To be wondering why we're not hearing more from Labour on this?

[theduchessstill]

I have been so impressed with Keir Starmer since he took over but I'm bemused as to why we're not hearing more from him on Cummings situation.

Views I've seen are that he's giving the Tories the space to hang themselves, which I hope is true; that he's a red Tory, which is obviously bollocks, or that he's rubbish, which I hope isn't true and is against my instinct. What do people here think?

Yanbu - he's got a plan
Yabu - he's wasting this opportunity

You don't seem to like answering questions much clavinova. I don't drink coffee, but if you like you can make me a tea while you're finding the part of the rules that you think cover travel to a vulnerable person when there's someone living nearer who could do it.

Keir Starmer
@Keir_Starmer
Boris Johnson's unwillingness or inability to do the right thing has left the Government looking untrustworthy and unprincipled.

Worst of all he's undermined the public health advice that keeps us all safe, just to keep one aide in his job.

Our nation’s health must come first.

BlackberryCane
You don't seem to like answering questions much clavinova.

There isn't a rule called 'non-essential travel'

I answered that yesterday -
"The government has today (26 March 2020) made new public health regulations strengthening police enforcement powers in England, to reduce the spread of coronavirus, protect the NHS and save lives."

"To ensure people stay at home and avoid non-essential travel, from today, if members of the public do not comply the police may:" ...

www.gov.uk/government/news/police-given-new-powers-and-support-to-respond-to-coronavirus

Not under the lockdown legislation they're not, only if they have an underlying health condition. Honestly, have you even read the regulations? You've made basic errors over multiple posts now.

Again, this is not the legislation.

Both answered yesterday -

The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020

(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), a reasonable excuse includes the need—
...
(d)to provide care or assistance, including relevant personal care within the meaning of paragraph 7(3B) of Schedule 4 to the Safeguarding of Vulnerable Groups Act 2006(1), to a vulnerable person, or to provide emergency assistance;

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/350/regulation/6/made

What do young children have to do with the legality of Stephen Kinnock's actions clavinova?

Answered today -

"a vulnerable person" needing "care or assistance" equally refers to a young child or an older person needing care or assistance.

while you're finding the part of the rules that you think cover travel to a vulnerable person when there's someone living nearer who could do it.

"You’re not going to tell me that Neil Kinnock had no alternative way of getting essential supplies other than his son who lived hundreds of miles away." -

was in fact posted by someone else although your reply up thread suggests that you thought it was me.

My comment, "particularly if she [his sister] lived closer to their parents than he did" relates to the particular day in question, not any other day. I am not inclined to believe Stephen Kinnock's story (he drove 300 miles there and back with essential supplies on his father's birthday) as his sister also visited their father on the same day with a birthday cake and a curry - therefore Stephen Kinnock may not have had a "reasonable excuse" to "leave the place" he was "living" on that particular day. I doubt that the police believed his story either but they did not take the trouble to investigate - they posted a reminder on twitter instead. Perhaps a member of the public might lodge a complaint now.

Well, you typed some words. It would be over-generous to suggest they amounted to an answer. Are you suggesting Kinnock travelled to assist young children?

And no, I'm referring to your post yesterday at 14.33, not the one where another poster appeared to be labouring (no pun intended) under the same misapprehension as you were about Kinnock's sister, ie that her having gone there the same day has anything to do with whether his actions were legal.

I'm referring to your post yesterday at 14.33

I have already explained my comment at 14.33 - have a nice day.

Because when people like Jonathan Ashworth the Shadow Health Secy come on TV railing about Cummings they sound vindictive and petty. Just at the time when Test and Trace is being launched. So Keir Starmer is avoiding that. Ranting isn't a good look at the moment. I'm in despair today at the quality of politicians we have on all sides. Come back David Cameron, Theresa May, Gordon Brown and Tony Blair. All is forgiven

He’s playing like an ace! The approval rating for Boris has dropped, it won’t recover unless he does something about Cummings.

Since he won’t, he’s given Keir Starmer a terrific stick to hit him with whenever he likes. It’s perfect. It’s not like Keir Starmer can force an election. But he can make Boris Johnson look impotent and evasive.

Boris’s best defence is move on and forget. Dire. Will have to do better than that. Otherwise all you have to do is remind people; they won’t forget. People are properly angry.

Erm he has said a lot of you search for it. I guess it’s the reporting.

Just at the time when Test and Trace is being launched

We seem to have had a lot of big announcements this week.

Haven't we....

He certainly looks incompetent and evasive, but the crisis here is that he’s not impotent because -

he’s still PM

he still has his advisor and his minions and nothing is changing.

he’s prepared for whatever his rebel MPs, the opposition parties and KS throw at him in Parliament.

He will evade the issue if public outrage by repeating, “I have said all I have to say. Reasonable people will have to form their own opinions on the matter. We need to move on ..,, blah blah yadda yadda er er er bollocks...,”

We need more than a stick to beat him with. We need DS out now and preferably the lot of them. But it won’t happen.,

And before I’m accused of being a “leftie loon,” believe me, I am most certainly not.

To the poster who keeps rambling in about Kinnock - well, start a thread about him then? Start a campaign if you like? Two wrongs don’t make a right.

We seem to have had a lot of big announcements this week. Haven't we.... I really don't know what you mean. I'm in Scotland where Nicola has just spent a lot of time making a lot of big announcements including the Scottish Test and Track system. She's speaking right now.
God all of this is bloody exhausting.

The PM has nearly a full term to go. Nobody will force him out now. Starmer just has to make him less and less credible over this period. There are very few decisive moments as an opposition. It is hard work. You have to grind down the perception of the PM as competent. That takes time. No one should expect at this stage in the election cycle that there will be a big change.

But if I were in the Labour Party I would be looking for ways to extend this narrative of some animals are more equal than others. It riles people and it is causing the PM’S popularity to drop.

It’s not an overnight thing. But it’s definitely something that they need to draw on and keep plugging away at.

He'd have to censure several Labour MPs including his predecessor which he's chosen not to do so is trying to avoid being called a hypocrite.

On Sky, Hancock was directly accused of having rushed out the T&T early this week to divert from the obvious. It was supposed to be introduced as an app in the first instance, but now they’re saying that won’t happen until mid to late June.

They only told the tracers for the T&T that it was going live today at 10pm last night Hmmmm...., wonder why?

news.stv.tv/politics/how-will-scotlands-coronavirus-test-and-trace-system-work? Starts today

Put this on another thread.

It's all about perception and optics

n further bleak news for the Prime Minister, the research suggests that former Labour voters in the 'Red Wall' in the North and Midlands have reacted particularly badly to the row.

At 72 per cent, working class 'C1/C2' voters are more likely to think the government is behaving as though 'it is one rule for them and another rule for everyone else', while 69 per cent are more likely to say Mr Cummings is not telling the truth than voters overall

@Clavinova

I'm referring to your post yesterday at 14.33

I have already explained my comment at 14.33 - have a nice day.

No you haven't. You typed some words, which is not the same thing.

That's very interesting chomalunga. I had noted that a number of those MPs had already called for Cummings to go or at least been outwardly critical, which given that they're new and probably feel they owe a good deal of their success to Johnson, is telling. It shows they've had lots of contact from constituents.