a very good job and also having a nice time whilst not in s chocolate too.

My DH is a teacher. He worked through Easter learning Teams and various other IT and adapting resources to be suitable for remote learning. He didn't work all day every day over Easter but I would say he averaged 5 hours each day of his holiday....after spending the 4 weeks before working 12 hour days in the lead up to lockdown and the start of remote learning. And then since Easter he has worked 8.30-5 solidly on school stuff. He has done a live lesson each day and has set work and marked work and returned it, phoned parents and students, been in zoom meetings with colleagues every day, has planned further resources and written some assessments, worked on plans for the return....and re-worked them in light of gov advice and re-worked them again....and again - probably 10 hours or more in terms of meetings and planning each time. And yet, we also had an hour for lunch each day and went for a walk. In the evenings we have had barbeques and recently he's been on bike rides with our teenagers in the evening in a way he wouldn't normally. He has found pleasure in being at home and not commuting and hasn't had to go to meetings in the evenings which usually take 2 evening s per week. So he has worked bloody hard, doing stuff most teachers are actually doing each day. Some parents might say their child saw him for an hour on a live thing and therefore he must have been swanning around all day, but he's been working full days (and is still doing 4 hours each day this week - which is half term immediately before the return to school) but we are having a great week and doing some 1-2-1 meet ups with friends and enjoying a lie in until 9 each morning. We don't have small children now and that makes everything easier. But it is possible for teachers to work really hard, not be seen constantly and still get pleasure from being at home at the moment. Because some people are furloughed or sick or worried, doesn't mean we can't also acknowledge that some people have found pleasure in this different time - even teachers. It's not a race to the misery bottom and 24 hours in the day have given lots of workers plenty of time to work hard and find pleasure with their families too, without it meaning they are skiving their jobs,

Piggywaspushed · 27/05/2020 21:06

lockdownstress that is not true and not what is says in DfE guidance.

It says you can be considered for WFH and , if this is not possible, be offered a role that affords less contact with others.

Piggywaspushed · 27/05/2020 21:09

FYI

Clinically vulnerable individuals who are at higher risk of severe illness (for example, people with some pre-existing conditions as set out in the Staying at home and away from others (social distancing) guidance have been advised to take extra care in observing social distancing and should work from home where possible. Education and childcare settings should endeavour to support this, for example by asking staff to support remote education, carry out lesson planning or other roles which can be done from home. If clinically vulnerable (but not clinically extremely vulnerable) individuals cannot work from home, they should be offered the safest available on-site roles, staying 2 metres away from others wherever possible, although the individual may choose to take on a role that does not allow for this distance if they prefer to do so. If they have to spend time within 2 metres of other people, settings must carefully assess and discuss with them whether this involves an acceptable level of risk.

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