To feel I can't cope with schools only going back part time in August?

[jbonsor]

Just that. I was coping OK with lockdown, and trying to keep positive about juggling kids and working from home til June, then take a few weeks holiday over the summer just to do things with the kids even if still restricted. This week I have received a letter from my son's nursery to say he has a space for the 2020-2021 school year but that due to covid 19 they can't confirm pattern of attendance, as in, they can't confirm if he will have the 30 hours he was having since August. I also have read a lot that primary school might be 2 days only a week or a very day but only morning or afternoon session.. This has really tipped me over the edge as I am dreading having to keep juggling all this for over a year. This really puts a strain in family life and finances because now we have to basically decide on one income only, and not onky that but I don't feel I am that good at home schooling and feel like my kids are going to fall behind. Sometimes I can't believe how everything fell apart so spectacularly and how is the Scottish government deciding this is the best course of action without any regard for the mountain of problems this will bring to a huge amount of families.

GoldenOmber - I think I agree with you, btw.

The children will have had, by September, the 6 week break, a half term and the two week Easter break in a normal year. So, 9 weeks holiday. So they won't have missed 6 months of school. They'll have missed 3 and a bit. Private schools usually have much longer off with about 25% more time off. This is absolutely within the realms of making catching up OK. I am confident, as a teacher that this can be done. I am not confident that opening schools up sooner is safe, and neither, luckily for Scotland, is their government.

I have been WFH at the same time as childcaring/remote learning and housework (on my own) for three months. I have only just kept my head out of the water with work - it’s impossible to concentrate for more than a few minutes, I am often late for conference calls because they start at the same time as Zoom lessons, and I’m constantly interrupted. I know I should log on after DC is asleep but I am mentally exhausted by then. I know I am not doing a great job with work and I have a horrible feeling that when the redundancies come at the end of the year (which they will) I will be top of the list. My employer prides itself in being family friendly and they made a song and dance about how they understood parents would need to be flexible, which is all very well, but how long are they prepared to pay people who aren’t able to do a full day’s work?

What makes me so cross about this is that it has not occurred to DC father that he should or could be supervising home schooling. Even this half term when he has him, he’s told me that DC will have to entertain himself during the day because he “works full time”. He hasn’t even bothered to take holiday days for HT, as I would have to do.

So yes, I don’t know exactly what schools
will do in Aug/September but I think unless employers are very careful, women who WFH are going to get absolutely shafted in the coming months - in terms of employment prospects and physical/mental health.

@phlebasconsidered I have no issue with them missing school now, as I feel they might be able to catch up, but if going back part time next year then they will not only be unable to catch up but fall behind even more.

jbonsor - that’s simplistic thinking, though. If the spread of the virus is controlled so that testing, tracking and tracing can be kept on top of, then vulnerable people have far greater protection than if they have bugger all idea who is spreading the virus because there are masses of asymptomatic, fit people out there spreading it to them because they are behaving as though the virus doesn’t exist. Also, once the hospitals are clogged up with sick vulnerable people, the young, fit and healthy are hugely at risk again, because they can no longer afford to risk being in accidents, getting ill and becoming vulnerable themselves, etc. I would like priority to be given to schools and further education going back to normal before anything else, but I doubt the desperate unemployed will agree with that.

"If the spread of the virus is controlled so that testing, tracking and tracing can be kept on top of, then vulnerable people have far greater protection.... "
The key her is "if" because its not been controlled, tracking and testing has not been done.

Schools will be part time for quite a while.

Some teachers will be concentrating on teaching schemes for those children who cannot return to school for medical reasons. Others will be planning online lessons for the days when fit children are not in school.

Some teachers will still be shielded and working from home. There will be times when teachers and pupils will have to be at home and isolated.

I honestly cannot see a return to all children in school for months, even years. Social distancing will have to be maintained.

Schools abroad have smaller classes and bigger classrooms. Much easier for them.

Well I guess you have very different priorities to us. In our family having both parents alive is more important than the bloody 11+ !!!
Are you seriously suggesting that losing a parent has a less negative effect long term than loosing a few months schooling? Because that's how your post reads and to me its just weird!

You were talking about people who have already lost a family member. Her father was already dead, he died of TB. There was no option for her to have a father. I'm talking about a lack of education compounding the issue. Passing the 11 plus gave her an out from the poverty. Nothing could bring him back but if she'd have lost months on education on top of that...her outcomes would have been dramatically worse.

We cannot keep everyone safe all of the time. It's not practical or healthy. I also don't want my children growing up afraid. I have ptsd and it's shit.

There are quite a few people here saying that it will be their DH giving his job up. I'm not sure why that is considered fine and dandy either? Men also damage their long-term earning capacity when they take long breaks from the workplace. The problem is that giving up work is being forced on SOMEONE, and whoever that person is, risks ending up up financially dependant on the other. If someone actively chooses that, then fine. But this is not a real choice for anyone!

I honestly cannot see a return to all children in school for months, even years. Social distancing will have to be maintained.
Is this wishful thinking? Are you a teacher or SAHP with no money worries or concern for the impact of working parents parents including those WFH, who are just about treading water doing their own jobs, as well as that of teachers?
Please stop with the ridiculous scaremongering. At some point in the next six weeks the government will order EVERYONE back to work because if they don’t, there won’t be enough taxes to cover the NHS and public sector (yes, that includes teacher) wages.

couples choose to have 2 jobs after kids go back to school because is the logical thing to do. Why is this seen as bad

It usually isn't. Mumsnet is scathing about sahms with school age children under normal circumstances.

Wonder how all the children evacuated during the war coped.

Their education was hugely disrupted. Of course, it mattered less in those days as there were still tons of jobs you could do with minimal education.

The whinging and moaning on Mumsnet at the moment is beyond belief

Yep, whinging and moaning. You can hear it all over this thread. Parents whinging and moaning that they can't get their nails done and go on a foreign holiday this year.

Except they are not, are they? They're angry and worried because their children are going to get next-to-bugger-all education for the next year or so, and they themselves may be about to become unemployed.

if your child is doing higher chemistry then they are able to learn independently.

It is hard for human beingseven adults-to teach themselves skills without instructors' help.

Distance learning at university level (MOOCs etc.) has mostly shown disappointing outcomes. And that's with adult learners over 18 who are getting much more thorough, rigorous and well-designed courses that have been designed with remote learning in mind (as opposed to the offerings which schools have had to quickly come up with at a couple of weeks' notice) and including things like teleconferencing-style video lessons/tutorials (which most state schools are not providing).

If a teenage kid can actually just teach themselves chemistry out of a book and YouTube and genuinely get the same results as they would with a school and a teacher, it's not quite clear why we would bother spending large sums of money training and hiring teachers in the first place?

It usually isn't. Mumsnet is scathing about sahms with school age children under normal circumstances.

It’s just as scathing about mothers who work full or near full time. Apparently, you’re supposed to have a job that is school hours only or at least not much more (it’s such a long day for them otherwise), is totally flexible and at or near home so that you can pick up your kids within 5 minutes if school calls.

Anything else is totally neglectful.

And obviously in the current circumstances if you aren’t delivering a full curriculum for your kids and lots of enriching activities in line with the EYFS for the preschoolers, then why the fuck did you even have kids you clearly don’t like them.

if your child is doing higher chemistry then they are able to learn independently.

Cool cool. So we can ditch sixth forms, colleges and universities permanently then?

I honestly cannot see a return to all children in school for months, even years. Social distancing will have to be maintained.

What are you basing this one? Surely much depends on the amount of virus circulating. If we get it down to Australia levels, we can do what Australia is doing. Given that we’re already reaching a point where the Oxford vaccine researchers are worried there won’t be enough virus circulating in the UK to allow for vaccine trials, we are on a path to lower prevalence which is the other key factor alongside the R. If you can keep prevalence low - particularly through contact tracing and isolation - then the R becomes less fundamental (though still important).

in terms of all the missed opportunities for taking part in school plays and musicals, orchestras, bands, sports, other community activities, school trips, creative and practical subjects, the situation is dire and there is no denying that.

My children do a wide range of activities (6+ hours a week each) to absolutely none. The loss of these activities is not dire, and is far from it.

If anything, it has made me re-evaluate the need to reduce the hours dramatically going forward, something the clubs won’t like to hear.

@Worriedaboutthefuture1 At some point in the next six weeks the government will order EVERYONE back to work because if they don’t, there won’t be enough taxes to cover the NHS and public sector (yes, that includes teacher) wages.

I so wish you were right about this however Scottish schools don't start back for another 11 weeks and will be part time from the start, I can't believe there's not more criticism over this in Scotland.

I thought DD would struggle but she is doing really well. She keeps in touch with friends via tech as we're all doing. She gets through the schoolwork really quickly so she's picked some other stuff to do to keep her busy.

Most of her friends seem to be coping fine too.

The children will have had, by September, the 6 week break, a half term and the two week Easter break in a normal year. So, 9 weeks holiday. So they won't have missed 6 months of school. They'll have missed 3 and a bit.

The actual number of missed days is not so important. What matters is the sheer length of time that is elapsing between the last time they were at school and the next time they will be at school, because of the amount of forgetting that goes on.

If part-time schooling goes on and on, children will also lose huge amounts of curriculum time as a result.

@trumpisaflump give it another few weeks and the penny will drop with the Scottish Joe Public. I’m not in Scotland but I understand that you have elections next year and the SNP will be on very thin ice if they continue to restrict children’s learning in this way and adversely affect people’s ability to sustain employment.

@trumpisaflump me neither. I’m Scottish and there’s nobody on my Facebook questioning this. Nobody questioning the removal of 30 free hours for nursery.

My DSis is a teacher in an ASN school and says social distancing will be impossible. The kids are all over her all the time (and they are lovely kids). On the other hand, sometimes she and colleagues have to practice safe restraint. The SNP don’t have a fucking clue.

Sittingontheveranda - I wasn’t talking about privately run clubs, I was talking about the activities put on by school music and drama departments. You may not miss it, my children certainly do - the only thing my younger ds got truly animated about at school was taking part in the annual school production.

Yes, women, because it will likely be women having to give up their jobs because of this.

Surely it’s the one earning the lesser wage who’d have to give up their job. Could just as easy be the man.

about as much danger as they are from seasonal flu, even though we vaccinate for that.

We vaccinate kids for flu primarily to protect the elderly.

We are keeping schools shut to protect the elderly. The only reason we should open schools is if we are sure kids aren't super spreaders like they are with flu.