To be wondering why we're not hearing more from Labour on this?

[theduchessstill]

I have been so impressed with Keir Starmer since he took over but I'm bemused as to why we're not hearing more from him on Cummings situation.

Views I've seen are that he's giving the Tories the space to hang themselves, which I hope is true; that he's a red Tory, which is obviously bollocks, or that he's rubbish, which I hope isn't true and is against my instinct. What do people here think?

Yanbu - he's got a plan
Yabu - he's wasting this opportunity

Starmer has got the press doing it for him. The official opposition don't need to do anything. Why have a dog and bark yourself?

No you haven't. There isn't a rule called 'non-essential travel' and given that you've claimed some things that don't exist in the rules would need to be taken into account, it's not really safe for anyone to make assumptions about which rule you might think you're referring to.

Hilariously enough, functioning of that person's household isn't even defined in the rules either: there are more things you were allowed to leave the house to do for a vulnerable person other than bring basic necessities. It really was veeeeeeeery wide.

I think he's a dick!

You’re not going to tell me that Neil Kinnock had no alternative way of getting essential supplies other than his son who lived hundreds of miles away. I could have found him a willing volunteer in about 2 minutes on his local FB group.

I personally think an elected MP behaving like that is way worse than an advisor, although I would sack both of them if it were up to me.

Press Release -
Published 26 March 2020
From: Home Office and The Rt Hon Priti Patel MP

"The government has today (26 March 2020) made new public health regulations strengthening police enforcement powers in England, to reduce the spread of coronavirus, protect the NHS and save lives."

"To ensure people stay at home and avoid non-essential travel, from today, if members of the public do not comply the police may:"

*instruct them to go home, leave an area or disperse.
*ensure parents are taking necessary steps to stop their children breaking these rules.
*issue a fixed penalty notice of £60, which will be lowered to £30 if paid within 14 days...

www.gov.uk/government/news/police-given-new-powers-and-support-to-respond-to-coronavirus

there are more things you were allowed to leave the house to do for a vulnerable person other than bring basic necessities. It really was veeeeeeeery wide.

Yes, I know but Stephen Kinnock didn't mention anything else in his tweet. Small children are classed as vulnerable people as well.

KS doesn’t need to at the moment

His turn next week when there shall be even more anger on the Tory back benches

You’re not going to tell me that Neil Kinnock had no alternative way of getting essential supplies other than his son who lived hundreds of miles away.

Nope, I'm going to tell you it's irrelevant to the legality of his son having travelled from further away. There was absolutely nothing in the rules requiring a person leaving their home to assist a vulnerable person to be doing so in the absence of a closer alternative.

Yes, I know but Stephen Kinnock didn't mention anything else in his tweet. Small children are classed as vulnerable people as well.

Not under the lockdown legislation they're not, only if they have an underlying health condition. Honestly, have you even read the regulations? You've made basic errors over multiple posts now.

"At the government’s daily press conference on 24 March, England’s deputy chief medical officer Dr Jenny Harries spoke of the “exceptional circumstance” of an adult unable to care for a young child during the pandemic."

“A small child clearly is a vulnerable individual, so in this case, although we are encouraging everybody to stay in their own households–that’s the unit with the same risk of exposure–clearly if you have adults who are unable to look after a small child, that is an exceptional circumstance,” Dr Harries said."

www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/coronavirus-symptoms-parents-children-childcare-dominic-cummings-a9529481.html

Again, this is not the legislation. Citing something that's not the law doesn't refute the point that it's not the law. Also, were there any children present during the Stephen Kinnock visit?

Yes, but DC and his wife were able to care for their child - they were able to drive 260 miles and he says they had no help with childcare when they got there!

Whatever the guidance says, it doesn't say travel if you think you may become unable to look after a child at some point. An emergency would be, on finding both parents unable to cope, phoning for support - though it was community hubs you were supposed to call on, not family,

Again, this is not the legislation.

legislation.gov.uk

The Health Protection (Coronavirus, Restrictions) (England) Regulations 2020

Restrictions on movement
6.—(1) During the emergency period, no person may leave the place where they are living without reasonable excuse.

(2) For the purposes of paragraph (1), a reasonable excuse includes the need—
...
(d)to provide care or assistance, including relevant personal care within the meaning of paragraph 7(3B) of Schedule 4 to the Safeguarding of Vulnerable Groups Act 2006(1), to a vulnerable person, or to provide emergency assistance;

www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/350/regulation/6/made

Of course a young child (just turned 4 - born in 2016) is a "vulnerable person".

Whatever the guidance says, it doesn't say travel if you think you may become unable to look after a child at some point.

It doesn't specify not to either - the guidance does say, "plan ahead".

@clavinova

The Tories are eating themselves.

It's great to watch. Good luck though with your repeated attempts to defend all these actions.

Keir starmer has played it just right - without an inquiry it’s impossible to prove legally which is why boris has fronted it out. We are 5 years away from another election, unless the Tory majority takes BJ down nothing is going to happen.

Go on then @Clavinova

Quote the leglisation where it says you can drive on a 50 mile return trip for a 15 minute sit down by the river.

Starmer doesn't need to have a go. The BBC is doing it for him:
www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-52824508

Quote the legislation where it says you can drive on a 50 mile return trip for a 15 minute sit down by the river.

That would be difficult - although I have just found a recent study published in The Lancet on retinal changes after COVID-19 which might help;

www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)31014-X/fulltext

That would be difficult - although I have just found a recent study published in The Lancet on retinal changes after COVID-19 which might help

So you didn't find it in current leglisation.

Dominic Cummings is supposed to enjoy reading The Art of War

Unless there is some big plan, then this is not how it's supposed to work out.

It worked very well in the post Brexit issues with May's Government. Lose the battle but win the war.

But I honestly can' see the tactics now.

Because he understands the concept of people in glass houses shouldn’t throw stones and is in his knees every night praying to whichever god he has that the BBC don’t come to his village in their self appointed role as Wytchfynder general?

What do young children have to do with the legality of Stephen Kinnock's actions clavinova?

"a vulnerable person" needing "care or assistance" equally refers to a young child or an older person needing care or assistance.

As stated above, we don't know whether Stephen Kinnock was telling the truth about his visit or not - on balance I am not inclined to believe him - but I quite like him generally.

That hasn't explained why children are relevant to the legality of Stephen Kinnock's issues.

I have explained it very well - you are just being disingenuous.

Where did you explain it?

BlackberryCane

Perhaps a strong coffee might help - Caffe Nero have just opened up again near me for takeaway coffees.

Following your logic, Dominic Cummings can drive up to Durham again this weekend with a pint of milk and a loaf of bread.

Labour MPs have also broken the rules : it's brought up on the Daily Mail pages. Not on the scale of DC , but it's still a small stick to beat people with.
I guess his also making sure the more right wing press haven't got more up their sleeves regarding others maybe?
I'm routing for Sir Keir Starmer to become a credible opposition as we need it more than ever , but I think his doing it his way.